Roger Clemens Not Guilty on All Counts

[oldjudge]

I don't know if he cheated or not; I wasn't there. Therefore, my opinion would only be a guess. I haven't listened to the facts, like the jury. If after hearing the facts they thought that there was not compelling evidence that he did steroids then I must guess that he did not.
Peter--I was just making the point that if O'Keefe could make an open and shut case, based on facts and not assumptions, that Clemens juiced then the prosecution could have probably made a strong argument, a winning argument, that he was guilty. Obviously, that was not the case.

Mattingly had half a HOF career. Unfortunately, a bad back killed the second half.

[packs]

The jury didn't decide he didn't use steroids though. They decided it wasn't proven he lied about using steroids. There's a big difference. It's hard to prove someone lied about something you can't prove without a doubt they did.

The point of the Mitchell Report was both to inform baseball what was going on and to inform the fans of what their favorite players have been up to. If you refuse to acknowledge any of the report's information because it can't be proven, then I think you are missing the point. At the same token you can't prove anyone didn't use steroids.

[yanks12025]

Originally Posted by packs

The jury didn't decide he didn't use steroids though. They decided it wasn't proven he lied about using steroids. There's a big difference. It's hard to prove someone lied about something you can't prove without a doubt they did.

The point of the Mitchell Report was both to inform baseball what was going on and to inform the fans of what their favorite players have been up to. If you refuse to acknowledge any of the report's information because it can't be proven, then I think you are missing the point. At the same token you can't prove anyone didn't use steroids.

But the Mitchell Report was based on Brian Mcnamee's testimony atleast for Clemens being on it. But if a jury finds Clemens not guilty, then they must think Mcnamee's testimony is in doubt. So if they can't back his testimony in court, then what proof is there that Clemens actually used?

Also I think the Mitchell report was a huge joke and 90% biased against NY teams.

[CMIZ5290]

How can anyone with a head the size of a medicine ball have his health in front of him?

[packs]

The jury has to consider facts. The Mitchell Report was based on conversations between investigators, personnel and players. The burden of proof in a courtroom is different. If you can't prove beyond a reasonable doubt that everything McNamee said is true, that doesn't mean it isn't true.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

I don't know if he cheated or not; I wasn't there. Therefore, my opinion would only be a guess. I haven't listened to the facts, like the jury. If after hearing the facts they thought that there was not compelling evidence that he did steroids then I must guess that he did not.
Peter--I was just making the point that if O'Keefe could make an open and shut case, based on facts and not assumptions, that Clemens juiced then the prosecution could have probably made a strong argument, a winning argument, that he was guilty. Obviously, that was not the case.

Mattingly had half a HOF career. Unfortunately, a bad back killed the second half.

And a jury acquited OJ. Sometimes, it's just hard to prove things with admissible evidence beyond a reasonable doubt. But I wouldn't infer innocence from that. Change the burden of proof and you might have a different verdict. The jury also could be sending a message that this sort of prosecution is a waste of time and money.

[laughlinfan]

Yep. Never used 'em. And thought that Piazza's broken bat was a baseball, so he grabbed it and threw it at him. Thinking back on this, a) how the heck was he not thrown out of the game and suspended and b) how come no one suspected Roid Rage at that time?

In retrospect, the people I feel sorry for are the guys who played clean and would have been considered the best of their decade, if the top ten (or twenty) players hadn't been cheating. Sad part is, we'll never know who they were for certain.