What would be the most valuable original baseball photo (if it existed)?

[Forever Young]

Originally Posted by drc

That's even another good point. When you see an auction price, you can't even be sure if the price was legitimate. Beyond shilling, you sometimes don't even know if the transaction went through. How can you use an price as an iron clad value, when you don't even know that price was ever paid?

Quite a few buyers have later deduced they were probably shilled when they try and resell the item and can't even get half.


For various reasons, I think going by a single sales prices is a dubious way to determine value.

COMPLETELY AGREE WITH THIS STATEMENT.

JAKE, Good point on the X statement. Two might tango on a rare item. Then another will surface and one bidder is out of the equation.

PS: I knew you weren't drunk David...hence my attempt at humor with yoda and boom boom stick... aparently some people believe Yoda truly does exist

[Splinte1941]

Originally Posted by Forever Young

COMPLETELY AGREE WITH THIS STATEMENT.

JAKE, Good point on the X statement. Two might tango on a rare item. Then another will surface and one bidder is out of the equation.

PS: I knew you weren't drunk David...hence my attempt at humor with yoda and boom boom stick... aparently some people believe Yoda truly does exist

I really hesitate to go off my shill bid rant, but suffice to say, the FBI needs to investigate the technology involved in proxy bids and how easily auction sites have access to that information. That's where the scam is.

[Forever Young]

Originally Posted by Splinte1941

I really hesitate to go off my shill bid rant, but suffice to say, the FBI needs to investigate the technology involved in proxy bids and how easily auction sites have access to that information. That's where the scam is.

I agree man... it is a big problem and I think in teh long run it would help realized prices as peeps would feel comfortable.

I did max bids in many auctions and never felt I was shilled.
BUT THEN..I did max bids in one particular MAJOR auction house about 3 years ago on 4 items(first time I did it with them). All the items were higher end. Low and behold.. I was maxed up to all of them..and not outbid on one at the end. I will NEVER bid in that auction house again as the probability was so small that this could happen on all 4 items at those high price ranges/all those bids. There was NO DOUBT in my mind I was screwed...NO DOUBT.
I have not felt that way in any other auction..probably because I have not done it to that extent. Now I just stay up all night and bid emotionally and overpay anyway. HAHA
I guess moral of the story is, trust who you buy from and expect to pay your max bid...now I do.

[Splinte1941]

Originally Posted by Forever Young

I agree man... it is a big problem and I think in teh long run it would help realized prices as peeps would feel comfortable.

I did max bids in many auctions and never felt I was shilled.
BUT THEN..I did max bids in one particular MAJOR auction house about 3 years ago on 4 items(first time I did it with them). All the items were higher end. Low and behold.. I was maxed up to all of them..and not outbid on one at the end. I will NEVER bid in that auction house again as the probability was so small that this could happen on all 4 items at those high price ranges/all those bids. There was NO DOUBT in my mind I was screwed...NO DOUBT.
I have not felt that way in any other auction..probably because I have not done it to that extent. Now I just stay up all night and bid emotionally and overpay anyway. HAHA
I guess moral of the story is, trust who you buy from and expect to pay your max bid...now I do.

Wow Ben, for the life of me, I can't imagine which auction house that might be. You were bid up to your max and never outbid on 4 items???? Talk about brazen!

Some people (read, those who run these scams) never learn their lesson...

[glchen]

Is shilling legal, btw? I saw this quote from a major auction house in a thread once. (I have replaced the name of the auction house w/ the generic auction house.) I guess owners bidding on their own lots in this case isn't strictly shill bidding?

(1) {Auction House} and {auction house} employees do not shill bid.

(2) {Auction House} does not bid on their own items other than by placing reserves. I will note that owners placing bids on their own items at auction is quite legal; we will identify this when we determine that it is happening on an auction floor.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by glchen

Is shilling legal, btw? I saw this quote from a major auction house in a thread once. (I have replaced the name of the auction house w/ the generic auction house.) I guess owners bidding on their own lots in this case isn't strictly shill bidding?

(1) {Auction House} and {auction house} employees do not shill bid.

(2) {Auction House} does not bid on their own items other than by placing reserves. I will note that owners placing bids on their own items at auction is quite legal; we will identify this when we determine that it is happening on an auction floor.

My understanding is that shill bidding issues are state law. That being said I think a lot of what an auction house can and can't do is by the wording in their own rules, almost as much as law. They can't legally say they don't do something when they do. On the converse many times they can do things, by putting them in their rules, that we would call unethical or illegal. A few auction houses have in their own rules that they will bid on items under any number of circumstances. In my small auction company we have written rules against it. If you want to know what an auction can and can't do many times reading their rules will tell you. That all goes by the wayside if they are doing illegal stuff. I am confident that the authorities are still keeping an eagle eye on parts of the hobby especially the auction houses.

[Jlighter]

This brings to mind the question, Why aren't there more real time Internet auctions. It would solve some of these problems plus I like the feel of more classic styled auctions.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Splinte1941

I really hesitate to go off my shill bid rant, but suffice to say, the FBI needs to investigate the technology involved in proxy bids and how easily auction sites have access to that information. That's where the scam is.

You are approximately 5 yrs behind. They are probably already looking for ways that auction companies counter the proxy technology.