Analysis of current AH's rules regarding shill/internal/sketchy bidding practices

[ullmandds]

I don't want to hijack the mile high thread...but I've been concerned for quite a while about hammer prices for many cards in the hobby in the past 10 or so years.

Shill bidding on ebay.

final sales but item never really sells scenario.

hidden reserves.

AH's written rules which allow them to shill/bid items up to a reserve/desired outcome.

All of these things concern me and make me think that a lot of valuations in the hobby are artificially inflated.

I'd like this thread to discuss the various AH's and their practices regarding these issues.

I just went to HERITAGE'S site to see what their stance is on this...just because I had to start somewhere!!!!

It is not outlined in the terms of bidding but is buried in a pdf file under terms and conditions:

I found this:

[ullmandds]

For those too lazy to read the small print...

IT BASICALLY SAYS THE AH...IT'S EMPLOYEES...OR ITS AFFILIATES MAY NOT ONLY CONSIGN ITEMS AND THEN BID ON THEM...BUT THEY MAY BID ON ANY ITEMS.

[bnorth]

Pete this is a very shady hobby. Has to be when even the "honest" AH's straight up tell you they can and will shill bid the items in their auctions to the price they want. Best part is nobody cares, AH owners thank you.

[BabyRuth]

That is frightening, that's why I set my max price and never change it.

[x2drich2000]

I do believe this is the first time I've seen Mile High have the right to bid in their own auction, but I know HA has had this in their T&C's for years. It seems like every 6 months or so HA name reappears regarding it. On the positive side, at least Mile High marked the lot as a pass, rather than just keeping the final bid "amount" displayed. I'm not sure how anyone could call either either HA or Mile High dishonest for this if it is in their T&C. To me it is quite simple, if you don't like the terms of their sale, don't bid.

On the other end of the spectrum, I know REA and LOTG specifically state employees can't bid and REA even goes so far as to tell you what lots are consigned by employees. I believe both also specifically state when a lot has a reserve.

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by x2drich2000

I do believe this is the first time I've seen Mile High have the right to bid in their own auction, but I know HA has had this in their T&C's for years. It seems like every 6 months or so HA name reappears regarding it. On the positive side, at least Mile High marked the lot as a pass, rather than just keeping the final bid "amount" displayed. I'm not sure how anyone could call either either HA or Mile High dishonest for this if it is in their T&C. To me it is quite simple, if you don't like the terms of their sale, don't bid.

On the other end of the spectrum, I know REA and LOTG specifically state employees can't bid and REA even goes so far as to tell you what lots are consigned by employees. I believe both also specifically state when a lot has a reserve.

I do not fault any of the auction houses that have such practices as long as they are stated upfront... I just have a problem with the artificial valuations!

[ullmandds]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Pete this is a very shady hobby. Has to be when even the "honest" AH's straight up tell you they can and will shill bid the items in their auctions to the price they want. Best part is nobody cares, AH owners thank you.

I know, Ben. Im just trying to raise awareness.