Drum back on Ebay!

[Chicago206]

Very exciting for me as I havent seen one listed in the over 2 months I have been searching. What are your thoughts on the card itself, the fact its graded by a "subpar" company, and what you think the hammer price will be?


P.S.- I know that if the card was mine, it would WITHOUT A DOUBT be holdered in either a PSA or SGC slab!



Edited to add a link:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...STRK:MEBIDX:IT

[Matt]

Just an FYI - it's generally not a good idea to post an ongoing auction about a card you hope to win as it brings lots of attention (and other potential bidders) to it. That should be weighed against how critical the information you are asking is to you in your bidding.

[canjond]

Matt - I thought that rule only applied when something might not be properly listed. In this case, the card is in the correct category, is properly described and titled (The title clearly states it has a RARE DRUM back), and is being seen by everyone (just look at the number of bids already).

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by Matt

Just an FYI - it's generally not a good idea to post an ongoing auction about a card you hope to win as it brings lots of attention (and other potential bidders) to it. That should be weighed against how critical the information you are asking is to you in your bidding.

Ditto. People hate to see ebay auctions "outed" on Net54baseball.

I wonder why it is in a GAI holder. You could probably double/more your money in PSA or SGC.

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by canjond

I thought that rule only applied when something might not be properly listed.

That's certainly a consideration, but there is also a "draw attention to" angle that frustrates bidders. The less talk the better -- unless you're the seller.

[FrankWakefield]

.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by canjond

Matt - I thought that rule only applied when something might not be properly listed. In this case, the card is in the correct category, is properly described and titled (The title clearly states it has a RARE DRUM back), and is being seen by everyone (just look at the number of bids already).

There is no rule at all - I was just giving him some practical advice...

[ChiefBenderForever]

It's to bad he didn't have the magnifying glass on the scan so you can see what is up with the bend in the front. The big question is would this be Authentic in sgc or psa.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Matt

There is no rule at all - I was just giving him some practical advice...

I concur..... and there will never be a rule. It does irritate people bidding on it as it calls attention to it. Of course no matter what the situation or debate there will be opposing views. Personally, and this is not a rule, I would prefer not outing ebay ongoing auctions. Only for the reasons stated.

[T206DK]

I don't mind "outing" auctions here at all. My view is that there are dozens of collectors and rpobably dealers on this forum that do the same searches I do and try to find that one card that may be listed in a bizarre category. I rarely find anything decent in my searches anymore though. I once found a T200 card that was listed in a section for baby clothes.

[Anthony S.]

Every other graded card that seller has listed (including his completed auctions) is in either an SGC or a PSA holder. Buy the card because you want a T206 DRUM back, not because you hope it will cross over to anything higher than an "A."

[Matt]

Looking at the card, I don't see anything that leads me to believe it won't grade numerically. Old GAI cases aren't like CSA where it's almost assured that the card is trimmed - at the time, GAI certainly got it right more often then not (though, 'not' happened quite a bit).

Why the seller didn't cross it could be simply because he doesn't like the principal of shelling out more cash for an already graded card. Not a good business decision, but certainly understandable.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by T206DK

I don't mind "outing" auctions here at all. My view is that there are dozens of collectors and rpobably dealers on this forum that do the same searches I do and try to find that one card that may be listed in a bizarre category. I rarely find anything decent in my searches anymore though. I once found a T200 card that was listed in a section for baby clothes.

Dave
And if you take hours to search for something and find a gem of a card in a category that is for stuffed zoo animals, and it gets posted on the main board with 3 hours left....You might have a different opinion...and then again, as I said before, maybe not. Regardless, everyone can do what makes them happy. best regards

[ullmandds]

yes...that bottom definitely looks tampered with...A is the correct grade, IMO.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

yes...that bottom definitely looks tampered with...A is the correct grade, IMO.

Peter - I think what you're seeing is the black gasket of the case - it makes it seems that the bottom of the card is wavy.

[ChiefBenderForever]

Originally Posted by Anthony S.

Every other graded card that seller has listed (including his completed auctions) is in either an SGC or a PSA holder. Buy the card because you want a T206 DRUM back, not because you hope it will cross over to anything higher than an "A."

I agree but at the sametime, on a card like this no reason to overpay a couple grand if it is indeed not a 1 or 2 right ?

[E93]

I don't think the card is tampered with. I think it is the black insert and angle of the scan that makes the bottom edge look weird. Look at the same edge with the scan of the back of the card and it is more clear, imho.

It certainly was not trimmed to improve corners. Maybe it was hacked to fit into a plastic sheet back in the day, but this one does not look that way to me. I have seen a lot of scans with holders from all three grading companies that make side look suspicious when they clearly are not viewed in person.
JimB

[Chicago206]

I didnt mean to stir up a debate on "outing" an auction. That was NOT my intent. As a very new collector to this series, I just wanted some honest opinions of the card, AND why you think its in a GAI slab rather than a top tier slab. I am high bidder on the card, and plan to be very aggressive on it....so if anything, im just "hurting" myself by drawing attention to it. However, I'd rather have some spirited competition if that means getting expert opinions on it before I go bananas on the bidding. I'd much rather overpay $500-$700 on a legit card because of a few extra bidders than to save that money, and pay for a substandard card just because I didnt want to "out" it in a web forum. Make any sense?

[Matt]

It makes a lot of sense - it's exactly what I wrote in the second sentence of my initial response. In your scenario, you felt the information to be gained outweighed the potential additional cost.

[tedzan]

What's the difference of Chicago206 "outing" this card....vs....Leon "outing" an ebay lot when he runs his
occasional CONTEST ?

I'll save you your rationalizations......there is NO DIFFERENCE !


Hey Leon, you are overdue to run a Contest....how's about running a Contest on this DRUM card ?


Some Net54er will win a nice St Patrick's Day gift

T-Rex TED

[teetwoohsix]

Good luck on the card Chicago206!!Just wanted to say,I've only sent in three T206's graded by GAI for crossover to SGC,one came back same grade,the other 2 came back a grade higher,to my suprise.I may be in the minority,I don't know...........

[T206DK]

While I might be a bit mad that others find that item, I still look at it like there was a chance that someone would find it anyway whether it was talked about here or not. I realize outing something here would lower my chances of winning the items due to the amount of collectors with similar tastes on here and people just trying to find a good deal. I usually only "out" suspected sheisters I see on Ebay....I think that's good for all of us. I like reading about other auctions people find too. I personally don't buy on Ebay much anymore, but I look a lot just to see what's out there.

[Rob D.]

What's interesting about the auction-outing issue is that the folks who always seem to be first in line to applaud and defend the practice never seem to out any auction themselves. It's probably just a simple matter of them never coming across a ballcard that's listed in the wrong category or an uneducated seller who has poorly described an item.

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by tedzan

What's the difference of Chicago206 "outing" this card....vs....Leon "outing" an ebay lot when he runs his
occasional CONTEST ?

I'll save you your rationalizations......there is NO DIFFERENCE !

I agree. Regardless of how the discussion gets started, it is a bummer finding something you really like on ebay only to find a massive discussion about the card taking place on Net54. This almost never has happened to me, but I can appreciate the feeling and try to respect that before initiating a post on here about in-progress auctions of any kind.

[Chicago206]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

I agree. Regardless of how the discussion gets started, it is a bummer finding something you really like on ebay only to find a massive discussion about the card taking place on Net54. This almost never has happened to me, but I can appreciate the feeling and try to respect that before initiating a post on here about in-progress auctions of any kind.

Then how does a newer collector get opinions on a high dollar card before pulling the trigger? I'd hate to overpay on that card, THEN ask for opinions on it only to find out I was had. If it was in a PSA/SGC slab, I wouldnt even have started this thread. But I wanted to know member's opinions about the card since its in a lesser slab before I make a potentially expensive mistake!

[ullmandds]

oops...looks like you guys are correct...it's the insert i saw. wish i never sold my drum to buy a leather recliner my cat ultimately chewed up!!!

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by Chicago206

Then how does a newer collector get opinions on a high dollar card before pulling the trigger? I'd hate to overpay on that card, THEN ask for opinions on it only to find out I was had. If it was in a PSA/SGC slab, I wouldnt even have started this thread. But I wanted to know member's opinions about the card since its in a lesser slab before I make a potentially expensive mistake!

First, I don't think what you did was a big deal. I can just understand the frustration of potential bidders on this auction (of which I am not one). I think Sweet Caporal backs are cooler than Drum backs! They're certainly more popular -- everyone has one!

Second, there is a potential problem in that you are asking opinions on a card from your potential competitors for that card. The best way to get educated about this card without creating unnecessary publicity would be to ask questions of other real cards, hypothetical cards or even completed auctions for similar stuff.

In the end it is always a trade-off -- you may ultimately win this card with better knowledge, but you may wind up paying more for luring more potential bidders into the auction. In short, there is always a cost for asking about current auctions that you may be interested in.

[Bridwell]

Not only are there tons of ebay auctions, but there are at least 10 other vintage card auctions every month through the auction houses. It takes a lot of hunting to find certain cards, so I secretly hope that I don't have 20 other collectors bidding against me on the stuff I'm hoping to get.

It usually happens anyway, though, and I'm outbid.

Ron R

[cfc1909]

This has collectors on both sides-the consignors/sellers love it. I think it is very close to the thread started on T213-1 right at the time B&L Auctions was ready to start. Your partner even stated in the thread that you have 2 in your upcoming auction.

Its 50-50 for bidders and great for consignors. If a bidder is interested in the auction it is not so good and if not it doesn't matter.

[buymycards]

If you want to find out about Drums, the search function shows dozens of threads. And the question about 2nd tier grading companies has been posed many many times, so again, a search would answer this question.

Rick

[smtjoy]

Chicago206 what you did was fair game and you didnt need to explain why you did it.

You wanted feedback on an expensive card and you got some good info that should help you in your decision. IMO thats what this board is about. Good Luck!

[JP]

I can't really see this card ending anywhere other than the tight range that has already been established for "good" graded drum back commons....as there were a half dozen in an auction 6 months ago.

# #278, T206 Dick Hoblitzell with Drum back PSA-2 $2,520
# #279, T206 Doc Marshall with Drum back PSA-2 $3,000
# #281, T206 Ed Willetts with Drum back PSA-2 $2,400
# #282, T206 Heinie Wagner with Drum back PSA-2 $2,880
# #283, T206 Hooks Wiltse with Drum back PSA-2 $2,520
# #284, T206 Jake Atz with Drum back PSA-2 $2,520
# #285, T206 Tim Jordan with Drum back PSA-2 $2,760

[Chicago206]

Originally Posted by JP

I can't really see this card ending anywhere other than the tight range that has already been established for "good" graded drum back commons....as there were a half dozen in an auction 6 months ago.

# #278, T206 Dick Hoblitzell with Drum back PSA-2 $2,520
# #279, T206 Doc Marshall with Drum back PSA-2 $3,000
# #281, T206 Ed Willetts with Drum back PSA-2 $2,400
# #282, T206 Heinie Wagner with Drum back PSA-2 $2,880
# #283, T206 Hooks Wiltse with Drum back PSA-2 $2,520
# #284, T206 Jake Atz with Drum back PSA-2 $2,520
# #285, T206 Tim Jordan with Drum back PSA-2 $2,760

Thanks for the auction results! Now a question about those. Notice they were all PSA graded. Is there, or should there be any type of "discount" pricing structure for cards graded by "lower level" grading services?

[JP]

Absolutely. If it isn't in an SGC or PSA holder already, it runs the risk of coming back as an AUTH when trying to crossover. That will take 5-10% off at least, I'd think.

[Chicago206]

Originally Posted by JP

Absolutely. If it isn't in an SGC or PSA holder already, it runs the risk of coming back as an AUTH when trying to crossover. That will take 5-10% off at least, I'd think.

This is the exact type of info I was seeking in regards to me starting this thread! Thank you!

[ChiefBenderForever]

Now that you ran it up to 1650 already it should hold steady until the last day or hours I would think. I would get a number you are comfortable with and if you don't get it don't worry, more will come along. It's tax time right now so a lot of people have extra money and nothing else to do. This summer when people are looking for some vacation money more will definately come along. Oh yeah, good luck !!

[Chicago206]

Missed it by a mere $126. Oh well....maybe i'll get lucky in the upcoming REA auction.