T206 Reference / Reflections.....Tuesday Nite Trivia

[Pat R]

Ted before you accuse me of attacking you here you know I sent you a private email over a year ago about using information I posted about the Brown Lenox as your own.

I posted this thread on 5-9-15 with no responses

Originally Posted by Pat R

They're so scarce it could just be a coincidence but all 22 confirmed Brown
Lenox subjects are among the 75 AB 460 subjects.

I then posted on 10-20-2015 about them in an American Beauty thread you started

Originally Posted by Pat R

I have mentioned this once before but it didn't receive any opinions either
way so I thought I would try it here.

All of the confirmed Brown Lenox subjects are also AB 460 subjects so I was
thinking it might be possible that some(or all) of the sheets used for the
AB 460's were also used for the Brown Lenox.

While the Brown Lenox is an extremely rare back (22 different subjects confirmed so far) it seems odd that none of the possible 34 non AB 460
subjects has been confirmed with a Brown Lenox. So could it be that not all Black Lenox subjects are possible with Brown Lenox and only AB 460 subjects are?

Originally Posted by tedzan

Very interesting observation, Pat.

We do know that some of the sheets used to print the AB 460 backs were also used to print the UZIT backs.

But it remains to be seen if this is also true for the AB 460 cards and the brown LENOX cards, since (to date)
there are only 22 examples of the brown LENOX cards.

Furthermore, it is quite puzzling that 4 subjects (Lajoie, Overall, Pfeister, Wagner) of these 22 brown LENOX
cards have yet to be confirmed with black LENOX backs ? ? ? ?


Incidentally, there are 35 subjects that are AB 460 No-Prints (not 34).



TED Z
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Originally Posted by Pat R

I agree with you Ted, it's not much to gauge off with only 22 confirmed subjects but with 32% of the subjects being AB 460 no prints you would think at least a couple of the Confirmed Brown Lenox would be from this group if they are a possible front back combo.

Originally Posted by tedzan

In any event, I think this connection is worth tracking....who knows where it will lead us.

Only The Monster knows !


TED Z
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You then started this thread a few months later on 1-16 2016 where you did give me credit for the 28 AB350/460 subjects

Originally Posted by tedzan

American Lithographic (ALC) printed the AMERICAN BEAUTY 460, PIEDMONT 460 (Factory 42), LENOX, and UZIT cards circa...Feb 1911. Concurrently, ALC started producing
their Gold-bordered cards, beginning with their T80 (Military Series) which were printed with T206-type backs (LENOX, OLD MILL, TOLSTOI, UZIT) and CAIRO MONOPOL.
The latter T-brand back was printed using BROWN ink.

I contend that the T206 brown LENOX cards are simply the result an ALC printer who had just completed a press run of T80 cards with CAIRO MONOPOL backs, then failed to
switch to Black ink in order to proceed with the following press run of T206 black LENOX cards.

In time, if my theory proves to be true, we could discover as many as 75 subjects with brown LENOX backs. My 75 number tracks with the PIEDMONT 460 Factory 42 number.
Which comprises of 63 subjects from the 350/460 series plus 12 subjects from the 460-only series.

Also, it has been suggested by Pat R in another thread, that brown LENOX cards track with the 350/460 series subjects in the AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 press run (28 subjects).

In any event, we all know how extremely rare these brown LENOX cards are. And, this fact is consistent with the T80 CAIRO MONOPOL cards, which are very difficult to find.
I don't think that this is just a mere coincidence.


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Currently, there are only 23 confirmed T206 subjects with brown LENOX backs......

350/460 series

Bradley (bat)
Burch (fielding)
Cobb (bat off shoulder)
Conroy (bat)
Jordan (bat)
Lajoie (bat)
Lake (no ball)
Leach (cap)
Leifield (bat)
Manning (pitching)
McQuillan (bat)
Overall (yellow sky)
Pfeister (throwing)
F. Smith (Chicago & Boston)
Wagner (bat on right shoulder)
Willetts
Willis (bat)


460-only series

Chase (trophy)
Latham
Marquard (pitching)
Merkle (throwing)
Schlei (portrait)
Wiltse (portrait-cap)


Show us your brown LENOX cards....and, any responses to this thread will be greatly appreciated.


TED Z
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Then you abandoned that thread and started this one about those 28 subjects and claimed the theory as yours

https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=240525

Incidentally I told Art Martineau about the Jennings 3 weeks ago but I was waiting for the auction to end before posting about it.