Anyone ever see a Topps Xmas cello rack pack with different years cards?

[whiteymet]

Hi Gang:

Ever see a Topps Christmas Cello Rack Pack with cards from different years???

See: https://www.ebay.com/itm/1958-TOPPS-...0AAOSw7tRbFxxB

Two 58's on each side of a 59 Ashburn Mays card

Are ALL of these packs fake?

Fred

[darkhorse9]

"Fake" is a relative term here.

It's generally agreed these are an after-market product created by someone putting Topps cards into these racks and selling them. How contemporary the repacking was done is the big issue.

Although I haven't seen mixed years in any of these, others may have and it's not out of the realm of possibility.

The bottom line is...they are what they are...a grab bag of cards.

Trust but verify.

[ALR-bishop]

I do not think there is any doubt that these things are still being churned out today. When Murphy first surfaced them he argued that they were oringinally packaged second hand by a third party for sale at retail stores at Christmas. The 3d party and retail stores were never identified as far as I know. Nor is it clear when this packaging took place originally. Some say the 60s, some the 70s, some the 80s and some the 90s. Some say they can tell the "originals" by the staples or packaging. But no one argues they are a Topps product and everyone concedes they are used/handled/returned/excess cards.

Here is something I got from Murphy and Murphy's business partner when I asked about them early on

[SMPEP]

So I'm pretty sure I sold this seller the 1961 Topps Mathews Christmas Rack Pack that he also has for sale, and regardless based on the stickers on the rack packs, I can tell that the ones he has for sale originally came from:

http://christmasrackpacks.com/

This seller's "story" is some relative bought two huge cases of these way back when, and gives them to him to sell over time. He does a lot of private sales and doesn't let his buyers talk to each other (he blocks their ability to email other buyers - which I find suspicious). So I've never been able to confirm or deny whether there are good cards or not in these packs (although one of our board members opened several and got nothing worthwhile). I will also say ... over the 14 years of selling these that he advertises on his website ... he has sold thousands of these.

Oh, and I should mention, I bought 1 rack pack from him (for the novelty of opening cards - even if they weren't "real") and he "threw in" a freebie. I find that suspicious. If you weren't making them yourself, you'd have a limited supply of "good rack packs", and I would think you wouldn't want to give those away for free. Which is why I sold the 1961 Mathews pack. I actually still have the other one (since it was a freebie) - so would be interested to hear if others had positive stories buying racks from him.

Cheers,
Patrick

[JustinD]

I think they are all fake as a three dollar bill.

Some may be as old as the mid 80s as I don't remember any surfacing prior, but I agree with Al that they are still being made with an absolute ton hitting eBay in the last 5-7 years.

[1963Topps Set]

and most filled with over priced commons.

[ALR-bishop]

Seller who knows the real deal when he sees it....or has it

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Topps-Chris...oAAOSwG0hZ34Mo

[Paul S]

Staples sold separately.

[JustinD]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

Seller who knows the real deal when he sees it....or has it

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Topps-Chris...oAAOSwG0hZ34Mo

The Rack Pack Genius.

"Christmas Rack Packs have been devalued by all the unscrupulous sellers that do NOT have proper badging like striped ends that taper to the top left on the front, proper sized wreath with correct number of snowflakes, striped staples, ect, ect..."

I like how he also wrote a buyer's guide on avoiding other fake rack packs that don't look like his fake rack packs linked at the bottom.

Plus they are all "XRPG" graded, so my doubts are swayed.

[yakker1128]

Actually, I DO remember specifically seeing rack packs for sale at Woolworth's in the early 1960's with both 1961 and 1960 Topps baseball cards included in the racks. I'm sure of it. Not positive that it was a TOPPS packager, but I am sure of what I saw.

[1963Topps Set]

I noticed in the original posting, you do not see the back of the pack to see what cards are there. Buyer beware as usual.

[ALR-bishop]

Yakkers--- what state/city ? As far as I know none of Murphy's packs were mixed

[T.S. OConnell]

This tiresome scam does not involve uncirculated cards in any of its various incarnations. Almost certainly created in the late 1990s, all of them are simply secondary-market cards and if you want to purchase them on that basis, fire away. The various markers that reveal this are there for anyone to see; cards are generally Ex or maybe Ex-Mt. One of the clever aspects to this con job involves people contending there are fake versions, etc., counting staples or other red herrings. They are all bogus.

[hockeyhockey]

has anyone ever pulled a good card in the middle of these christmas rack packs? the ones with stars on top are obviously buyer beware, but always curious if anyone ever found something legit inside.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by hockeyhockey

has anyone ever pulled a good card in the middle of these christmas rack packs? the ones with stars on top are obviously buyer beware, but always curious if anyone ever found something legit inside.

All are buyer beware, these are all frauds created by con men. You are not going to get anything good from one of these.

[cardsagain74]

Speaking of secondary market packaged fun w/ diluted value, I wonder if anyone ever pulled the '52 T Mantle (or even the Mathews) that are supposed to be hidden somewhere in those recent Universal Treasures/Vintage Card Treasures packs?

Just about italicized "supposed to be"....

[chalupacollects]

For what it is worth I have a 55 Christmas rack pack I purchased from Mark Murphy way back that has Willie Mays on the back center...

[stlcardsfan]

There was an EBay seller of rack packs years ago that had the back of a Mathews showing on a 52 pack. It was in his about me section and was not for sale, although he had several other 52 packs for sale. I was watching his auctions for a while and they were going for very high dollars.

[MikeGarcia]

Originally Posted by chalupacollects

For what it is worth I have a 55 Christmas rack pack I purchased from Mark Murphy way back that has Willie Mays on the back center...

.. " The Kid !!".....there's a name from ancient history --- I remember reading about the warehouse fire and the loss of several billion dollars worth of unopened 1986 Topps , Fleer , and Score packs , boxes , and cases......the X-Mas rack packs praise da lawd somehow escaped the fire........ I bought my X-Mas rack pack from " Mop Boy Melvin"......anybody remember him ??

..

[ALR-bishop]

I posted the Murphy team input earlier in the thread. No one I ever heard of, including Murphy, claimed these were Topps packaged products or that they were pristine cards. And you could always see most of the cards and their condition top and bottom yourself if the scans were any good. And there is no doubt they are still being produced to this day.

I have said this before, the intrigue to me was whether these were actually ever packaged by a third party and sold at retail, and if so where and when. Murphy and his partner could not or would answer that question. Some have speculated ( likely sellers) that the cards were first packaged and sold at retail in the 60s. Others have said 70s or 80s or 90s. It would only matter if some were originally packaged in the 60s or 70s, because then some of the middle cards could be stars given their lesser value in those times.

But I have never heard a credible story of someone saying they bought these packs in the 60s or 70s at a specific retail store. And despite internet advice on how you can tell older packaged packs ( staples and positioning of the decorations and such), I have never felt I could readily ascertain the difference to those being marketed now from those Murphy sold. Maybe other can

Murphy's partner, see above note, did say their original find/purchase of these involved only packs from 53 to 63.

They continue to interest me because it has never been shown for sure when these things originated for the first time and if they were ever really sold at retail. A hobby mystery of sorts that I find fascinating.