Partially ripping a card opening the mail

[Mdmtx]

I just hurt my toe going to the mail box. If that shipment wouldn't have been there I wouldn't have hurt myself. I'm gonna sue PayPal, eBay and the post office and give a negative to the seller.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Mdmtx

I just hurt my toe going to the mail box. If that shipment wouldn't have been there I wouldn't have hurt myself. I'm gonna sue PayPal, eBay and the post office and give a negative to the seller.

Now you are getting it Mark. Nothing is your fault even if you done it, good luck on the lawsuits.

[Mdmtx]

Originally Posted by bnorth

Now you are getting it Mark. Nothing is your fault even if you done it, good luck on the lawsuits.

It's only fair. The world owes me. Do you know how fabulous I am? Now I can't dance with this hurt toe. Lawsuit is growing.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by Mdmtx

It's only fair. The world owes me. Do you know how fabulous I am? Now I can't dance with this hurt toe. Lawsuit is growing.

If your shoe had a steel toe, hurting yourself wouldn't have been possible. At MINIMUM your shoe should've had a warning label on it, telling you that there was a toe-stubbing risk.

Any accident or mistake anybody ever makes could've been prevented if somebody else would've saved them from their own carelessness. Hence, nobody need ever be responsible for their own mistakes. Isn't that wonderful?!

The card should've been better protected, but the story we have to work with is that the card did arrive safely and undamaged. So, the poor packaging is no longer relevant - it caused no damage as the card was safely delivered. At this point, we have the OP holding a bubble mailer envelope with an $800 card inside. I would think it would be quite apparent, feeling the envelope, that there was nothing rigid inside.

One poster here suggested gently pushing in the sides of the envelope to let the contents drop to the bottom. I mentioned that I tap such envelopes gently on my countertop to accomplish the same thing. Yet another poster here explained that you then, once the contents are safely at the bottom of the package/envelope, carefully cut the very top of it (like maybe 1/16th of an inch) with a scissors. You don't want to use a letter opener and rip it because something, like a packing slip, could be folded and still near the top, and that could get torn by using the letter opener method.

All of this is simple and obvious, for some of us. Maybe somebody should make a how-to video for opening envelopes carefully, for the rest to carefully study.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Mark17

Maybe somebody should make a how-to video for opening envelopes carefully, for the rest to carefully study.

How about a how-to video for properly preparing packages?

If you're going to continue to make ridiculously stupid comments, put your full name in your posts. It's the rules.

[markf31]

Honestly, its apparent there are those who believe the seller is 100% responsible. There are others who believe the buyer is 100% responsible. And there are those who believe both parties hold partial responsibility.

I don't see an argument that can be made or an example that can be thought up that will change the mind of anyone who holds any of those three stated opinions at this point.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

How about a how-to video for properly preparing packages?

If you're going to continue to make ridiculously stupid comments, put your full name in your posts. It's the rules.

My full name is always in my posts, but I resent the fact that you are implying that my comments are also ridiculous, simply because I disagree.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

My full name is always in my posts, but I resent the fact that you are implying that my comments are also stupid, simply because I disagree.

Disagreeing is one thing. Making condescending remarks about 'stumping your toe' or 'making a how to video on how to open a package' is another thing.

[tschock]

Originally Posted by Mark17

The card should've been better protected, but the story we have to work with is that the card did arrive safely and undamaged. So, the poor packaging is no longer relevant - it caused no damage as the card was safely delivered.

Your assumptions are showing. Please show me where the OP indicated that the card was or was not damaged in shipping? Obviously he tore the card, but if the card was already damaged (bent, creased, wrinkled, dinged) due to poor shipping, all he did was make matters worse to problem made by poor shipping. Again, had he NOT torn the card, there is no evidence that has been provided either way as to whether or not the card was damaged prior to opening the package.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by tschock

Your assumptions are showing. Please show me where the OP indicated that the card was or was not damaged in shipping? Obviously he tore the card, but if the card was already damaged (bent, creased, wrinkled, dinged) due to poor shipping, all he did was make matters worse to problem made by poor shipping. Again, had he NOT torn the card, there is no evidence that has been provided either way as to whether or not the card was damaged prior to opening the package.

Any damage caused by the poor packaging, which would include any damage prior to the package ending up in the OP's hands, would be the responsibility and fault of either the seller or the carrier, and because of the poor packaging I would put that 100% on the seller and zero on the USPS.

Any damage after the card was in possession of the OP is his responsibility.

Had this been me, I would have, first, carefully opened the package without ripping the card. Noting the poor packaging, I then would've examined the card very carefully to see if there was any damage because of that. Had there been, I would've asked for a partial refund commensurate with the damage.

We have been given limited details and no pictures to go on. The OP mentioned no other damage to the card so that isn't the issue at hand. The issue is whether or not he is responsible for his own actions of ripping the card.

[tschock]

Originally Posted by Mark17

Any damage caused by the poor packaging, which would include any damage prior to the package ending up in the OP's hands, would be the responsibility and fault of either the seller or the carrier, and because of the poor packaging I would put that 100% on the seller and zero on the USPS.

Any damage after the card was in possession of the OP is his responsibility.

Had this been me, I would have, first, carefully opened the package without ripping the card. Noting the poor packaging, I then would've examined the card very carefully to see if there was any damage because of that. Had there been, I would've asked for a partial refund commensurate with the damage.

We have been given limited details and no pictures to go on. The OP mentioned no other damage to the card so that isn't the issue at hand. The issue is whether or not he is responsible for his own actions of ripping the card.

I totally agree with everything of what you said here except for the following: "The OP mentioned no other damage to the card so that isn't the issue at hand. " I went back and re-read the OPs 4 posts on this (yet again). The OP never indicated one way or another, but many seemed to have assumed he did.

My point here and previously is that the OP is responsible for the rip, but may not be totally responsible for ALL damage. That's just speculation on all our parts whether or not damage existed before he opened the package.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Mdmtx

I just hurt my toe going to the mail box. If that shipment wouldn't have been there I wouldn't have hurt myself. I'm gonna sue PayPal, eBay and the post office and give a negative to the seller.

I just pulled up to Starbucks and ordered a large coffee. About 3 blocks away, I hit a pot hole and spilled it all over myself. Come to find out, the lid wasn't on good. Help me out here, Mark. My fault for ordering the coffee to begin with? My fault for hitting the pothole? My cars fault because the shocks are bad and shouldn't have caused such a big jolt? The girl at Starbuck's fault for not putting the lid on good to begin with?

Oh, and next time wear some shoes, Mark. Shoes are meant to protect your toes - kind of like a top loader and cardboard are meant to protect a card.

[Mdmtx]

Based upon everyone's opinion in this thread, it is clear to me that the city is at fault for allowing a pothole. Everyone knows that the end user has no accountability to verify the lid is secure. Only trained professionals are allowed to install lids. Takes a high level of skill to perform the task.

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

I just pulled up to Starbucks and ordered a large coffee. About 3 blocks away, I hit a pot hole and spilled it all over. Come to find out, the lid wasn't on good. Help me out here, Mark. My fault for ordering the coffee to begin with? My fault for hitting the pothole? My cars fault because the shocks are bad and should have caused such a big jolt? The girl at Starbuck's fault for not putting the lid on good to begin with?

Oh, and next time wear some shoes, Mark. Shoes are meant to protect your toes - kind of like a top loader and cardboard are meant to protect a card.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Mdmtx

Based upon everyone's opinion in this thread, it is clear to me that the city is at fault for allowing a pothole. Everyone knows that the end user has no accountability to verify the lid is secure. Only trained professionals are allowed to install lids. Takes a high level of skill to perform the task.

Let me ask you a simple yes or no question. Do you think the card would have been ripped if it were in a top loader, between two pieces of cardboard inside a bubble mailer (in other words, packaged properly)?

[Mdmtx]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

Let me ask you a simple yes or no question. Do you think the card would have been ripped if it were in a top loader, between two pieces of cardboard inside a bubble mailer (in other words, packaged properly)?

Likely not. But that has no bearing. Could just as easily say if he hadn't bought it, it would not be ripped. They both are accountable. Period. I assure you that is correct. Maybe he should consult an attorney and ask how the law would view the division of liability.

The people that have insisted PayPal and eBay and other 3rd parties take responsibility is laughable. I am surely hoping those comments came from trolls and not their real views. If those are in fact their views, we are further down the crapper as a society than I believed. Without going back through and counting, I would guess 50% of the people thought a 3rd party should be held accountable. Wow. Then 75% or so feel it is the fault of the seller, even more shocking.

We used to live in a society where the majority of the populace were accountable. From this small thread, it is apparent to me that, that ship has sailed. I would really like to know the ages of the 4 possible demographics at play.

1. All seller fault
2. All buyer fault
3. Shared liability
4. 3rd party fault.

To remove all responsibility from the party who physically tore the item in question is ludicrous in my opinion.

[vintagetoppsguy]

Originally Posted by Mdmtx

Likely not. But that has no bearing.

Yes, Mark, it absolutely has bearing. You just admitted that it "likely" wouldn't have happened if it were packaged properly.

If the card would have been damaged during shipping (let's say by a postal machine), does the improper packaging still have no bearing or is it the post offices fault? The improper packaging is what caused the card to rip. Had it been properly packaged it wouldn't have ripped.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

The improper packaging is what caused the card to rip. Had it been properly packaged it wouldn't have ripped.

I could've opened that package without ripping the card, so your assertion that the packaging caused the card to be ripped is factually wrong. It was not inevitable that the card would be ripped upon opening the package. Frankly, had the OP been reasonably careful, it would've been highly unlikely. But personal responsibility is a concept foreign to some people so I'll quit trying to explain it.

I have added my full name to my posts, too. That was a valid point.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by vintagetoppsguy

I just pulled up to Starbucks and ordered a large coffee. About 3 blocks away, I hit a pot hole and spilled it all over myself. Come to find out, the lid wasn't on good. Help me out here, Mark. My fault for ordering the coffee to begin with? My fault for hitting the pothole? My cars fault because the shocks are bad and shouldn't have caused such a big jolt? The girl at Starbuck's fault for not putting the lid on good to begin with?

Oh, and next time wear some shoes, Mark. Shoes are meant to protect your toes - kind of like a top loader and cardboard are meant to protect a card.

1. The coffee is in your hand so you should know how hot it is, and you should check the lid to be sure it's on securely. I assume you ordered and wanted your coffee to be somewhat hot.

2. You should pay attention to your driving so you could avoid large potholes and this would be more easily accomplished if you weren't drinking your coffee while driving.

So, you ordered the hot coffee, when you took possession of it you assumed all responsibility for it, including the lid (unless someone put poison in it or something bizarre,) and you are responsible for your own driving.

In our society right now, I'll bet it's about 50-50 between people who would accept responsibility for the coffee spilling, and people who, like you, would rattle off a series of others who should've prevented it.

And that is a sad commentary on our country's situation. Harry Truman's "The buck stops here" attitude used to be respected, now it's often ridiculed.