advice Michael Jordan

[packs]

People on this board told me they wouldn't believe my Koufax was signed by Koufax if I hadn't already said I had the ball signed myself. The doubt permeates every aspect of the hobby, not just TPA.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by packs

People on this board told me they wouldn't believe my Koufax was signed by Koufax if I hadn't already said I had the ball signed myself. The doubt permeates every aspect of the hobby, not just TPA.

True, but you didn't pay for the opinions of people on this board. In the case of TPA's, who charge a fee to provide a service, there should be no doubt. Otherwise why charge a premium for signatures that are slabbed? If the whole point is to "guarantee" authenticity, why even slab them to begin with if there's still doubt?

[packs]

I agree as well with your point. I feel as though if an opinion isn't rendered (i.e. they can't tell) then a refund is in order. But I also feel as though it is a benefit to buyers that TPA's are as strict as they are with highly forged signatures. But the change should be made to reflect that an I don't know is different than a No and in that case a refund should be made.

[sbfinley]

Originally Posted by dgo71

True, but you didn't pay for the opinions of people on this board. In the case of TPA's, who charge a fee to provide a service, there should be no doubt. Otherwise why charge a premium for signatures that are slabbed? If the whole point is to "guarantee" authenticity, why even slab them to begin with if there's still doubt?

There can never be "no doubt" unless you witnessed the signing yourself. The "guarantee" is that should ever an authenticated signature be proven fraudulent they will reimburse the cost you can prove you have in the item. I respect plenty of opinions on the board, but I doubt many if any would make you whole if they made a mistake.

[dgo71]

I completely understand that witnessing an item being signed is the only 100% way of proving authenticity. So by that same token, how could an authenticated signature ever be "proven" to be fraudulent? Why would "proof" of a fraudulent item be more iron-clad than "proof" of its authenticity? That's kind of my point, these are nothing more than opinions, and I don't see what makes a TPA's opinion worth the fees associated with their service or the mark-up on the re-sale of their authenticated items. If the main pro of a TPA is to offer peace of mind, and that peace of mind is really just an illusion at the end of the day, aren't they selling snake oil?

I mean, I get it from a seller's perspective, I can sell this DVD for $10, or I can put it in a fancy "special edition" tin with a couple knicky-knack bonuses and sell it for $30. But from a buyer's perspective I see TPA's as useless middlemen that only cause me to have to pay more for an item with the exact same assurance of authenticity of a raw item.

Sorry to go off topic OP!

[packs]

People may not like TPA's in their current state, but I believe there is a necessity to have a standard of opinion. Individuals who have been dealing for a long time are trusted resources. But there needs to be some third party standard set for the sake of buyers. A single person can be influenced.

[chaddurbin]

i've heard psa rejecting trouts in the past and bryants recently...but since jordan is a big ticket item (high authentication fees) i don't think they'd just randomly reject good jordans. we do have a jordan expert here maybe post a scan and he'll chime in.

and the "got it ip" line is one of the most abused lines used in this hobby. you just admitted now that it wasn't ip and you bought it 10 years ago...who's to say if your friend didn't use the same line but he really didn't obtain it himself.

[Michael B]

Originally Posted by chaddurbin

i've heard psa rejecting trouts in the past and bryants recently...but since jordan is a big ticket item (high authentication fees) i don't think they'd just randomly reject good jordans. we do have a jordan expert here maybe post a scan and he'll chime in.

and the "got it ip" line is one of the most abused lines used in this hobby. you just admitted now that it wasn't ip and you bought it 10 years ago...who's to say if your friend didn't use the same line but he really didn't obtain it himself.

Actually what he said was "It was an IP autograph at Arizona fall league- 100% legit." He did not say that he got it in person. A minor point, but I believe a salient one.