Getting sick of the more obvious frauds

[Leon]

Originally Posted by sbfinley

A couple of personal points.

1. Anyone in the market for the original card in question should be doing their due diligence and know the issue's previous history. This is not a card that an unsuspecting mother, father, or wife would pull the trigger on for a loved one's gift. I would venture to guess that less than half of this board's registered members had even seen a copy of it before this thread. It also does not carry the popularity of as, say, one of his T206 poses so it would not be on the radar of even above-average collectors. What are there, maybe a couple dozen graded examples of the card?

2. I do not personally consider adjusting scans an agent of fraud. To me that is reserved for trimmed, recolored, swapped, and stolen cards. Part of selling is making the product seem appealing. If the scan was edited to hide something (paper loss-creases) I might consider otherwise, but simply adjusting the scan to make the card pop does not constitute fraud to me. Unethical maybe, but not fraud.

3. Use common sense. The card is slabbed poor with obvious creases. Yes, I know not all poor cards are built alike, but know what you are getting. I have purchased many lower grade cards before and never have I commented "I really thought it would present better" when I received them. They are poor for a reason.

4. A seller can ask whatever they want for card. It is their business. This isn't the late 80's and early 90's when everyone was a dealer and that was their livelihood. There are a few big time dealers left on the bay who make a living turning cardboard, but the vast majority are doctors, lawyers, educators, or businessmen and women first. It is not a job for them, it is a hobby and their family isn't going to go hungry because they wouldn't come down 10%-15% on a $3k card.

5. I'll over pay for a card that I really want. I am a very impulsive buyer. There are many collectors who are very selective and patient, but there are also many like me who, when they want it and have the cash, will jump on it. I had been following a card sitting on a 1k buy it now for almost a year. It was more likely a $600-650 card. It sold two weeks ago. I thought I knew who picked it up so I sent him an email. He was the one who finally bit and when I asked him if he thought it was a bad deal he responded that he hadn't seen another one come up in months and he really wanted it. He was happy. The seller was happy. Everyone was happy.

6. It is a baseball card.

Agree with everything you said Steven....but you lost me on this one-

"2. I do not personally consider adjusting scans an agent of fraud. To me that is reserved for trimmed, recolored, swapped, and stolen cards. Part of selling is making the product seem appealing. If the scan was edited to hide something (paper loss-creases) I might consider otherwise, but simply adjusting the scan to make the card pop does not constitute fraud to me. Unethical maybe, but not fraud."


Deceiving is fraud and making a scan look better than the card really is, is called deception. Plain and simple fraud to me. I guess it's debateable, just not in my mind.