1952 Bowman Stan Musial PSA 10 on eBay :o

[japhi]

Ya thats crazy, and in this case Brent walked him into a card he must know was altered. How many other Moser cards did Brent coach him to buy? How many other big buyers was Brent coaching? Playing these guys against eachother and making a fortune.

The whole thing is ridiculous.

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

He said, I think, that he also discussed how high to bid with Brent. Ugh.

My own cynical prior comment:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Maybe it's just me, but if I'm looking for an opinion on what to pay for a card, I am likely to ask someone other than the seller.
__________________
Stuff trumps all in this fraud and ostrich hobby.

[Goudey77]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Maybe CGC will slab it for him? I wonder if there's a video that explains it?

John you and I both know CGC would’ve caught the color touch job. Maybe they should open a card grading division. Out of respect to UFFDAH I won’t spam the CGC video here.

[bobbyw8469]

All these cards that are altered. It's sickening.

[swarmee]

Bobby, you didn't get any PSA bulk submission cards from any Mary Goser, did you?

[Goudey77]

A nightmare scenario for sure. This is where the card bubble may cool off or dare I say pop.
As much as I thought this news was isolated to a few social media outlets it has actually gained some good traction beyond the reaches of blowout and net54.

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Bobby, you didn't get any PSA bulk submission cards from any Mary Goser, did you?

LOL....no.....not at all.....all my stuff is low grade, and the dollar amount appears to be stuff he is not interested in.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by swarmee

bobby, you didn't get any psa bulk submission cards from any mary goser, did you?

lololololol

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by calvindog

lololololol

I'm small potatoes. He appears to like bigger fish.

[calvindog]

He likes any size fish as long as the fish has a wallet.

[111gecko]

This is awful. No refund from Brent; just having him send the card back to him and he sends it to PSA.
PSA has 2 choices: 1) admit they missed the altered card and are stuck with a $ issue, or 2) say they can’t find any alterations and send it back to Brent as good.
Brent is basically out of it?..

[swarmee]

Good thing they are so trusted as the market leader that they have an infinite grade guarantee policy they self-insure, at the card's current market value.

[japhi]

Originally Posted by 111gecko

This is awful. No refund from Brent; just having him send the card back to him and he sends it to PSA.
PSA has 2 choices: 1) admit they missed the altered card and are stuck with a $ issue, or 2) say they can’t find any alterations and send it back to Brent as good.
Brent is basically out of it?..

No way PSA is going to just start writing cheques. As the seller, and a partner of PSA, he has at least some responsibility to make sure cards in his auctions are good.

It’s clear to me that he knows that Moser is buying from him, restoring and selling through him. I don’t see PSA just bending over and writing big cheques. Would love to be a fly on the wall, I suspect Brent is stuck with refunds on the Moser cards, and he will have to work with Moser on recovery.

If you are within reasonable chargeback times that is where I would start, with my CC company. At minimum it forces him to fight the CB, and lots of card issuers will extend timelines in cases of fraud. I have to bet PWCC is getting slammed with chargebacks now.

[Buythatcard]

I believe he goes after any size fish. I am a small fish and he has bought 6 cards from me between 12/2006 and 11/2018. I don't know what he did with those cards but from what I've been reading the past few weeks, I can imagine.

I have kept records of every card that I've sold in 15 years, so I did a search on eBay for the most recent card that he bought from me and have noticed that his userid was changed on 6/4. Originally, it was whitman111 but it now appears to be ricky-leo.

BTW, the name of the purchaser of my card was Gary Moser. I believe that we are talking about the same guy. If not, then ignore what I said.

[swarmee]

Exactly the same guy. You should read more threads. Especially the hundred page ones over on Blowout. If you have "before" pictures of the cards you sold him, please post them on this board.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

I believe he goes after any size fish. I am a small fish and he has bought 6 cards from me between 12/2006 and 11/2018. I don't know what he did with those cards but from what I've been reading the past few weeks, I can imagine.

I have kept records of every card that I've sold in 15 years, so I did a search on eBay for the most recent card that he bought from me and have noticed that his userid was changed on 6/4. Originally, it was whitman111 but it now appears to be ricky-leo.

BTW, the name of the purchaser of my card was Gary Moser. I believe that we are talking about the same guy. If not, then ignore what I said.

We need PSA to provide certs for his submissions. And those of others who do similar things to cards. Dream on.

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

I believe he goes after any size fish. I am a small fish and he has bought 6 cards from me between 12/2006 and 11/2018. I don't know what he did with those cards but from what I've been reading the past few weeks, I can imagine.

I have kept records of every card that I've sold in 15 years, so I did a search on eBay for the most recent card that he bought from me and have noticed that his userid was changed on 6/4. Originally, it was whitman111 but it now appears to be ricky-leo.

BTW, the name of the purchaser of my card was Gary Moser. I believe that we are talking about the same guy. If not, then ignore what I said.

Howard, can you teach me how to check to see if he bought from me? Did you do some sort of Paypal search?

[MULLINS5]

I would NOT send that card back to Brent. It's evidence that could be destroyed.

[Buythatcard]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Exactly the same guy. You should read more threads. Especially the hundred page ones over on Blowout. If you have "before" pictures of the cards you sold him, please post them on this board.

I think I read most of the posts over the past few weeks. I have become addicted to this story.

Here is a link to the last card that he purchased from me.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/13285295926...m=132852959261

[Buythatcard]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

Howard, can you teach me how to check to see if he bought from me? Did you do some sort of Paypal search?

Robert,

I use Sixbit software to list my items. It will keep a history of all of your transactions. I usually delete them every 6 months. I searched thru my transactions since, it has the buyers name, address, email address, user name etc. I searched for Moser and found the most recent item.

I have a database which I developed years ago which keeps track of every single transaction that I have ever done on eBay. It includes item numbers and eMail addresses along with what was paid for that item. Since I now had Moser's eMail address, I looked up all the transactions that Moser bought from me and found 6.

[swarmee]

Don't see any Lipon cards here, yet.
https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1289859

Thanks for providing it.

[Buythatcard]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Don't see any Lipon cards here, yet.
https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1289859

Thanks for providing it.

Doesn't mean that there isn't any. Maybe he kept it for his own collection or perhaps he botched the alteration.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

Doesn't mean that there isn't any. Maybe he kept it for his own collection or perhaps he botched the alteration.

That list is very very very partial. Anyone who thinks that list is somehow complete should take the time to understand what it is, and isn't.

[Buythatcard]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

That list is very very very partial. Anyone who thinks that list is somehow complete should take the time to understand what it is, and isn't.

I agree with you. Every time I check the board, a new item has been discovered. Just the tip of the iceberg.

I went to look at Moser's feedback just to see what he's been up to. But, of course his feedback is private so you cannot see what he is currently doing. It's almost as though eBay is alright with all of this. They make it so easy for Buyers to cover their tracks.

I am confident that our fellow members here and over at BO will piece this all together.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

I agree with you. Every time I check the board, a new item has been discovered. Just the tip of the iceberg.

I went to look at Moser's feedback just to see what he's been up to. But, of course his feedback is private so you cannot see what he is currently doing. It's almost as though eBay is alright with all of this. They make it so easy for Buyers to cover their tracks.

I am confident that our fellow members here and over at BO will piece this all together.

On BO they archived it as of fairly recently.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

I agree with you. Every time I check the board, a new item has been discovered. Just the tip of the iceberg.

I went to look at Moser's feedback just to see what he's been up to. But, of course his feedback is private so you cannot see what he is currently doing. It's almost as though eBay is alright with all of this. They make it so easy for Buyers to cover their tracks.

I am confident that our fellow members here and over at BO will piece this all together.

The frustrating part to me is PSA knows every card he and his fellow card doctors have submitted since day 1, but leave us to try to unravel this mess.

[Buythatcard]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

The frustrating part to me is PSA knows every card he and his fellow card doctors have submitted since day 1, but leave us to try to unravel this mess.

And the crime continues as we all sit here waiting to see what happens.

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

It's like PEDs, the masking technology is ahead of the detection effort.

fyp

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

And the crime continues as we all sit here waiting to see what happens.

Changing his ID and taking his feedback private are not the actions of a man who intends to stop. I would imagine he has cards to sell in the pipeline but it won't be hard to find someone else to take them, particularly if he didn't buy them from Brent pre-alteration. Let's not forget many of these cards he bought raw, and are untraceable unless PSA divulges certs.

[Anish]

Originally Posted by UFFDAH

For the record I was the winning bidder. I am not stupid nor naïve. I graduated from college Cum Laude and own/run a multi-million $ company that sells into major retailers across the USA. I collected as a kid in the early 80's and my mom would take me to cards shows when Larry Fritsch had all the goodies. I am a meat and potatoes kind of guy that knows how to outfox and trap coyotes and I enjoy matching wits and killing big Whitetail Bucks who have a superior sense of sight and smell.

I bought the card because I simply love the fact that it is a HOF Musial and a fantastic image of him and that it is an extraordinary 66 year old example that made it through all the pitfalls from antiquated manufacturing/distribution and dodged the bullets of kid handling, bike spokes, tape, thumb tacks, and the list goes on to become a PSA 10.

I'm not a flipper, set builder, registry collector, or a Flip Chaser.

My collection consists of mostly Rookies but also some special non-Rookies plus vintage unopened. Baseball, Football, Basketball and Hockey. And a few non-sports. I respect all cards from PSA 1 to PSA 10 and respect all collectors.


This is my very first and only Musial and have been patiently waiting for a special one for a number of years since I got back into collecting. I may not own another Musial.

I may or may not sell my valuable collection some day. Hopefully some of the extra special one's like the Musial will be passed down.

All in all I really like and appreciate the card not only because it is Musial but because of all its attributes and yes for sure because it is a PSA 10.

Do I wish I could have got it for less?? Heck yeah, but I'd be kicking myself today if I put a top bid in of $15K.

I guess being smarter than a coyote or deer doesn’t make you smart enough to detect a scam

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

fyp

Not so sure some of this can be detected with the usual methods.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

i don't care how much and how you earned your hard earned money ...spending 28K on a card like that is just plain stupid! And I'll say it again and again and again!

Once upon a time, someone bought a Wagner for around that figure, and someone said the same thing.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Anish

I guess being smarter than a coyote or deer doesn’t make you smart enough to detect a scam

I am sure he feels chagrined without people piling on too much. Yes no question he was too trusting of Brent, but Brent seduced a lot of people.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Mark17

Once upon a time, someone bought a Wagner for around that figure, and someone said the same thing.

And they were right, look where Bill (he paid 25, right?) ended up.

[Buythatcard]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Changing his ID and taking his feedback private are not the actions of a man who intends to stop. I would imagine he has cards to sell in the pipeline but it won't be hard to find someone else to take them, particularly if he didn't buy them from Brent pre-alteration. Let's not forget many of these cards he bought raw, and are untraceable unless PSA divulges certs.

I don't even want to think about how many raw cards were involved. He bought 6 cards from me. 3 raw and 3 graded. He won't be buying anymore from me. I blocked him under his previous user name and his current user name.
One thing that I never thought about. If I block a buyer and he then changes his username, will he still be blocked under his new name. Or, is this just a way to slip between the cracks?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

I don't even want to think about how many raw cards were involved. He bought 6 cards from me. 3 raw and 3 graded. He won't be buying anymore from me. I blocked him under his previous user name and his current user name.
One thing that I never thought about. If I block a buyer and he then changes his username, will he still be blocked under his new name. Or, is this just a way to slip between the cracks?

He can just create a brand new ID in any case. I have a couple myself, not for anything sinister of course.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

And they were right, look where Bill (he paid 25, right?) ended up.

Bill's mistake is that he didn't buy the Jumbo Wagner.

[chalupacollects]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

He said, I think, that he also discussed how high to bid with Brent. Ugh.

My own cynical prior comment:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Maybe it's just me, but if I'm looking for an opinion on what to pay for a card, I am likely to ask someone other than the seller.
__________________
Stuff trumps all in this fraud and ostrich hobby.

Hopefully he saved the emails or texts....

[brianp-beme]

Originally Posted by UFFDAH

My confidence lies in PSA and PWCC who have earned my and many other collectors trust. I review most of my PWCC card targets including the Musial with Brent before I pull the trigger with a bid and have the utmost trust in his opinion. My best bump of a PWCC purchase is a 58' Jim Brown from an 8 to an 8.5 so my confidence and trust is VERY HIGH.

Peter - sellers like Brent, Steve Hart and some others are straight shooters. They build successful businesses because they are trustworthy. No different than my company taking care of our customers/consumers because we stand behind our product, you have to for repeat long term business. Brent does not hesitate to tell me to pass on one of his auction cards if he feels I should be patient and wait for a little stronger example knowing my goals and tastes. Sometimes my itchy trigger does not want to listen to him but I almost always do.

Man, talk about putting your trust in the wrong folks. Hopefully it all works out for the buyer, and for us too...this whole situation is disgusting.

BrianP(arker)-beme

[steve B]

So it's being returned?

Where does it eventually end up?
With PWCC?
With PSA?
With the card doctor?

If it simply all gets returned, I believe it will simply either get reslabbed after a crackout still a 10 but with a new cert number. Or gets a slight ding, and gets reslabbed as a 9 again with a new number, and we start all over again.

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by steve B

So it's being returned?

Where does it eventually end up?
With PWCC?
With PSA?
With the card doctor?

If it simply all gets returned, I believe it will simply either get reslabbed after a crackout still a 10 but with a new cert number. Or gets a slight ding, and gets reslabbed as a 9 again with a new number, and we start all over again.

The whole level of fraud and deception bestowed upon us by a few players is sickening.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

The whole level of fraud and deception bestowed upon us by a few players is sickening.

It’s not just a few players. It’s hundreds of crooks in this hobby, some big, some not so big, big there’s fraud in every corner of it.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by calvindog

It’s not just a few players. It’s hundreds of crooks in this hobby, some big, some not so big, big there’s fraud in every corner of it.

Noah's Ark time.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Just checked my lowly 7 and yeah there is a bit of a rough cut on the right side.

Brent Mastro can get that up to a 8 or 9 for you. Give him a call.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by calvindog

It’s not just a few players. It’s hundreds of crooks in this hobby, some big, some not so big, big there’s fraud in every corner of it.

But the biggest Fraudster of them all is Brent Mastro...The Ring leader.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

Brent Mastro can get that up to a 8 or 9 for you. Give him a call.

I haven't spoken with the lad since two or three years ago when he assured me Gary had pretty much retired. I think I'll leave it at that, thank you.

[T205 GB]

Hey guys. Someone told me a dead horse beating was going on. Did I miss it or do I have some time to get a few licks in?

[Fuddjcal]

I'm sure you have a boat load of fake cards UFFDAH if you have been working with Brent Mastro in this fashion.

I would get an attorney IMMEDIATELY and sue the snot out of that cheater liar scum bag. He is not your friend. He is a smiling grifter. Very sorry for your loss, but it's probably just the beginning for you.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I haven't spoken with the lad since two or three years ago when he assured me Gary had pretty much retired. I think I'll leave it at that, thank you.

LOL He was just getting started then...Started on his 15th year of trimming 4,000 cards a year for old Brenty Mastro.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

LOL He was just getting started then...Started on his 15th year of trimming 4,000 cards a year for old Brenty Mastro.

I can forgive people a lot of things, and do. Lying flat out to me, not so much.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

I think I read most of the posts over the past few weeks. I have become addicted to this story.

Here is a link to the last card that he purchased from me.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/13285295926...m=132852959261

I can see why he bought it. He will dress that pig into a 8 and make a quick 1 or 2K and Brent Mastro the dingleberry will send it to psa and sell it for him...Like he has been doing 4000 cards a year every year. Nice work if you can get it.