FS: T206 Ty Cobb Bat Off Green Apple Sov.

[Shoele$$]

Hello all,

For sale is an unbelievablely beautiful SGC 40 T206 Ty Cobb with the tough Green Apple Sovereign 350 back. This card speaks for itself. Absolutely stunning condition with sharp corners, near perfect centering and crease free with a sharp bold image. Undergraded IMO, should easily be at least a 4, possibly 4.5. Price is $2350 shipped and fully insured. First to say "I'll take it" gets it. PM if interested. Thanks

[Mick_7]

Whoa! Big time card here. I have never seen a grn apple sov Cobb before. Very nice, looks like a 5 to me.

[g_vezina_c55]

Beautifull card Glenn !

[Mikehealer]

Originally Posted by Mick_7

Whoa! Big time card here. I have never seen a grn apple sov Cobb before. Very nice, looks like a 5 to me.

Bud, there was one on ebay a couple of weeks ago. I'm sure you could find it in a search.

[Shoele$$]

Thanks Nelson, I appreciate it.

Bud, this was the card that was on Ebay. Still the only Bat Off GA Cobb that I had ever seen up to that point. Got offered $2400 a week after the purchase, and declined because it was the only BO Cobb in my collection. Now she's regrettably up for sale due to a whale that I'm after.

[Jlighter]

An ousted board member owned this card...guess he sold it.

Still nice though.

[MBMiller25]

Wow, I really like that card. If your interested in moving it more in line with what you purchased it for, PM me.

[ynnek4]

Nice card. Looks like 4-5.

Why a 3 I wonder?

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by ynnek4

Nice card. Looks like 4-5.

Why a 3 I wonder?

I still have a loop from my days of buying watches and jewelry and I looked over this card continuously and I can't find a reason why it would come back a 3. Definite undergrade. I feel if it was cracked and resubmitted, it would come back a 4-5.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

I still have a loop from my days of buying watches and jewelry and I looked over this card continuously and I can't find a reason why it would come back a 3. Definite undergrade. I feel if it was cracked and resubmitted, it would come back a 4-5.

Then you should do it.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Then you should do it.

Pete, believe me, if it doesn't sell for around what I want, I'm taking your advice

[Mick_7]

Alright I can't get this card out of my head, would you take $2150?

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by Mick_7

Alright I can't get this card out of my head, would you take $2150?

Send me a PM Bud, we'll discuss any details of offers there. Thanks

[npa589]

Before that board member sold it on eBay, I sold it to him a month or so before.

It was previously a PSA 3. There is a crease on this card.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by npa589

Before that board member sold it on eBay, I sold it to him a month or so before.

It was previously a PSA 3. There is a crease on this card.

Where exactly is this crease? I've been over the entire card with a 10x loop and can't find. If it's there, it's not visable to the naked eye. Do you have any scans of it in it's previous holder?

[npa589]

I saw it with my naked eyes before getting it graded.

I agreed to a price through someone else if I recall (less than what he sold it for), but they were made aware of the crease being what caused it to grade a 3.

http://s1185.photobucket.com/user/np...?sort=3&page=1

[Shoele$$]

Closer scan....

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by npa589

I saw it with my naked eyes before getting it graded.

I agreed to a price through someone else if I recall (less than what he sold it for), but they were made aware of the crease being what caused it to grade a 3.

Still not seeing it.....location of crease? Any scans of previous holder?

There's a couple VERY light stains on the front right border, that's all I can pick up.

[npa589]

Closer scan:

[Shoele$$]

Those edges and corners don't even look like the same card. Scans on 2nd pick has corners all banged up, not the case.

[npa589]

Are you serious Glenn? It's the same card.

[Shoele$$]

As a heart attack Nate....

[Mick_7]

My offer still stands Glenn if you change your mind. It's still an impossible front and back combo to find. Still the only one I've ever seen.

[npa589]

I have no problem with the sale, nor the sale price. However, its current value should not be based upon an advertisement of being "crease free" and "undergraded" when, in fact, it is not crease free, nor has it been undergraded......twice.

If someone feels it is worth that price with those facts being described, that is completely fine.

[thenavarro]

Maybe it had a trip to the doctor in between PSA and SGC to soak and press the crease out and to press and sharpen the corners?

(Before anyone gets bent out of shape I'm not accusing the original poster of doing that,, just trying to find a logical explanation for the striking similarities but yet subtle differences in the scans posted)

Looks like the same card to me too on a quick glance

Overall I think its a great, attractive to the eye, iconic card of the great Cobb

[npa589]

If the crease was perfectly pressed out somehow, it wouldn't be a 3.

If scans (and less brightening) of the Cobb in an SGC holder were put on here with the same resolution of the Cobb in my previous PSA holder were put, you'd see all of the "similarities".

It is 100% the same card.

Mike C. can vouch for that, as he was the one who also knows I sold the card to Steve K. a couple months back. Steve then sold the card on eBay. I know this, as others do, because I saw it on eBay. I even asked Steve about it and he verified.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by npa589

I have no problem with the sale, nor the sale price. However, its current value should not be based upon an advertisement of being "crease free" and "undergraded" when, in fact, it is not crease free, nor has it been undergraded......twice.

If someone feels it is worth that price with those facts being described, that is completely fine.

You're well entitled to your opinion Nate, and whether YOU feel the card is not undergraded is irrelevant. Everybody is entitled to their option on the overall grade. Sounds like sellers remorse to me, which you in a way eluded to above. Sorry your offer wasn't accepted in the past. I don't need to run any pending sales prices through Na.te Ad.am.s in case you were unsure. Thanks though.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by npa589

If the crease was perfectly pressed out somehow, it wouldn't be a 3.

If scans (and less brightening) of the Cobb in an SGC holder were put on here with the same resolution of the Cobb in my previous PSA holder were put, you'd see all of the "similarities".

It is 100% the same card.

Mike C. can vouch for that, as he was the one who also knows I sold the card to Steve K. a couple months back. Steve then sold the card on eBay. I know this, as others do, because I saw it on eBay. I even asked Steve about it and he verified.

Up till 1:20 a.m. Florida time trying desperately to sabotage the thread....agenda much??

Again, not sure if or what could have been done to the card before I received it, but this card in person does not look all banged up with busted in corners as Nate's scan is showing.

[thenavarro]

Good luck with the sale. That's a neat card .

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by thenavarro

Good luck with the sale. That's a neat card .

Thanks Mike, I appreciate it, it's been receiving offers all night long. Definitely a polarizing card that's for sure. My price is about right where it should be. I was told a 4 grade would bring $3K. This card is not very far off. It's priced about right even at it's current grade given the initial offer I received of $2400 when I first purchased it.

[Mikehealer]

Why not just sell it to the gentleman that offered $2400, if he made the offer 1 week after you bought it. That would have only been a week or so ago.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by Mikehealer

Why not just sell it to the gentleman that offered $2400, if he made the offer 1 week after you bought it. That would have only been a week or so ago.

It was about two weeks ago, and it was the days following. I had no intention of selling at that point in time. That buyer also just purchased a rare back Cobb red portrait. Wish he still had the funds available.

[Mikehealer]

That's too bad. If this was a tough back it would sell for sure the way they are going right now.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by Mikehealer

That's too bad. If this was a tough back it would sell for sure the way they are going right now.

Have you seen another with this front/back combo? If so where and what grade? I haven't been able to locate one, and it seems others haven't either. I will agree if this was an even tougher back, we would be in the $5-10K range. A member has a Cycle 460 Cobb BO in a 1 condition with a slight tear and won't even part with it for $7500......An SGC 40 EPDG (which is pretty close to the same scarcity level) just went for over $3200 a couple months ago. I'd say the premiums are already there for these tougher backs, lol. Not to mention, the SGC 40 EPDG was pretty worn around for a 40....IMO mine looks like a 5 compared to this card.

[Mick_7]

How in the world did that El PDG get a 40?

If anything this thread has shed light on the inconsistencies in grading with SGC.

The OP's card should be a 4 and the El PDG should be a 2.5 and that's being generous.

[tiger8mush]

Hi Glenn, do you have a back scan available that is the same size as the front scan you posted in post #17?

Thanks,
Rob

[Tcards-Please]

Originally Posted by tiger8mush

Hi Glenn, do you have a back scan available that is the same size as the front scan you posted in post #17?

Thanks,
Rob

Rob,

Nate provided a larger size in post #19. It is the same card that Glenn is selling. Even the stains on the back of Glenn's original post matches the one that Nate provided in #19.

r/
Frank

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by npa589

If the crease was perfectly pressed out somehow, it wouldn't be a 3.

If scans (and less brightening) of the Cobb in an SGC holder were put on here with the same resolution of the Cobb in my previous PSA holder were put, you'd see all of the "similarities".

It is 100% the same card.

Mike C. can vouch for that, as he was the one who also knows I sold the card to Steve K. a couple months back. Steve then sold the card on eBay. I know this, as others do, because I saw it on eBay. I even asked Steve about it and he verified.

Leaving aside the possibility that the crease might not show depending on resolution of the scan Glenn vouches that he has personally scrutinized the card and doesnt see the crease. So how are we to understand that?

[Mikehealer]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

Have you seen another with this front/back combo? If so where and what grade? I haven't been able to locate one, and it seems others haven't either. I will agree if this was an even tougher back, we would be in the $5-10K range. A member has a Cycle 460 Cobb BO in a 1 condition with a slight tear and won't even part with it for $7500......An SGC 40 EPDG (which is pretty close to the same scarcity level) just went for over $3200 a couple months ago. I'd say the premiums are already there for these tougher backs, lol. Not to mention, the SGC 40 EPDG was pretty worn around for a 40....IMO mine looks like a 5 compared to this card.

Yes, I've seen several, Levi has one on ebay that's been there for quite a while. PSA has graded 15 at 3 or better with Sovereign designated, so I'm sure they have graded quite a few more than that. Yours is a nice card, but with the crease it is only a 3 in the TPG's opinion and it's not a rare card in terms of quantity.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by npa589

Closer scan:

Wow, my eyes are better than a loupe!

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by Mikehealer

Yes, I've seen several, Levi has one on ebay that's been there for quite a while. PSA has graded 15 at 3 or better with Sovereign designated, so I'm sure they have graded quite a few more than that. Yours is a nice card, but with the crease it is only a 3 in the TPG's opinion and it's not a rare card in terms of quantity.

So you're telling me there's 15 Sov green apples graded? I think not. PSA and SGC also doesn't designate between both Cycle backs, so does that mean there's tons of Cycle 460's of every card too? Not taking into account the Cycle 350s? Again, I think not.

[Shoele$$]

"Creases" go through the card, this card does not have a crease. Light surface wrinkles don't go through cards. It's been determined the card has most likely been soaked and pressed.

[Mikehealer]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

So you're telling me there's 15 Sov green apples graded? I think not. PSA and SGC also doesn't designate between both Cycle backs, so does that mean there's tons of Cycle 460's of every card too? Not taking into account the Cycle 350s? Again, I think not.

No, I'm telling you there are more than 15 and obviously what you think is wrong. The bat off with a Sovereign back is only found with the "350" back, so all that are graded are Sovereign 350.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by Mikehealer

No, I'm telling you there are more than 15 and obviously what you think is wrong. The bat off with a Sovereign back is only found with the "350" back, so all that are graded are Sovereign 350.

Right, but AGAIN, what YOU think is wrong because you're not taking into account the much more common Forrest Green Sov. Which is also a 350. Read up a little more

[Mikehealer]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

Right, but AGAIN, what YOU think is wrong because you're not taking into account the much more common Forrest Green Sov. Which is also a 350. Read up a little more

I don't need to read up any more on this.
The bat off is a 350-460 subject and the Forest green is not found with the 350-460 series. The Forest green is only found with earlier series cards(150-350 and 350 only).

[srs1a]

All Cobb bat off, Sovereign 350's are apple green. SGC has 4 in their pop report, but there are more in the "no pose" bucket. I have the lone SGC-45, which sits in the "no pose" bucket in their pop report, so I'm sure aboiut that. Exactly how many are there, I don't know, but there are at least 5 graded by SGC and I would suspect a similar (or larger) number by PSA.


edited to add" Exactly correct, Mike. We were typing at the same time.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by Mikehealer

I don't need to read up any more on this.
The bat off is a 350-460 subject and the Forest green is not found with the 350-460 series. The Forest green is only found with earlier series cards(150-350 and 350 only).

Right, that's what I was referring to, your numbers seem to indicate Forrest Green "on".

[Mikehealer]

No Glenn, they are what I said. 19 graded by PSA with 15 at 3 or higher all bat off. It is a fairly common card.

[Shoele$$]

Originally Posted by Mikehealer

No Glenn, they are what I said. 19 graded by PSA with 15 at 3 or higher all bat off. It is a fairly common card.

Present at least 5 examples for me. Because your figures and the figures from other sources GREATLY differ. If this card was that common, we would see at least 5 examples of previous sales. So far I've seen two.

[Mikehealer]

Originally Posted by Shoele$$

Present at least 5 examples for me. Because your figures and the figures from other sources GREATLY differ. If this card was that common, we would see at least 5 examples of previous sales. So far I've seen two.

Well you might want to get your information from other sources.
You clearly don't know much about this subject. If your card was worth so much why was there only two bidders that bid over $1000 on the card. It's not a difficult card.
Try the VCP, it has more than your requested 5.