Is this card really worth that????

Guy pulled the auction with about 6 days left and the just over $3k on bids. Now a starting price of $9500. I understand the card is an error but is it really worth that Is it as rare as the Hoblitzell No Stats? Some of those in grade 4 barely top the $10k mark. Why not send it of to an auction house to get a realized value?

I think someone may have a pursuaded hand in new price to protect their interest. Just my opinion.

http://cgi.ebay.com/1911-T205-Christ...item19b8f01bf4


Also does smething smell funny about this auction? Heres the bid list and strangely enough a new member with 0 feedback and really deep pockets bid. Wheres he at when I need him to bid up my cards??

http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.d...m=110475324700

[Wite3]

Absolutely not worth that much...It is not an error...it is just a Matty with a Cycle back and should bring a Matty price with the normal Cycle premium. I think that the hype that this card generated is just odd. It is not a single print and not as rare as the other single prints, errors, etc.

Joshua

[Tcards-Please]

I can't believe he pulled it and relisted. Last I looked, it was around $2500.00. Although the new person has deep pockets, it doesn't appear that he is in the ballpark of what the new listing price is. Unless the person that bought the graded 3 last year for $9503 is looking for an upgrade, I don't see this selling for that price.

r/
Frank

[Mrc32]

You don't come across lottery tickets that often that are winners.

If it was mine and I was forced to sell it, I would take it to a real auction house...

[Wite3]

Lew was wrong on the oldjudge website...there are as many Cycle Mattys as there are other Cycles. They all contain the misprint. Hoblitzell no stats is much more rare (in fact, there are several rarer cards). I have seen many Cycle backed Mattys over the years...the only thing driving the price right now is hype and collector fervor over trying to get a supposedly rare error card. I repeat, this is no rarer than any other Cycle backed card. People who are paying these prices, just need to wait...others will come around.

Just to put some more perspective on this...a large Cycle find was uncovered about five years ago...included in the find was at least two Cycle Mattys (I suspect there was three but one was a private sale). According to my notes, in the last three years since this hype started, I have seen at least 9 different Cycle Mattys sell at auction, ebay, or privately. In the same time, I have only seen two different Hoblitzell no stats sell.

I have no problem putting a premium on the card since collectors want to be completists with their sets and competition will drive the price. I feel that I would not pay that much for that particular card. Would I pay a small premium (if I did not already own one), yes, but a small premium. Not $9500.

Joshua

[calvindog]

The two highest bids came from zero feedback, brand new accounts. That's all you need to know about this auction.

[Matt]

I wish the guy would have let the auction run (or at least sent it to major auction as Andrew suggested) so we can put an end to the "how much should it be worth" discussions on this card since the Lipsett sale seems not to be trusted due to the mis-information in the listing (it's not the rarest T205 variation; Hobby no stats is rarer).

The guy did already have 4 bids over $2500 so we know the market doesn't agree with the philosophy that it should be valued like any similar print HOFer with a Cycle back. That's not really surprising considering the precedent of cards like DeMitt, O'Hara and Wilhelm which are valued well above what they "should" be if looking only at populations, as collectors have always placed a premium on these textual variations.

Disclaimer: I own one of these. Heck - if his sells for $9500+ mine will be next for sale

[Matt E.]

Was there excessive lobbying to the grading companies to get this added?


As an avid collector of T205's, I would not pay anything other than the normal Cycle premium for this card at best.

Matt E.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Matt E.

As an avid collector of T205's, I would not pay anything other than the normal Cycle premium for this card at best.

This is getting humorous. In the sake of disclosure, it should be noted that Turner contacted me this morning in the interest of buying mine as you need it for your set. People should know your comment may have been influenced by a desire to keep the price down.

[Matt E.]

Originally Posted by Matt

This is getting humorous. In the sake of disclosure, it should be noted that Turner contacted me this morning in the interest of buying mine as you need it for your set. People should know your comment may have been influenced by a desire to keep the price down.

If Turner wants to buy and it to the set fine with me. His card budget is bigger than mine right now. I figured you would be coming on to bust my chops about my thoughts. Trust me, my comments cannot keep a card price down. We are two separate collectors.

Sake of disclosure? you sound like Judge Judy.

Again, I would not pay anything additional for this made up variation IMO. I will take my chances and find it at a card show.

[calvindog]

Originally Posted by Matt E.

As an avid collector of T205's, I would not pay anything other than the normal Cycle premium for this card at best.

Matt E.

I'm just a neophyte when it comes to the T205 set so I appreciate the guidance. I was just about to offer 10K for an example of this Cycle Matty, thanks!

[Matt E.]

Originally Posted by calvindog

I'm just a neophyte when it comes to the T205 set so I appreciate the guidance. I was just about to offer 10K for an example of this Cycle Matty, thanks!

Paying the additional premium for the Cycle back would be pushing it on second thought.

Matt E.

[Matt E.]

Originally Posted by calvindog

I'm just a neophyte when it comes to the T205 set so I appreciate the guidance. I was just about to offer 10K for an example of this Cycle Matty, thanks!

Yikes!

CD.... try offering his opening bid of $9,500 to end the auction. Trying to save you five hundo.

Matt E.

[tbob]

Originally Posted by Matt E.

Yikes!

CD.... try offering his opening bid of $9,500 to end the auction. Trying to save you five hundo.

Matt E.

Matt- I think Jeff was just kidding
tbob

I have never heard of this. Is this story true that someone paid $1k for a card and it took 30 years to be recognized as an error to make his money back? I see where he got the steep price also.


The following information was found at the OldJudge Auction site, Nov. 2008:
"Never seen before, the rear of the Cycle backed card shows Mathewson having lost only one game in 1908 rather than the 11 he lost and is recorded on every other T205 Mathewson known. The type on the back is extremely dark and clear and this is not a case of the type not coming out or a digit being rubbed out. The card was discovered by long time Indianapolis collector Ted Koch at a show in 1975 or 1976 and was purchased then for the princely sum of $1,000. The card has, as previously mentioned a fairly tough Cycle back, and there is a possibility that may have something to do with the error. At this time the card must be considered the rarest of T205 variations easily surpassing the “Hoblitzell”. The card has a worn upper left corner and a couple of minor specks in the gold border. No creases and a very nice appearing card.
Winning Bid $9,503."