Judge’s 62nd hR Different Perspective

[cammb]

First of all, I am a Yankee hater. I don’t care how many hrs Judge hits. For me it is Maris as the true hr king. When Maris had his fabulous year, people forget that he was in a battle with Mantle. Everyone was against him, the fans and the press. Talk about pressure. No one wanted him to beat Ruth and if some one had to do it was Mantle. I think that in that last game, only several thousand people were in attendance. I could be wrong but it wasn’t a sell out. After his feat, he began to lose his hair because of the aniexty and pressure. Fast forward to today. There was no pressure on Judge. He’d had the fans and media bootlicking his every move.. this is my opinion. Having lived through that epic battle in 1961, hats off to Maris. PS. I didn’t want either of them to break the record. I had always hoped that Killebrew would do it.

[chalupacollects]

For me it is 62 home runs in 154 games to be the real record.

[chalupacollects]

...

[packs]

Is it fair to say he's not under pressure? He's both in the midst of of hitting 62 home runs, trying to win the triple crown, and planning his next move after he becomes a free agent.

He bet on himself the whole season. How can you say he's not under any pressure? He performed under a massive amount of pressure.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Being "pressured" as a baseball player fulfilling a dream most of us could never realize in a million years is a first world problem, if you ask me. Big deal.

[D. Bergin]

Personally, I'm not going to be impressed until somebody hits 80 HR's with a wiffle ball bat, while blind-folded with their back facing the pitcher in the batters box.

.....and they have to get it done by the All-Star break.

It's what the Babe would have done in the modern pansy ass game we call "baseball".

[todeen]

Originally Posted by packs

Is it fair to say he's not under pressure? He's both in the midst of of hitting 62 home runs, trying to win the triple crown, and planning his next move after he becomes a free agent.



He bet on himself the whole season. How can you say he's not under any pressure? He performed under a massive amount of pressure.

I don't think that's what he meant. It's a different type of pressure when people actively hate you rather than cheer you. All athletes are under pressure to live up to expectations.

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[packs]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Being "pressured" as a baseball player fulfilling a dream most of us could never realize in a million years is a first world problem, if you ask me. Big deal.

Are you talking about being a professional baseball player at all or being Aaron Judge? The majority of professional baseball players don't reach the major leagues, leave without any savings, and forego education for a chance to play. Seems like a lot of pressure to me.

[packs]

Originally Posted by todeen

I don't think that's what he meant. It's a different type of pressure when people actively hate you rather than cheer you. All athletes are under pressure to live up to expectations.

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Expectations are one thing but Judge bet on himself and it was up to him to make that a wise bet or not. He performed in a way no one could have seen coming. That's living up to pressure.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by packs

Are you talking about being a professional baseball player at all or being Aaron Judge? The majority of professional baseball players don't reach the major leagues, leave without any savings, and forego education for a chance to play. Seems like a lot of pressure to me.

Roger Maris was an established star at the time, and Aaron Judge has earned millions of dollars. To me whatever pressure they were under to hit home runs is a joke relative to the real life pressures on countless millions.

[packs]

Maybe you should look into Judge's life story a little more. I would not call him a fortunate person.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by packs

Maybe you should look into Judge's life story a little more. I would not call him a fortunate person.

I didn't say he hasn't hat problems, and they may indeed be real sources of pressure in his life despite his wealth. My point is that the pressure of the home run race is illusory. A construct by sports writers and fans seeking drama.

[packs]

The pressure of the race you're talking about can't materialize until baseball puts an asterisk next to Bonds. Hitting 62 home runs is a feat but he was never on pace for 74.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by packs

The pressure of the race you're talking about can't materialize until baseball puts an asterisk next to Bonds. Hitting 62 home runs is a feat but he was never on pace for 74.

Well the supposed pressure on Maris is always played up, unless like Aaron he was getting death threats I would question that too.

[jayshum]

Originally Posted by chalupacollects

For me it is 62 home runs in 154 games to be the real record.

Not sure if you're being serious, but if you are, then shouldn't it be 61 home runs in 154 games since Ruth only hit 60?

[bigfanNY]

So Judge hit 61 in less than 154 games and 62 in less than 162. Seems pretty clear to me he is the AL single season HR King no matter how you slice it. Good for Him and LET'S GO YANKEES!!!
As for Everybody rooting against Maris I was born in 61 I have a cousin named Roger. Most of the Yankee fans in my family were against the * next to Maris's record. Outside the stadium they sold buttons that said either I am for Mickey or I am for Roger. Now I know they sold more Mickey buttons but they sold a bunch of Roger pins as well.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by bigfanNY

So Judge hit 61 in less than 154 games and 62 in less than 162. Seems pretty clear to me he is the AL single season HR King no matter how you slice it. Good for Him and LET'S GO YANKEES!!!

No I think he had 60 through game 154.

Aaron Judge through Game 154 of 2022: 60 HR
Team Game 154: 9/25 — 0-for1, 4 BB

[chalupacollects]

Originally Posted by jayshum

Not sure if you're being serious, but if you are, then shouldn't it be 61 home runs in 154 games since Ruth only hit 60?

No 62 in 154 as Ruth had 60 in 154 and Maris had 61 in 154.

To make it apples to apples then Judge needed 62 in 154 to break it. He's now still the leader but does it deserve the dreaded asterisk?

[Kutcher55]

I’m a Red Sox fan but jeez Judge is awesome and he seems to be a class act. Great story and I tip my cap to the guy.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by chalupacollects

No 62 in 154 as Ruth had 60 in 154 and Maris had 61 in 154.

To make it apples to apples then Judge needed 62 in 154 to break it. He's now still the leader but does it deserve the dreaded asterisk?

Maris had 58 through game 154.

[EldoEsq]

Originally Posted by chalupacollects

No 62 in 154 as Ruth had 60 in 154 and Maris had 61 in 154.



To make it apples to apples then Judge needed 62 in 154 to break it. He's now still the leader but does it deserve the dreaded asterisk?

Huh???

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[Peter_Spaeth]

Let's get the facts straight.
Through 154 games:
Ruth 60
Judge 60
Maris 58

Through 162 games assuming Judge hits no more:
Judge 62
Maris 61

[cammb]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Well the supposed pressure on Maris is always played up, unless like Aaron he was getting death threats I would question that too.

Read some of the newspapers in 1961. Just google them. Maris was certainly receiving death threats.

[cammb]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

I didn't say he hasn't hat problems, and they may indeed be real sources of pressure in his life despite his wealth. My point is that the pressure of the home run race is illusory. A construct by sports writers and fans seeking drama.

Ok. Then I imagined need it.

[cammb]

Originally Posted by packs

Expectations are one thing but Judge bet on himself and it was up to him to make that a wise bet or not. He performed in a way no one could have seen coming. That's living up to pressure.

I would think the adoring fans, media and no close competition is na little less pressure compared to the later.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by cammb

Read some of the newspapers in 1961. Just google them. Maris was certainly receiving death threats.

I did not realize that. The pressure mentioned earlier in the thread was that of fans not wanting him to break the record, or preferring Mantle. If he was getting death threats that's legitimate pressure.

[bigfanNY]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Let's get the facts straight.
Through 154 games:
Ruth 60
Judge 60
Maris 58

Through 162 games assuming Judge hits no more:
Judge 62
Maris 61

My bad Pete Judge hit 61 game 155. So you are correct only 60 in 154. And almost everyone knows that Maris hit 61 last day of season Oct 1 1961.
J

[Tyruscobb]

Originally Posted by chalupacollects

He's now still the leader but does it deserve the dreaded asterisk?

You could argue that several records have asterisks. The reason is today's players play more games each season, which, in turn, means they have more opportunities to accumulate career statistics.

The AL went from playing 154 games to 162 in 1961, and the NL made the change in 1962. From the 1890s through the early 1960s, each league played 154 games a year.

Accordingly, pre-1961 (AL) and pre-1962 (NL) players had 8 games less each season to accumulate career statistics than more modern day players.

Ty Cobb played 24 years. This equates to 192 lost games (24 years x 8 games a season). Cobb averaged over 174 hits a year. Adding just his seasonal average to his hit total would easily give him more hits than Pete Rose.

So, 8 additional games each season doesn't sound like a lot, but it adds up over a 20+ year career.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Ruth and Cobb played in an all-white league, did not have to play at night or deal with all the time zone changes, I think it probably all evens out more or less.

[BobbyStrawberry]

Any pressure on Judge seems to me to have been put on himself. I saw his deciding to test the FA market as a gamble at the time, especially given his spotty health history. But man, did he make the right choice! I wonder, has there ever been a baseball FA who decided to take this kind of gamble in the past and had it work out as well as Judge has? So many stories where it played out in the opposite way...

[Vintagedeputy]

No pressure on Judge? Seriously?

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Vintagedeputy

No pressure on Judge? Seriously?

Seriously. What happens if he doesn't break the record, he's worth a few million less? Oh my God, how unthinkable.

[Mike D.]

For me, the REAL home record is Ned Williamson's 1884 record of 27.

Because, if you're going to be arbitrary about things, it's best to REALLY DO IT UP!

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by Mike D.

For me, the REAL home record is Ned Williamson's 1884 record of 27.

Because, if you're going to be arbitrary about things, it's best to REALLY DO IT UP!

Babe Ruth haz Cars and Planes and Penicillin and Indoor Plumbing.

Ned Williamson had to deal with dirt playing fields filled with manure and pot holes, dysentery, traveling to road games by horse or on foot, and the basic misunderstanding that Opium and Blood-letting were performance enhancers.

[Mike D.]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Babe Ruth haz Cars and Planes and Penicillin and Indoor Plumbing.

Ned Williamson had to deal with dirt playing fields filled with manure and pot holes, dysentery, traveling to road games by horse or on foot, and the basic misunderstanding that Opium and Blood-letting were performance enhancers.

Your post made me picture the old "Oregon Trail" video game. I smiled.

[bmattioli]

Judge will get $40 Million a year and a 8 year contract. Yankees had their chance now the Redsox will swoop in.. Dude had an amazing year and timing is everything..

[Peter_Spaeth]

Boston needs pitching above all else. Oh wait, Chris Sale will be back to collect umpteen million and then be hurt for the season after three starts by gripping his steering wheel too tightly or something.

[Bestdj777]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Babe Ruth haz Cars and Planes and Penicillin and Indoor Plumbing.

Ned Williamson had to deal with dirt playing fields filled with manure and pot holes, dysentery, traveling to road games by horse or on foot, and the basic misunderstanding that Opium and Blood-letting were performance enhancers.

You have convinced me.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Mike D.

For me, the REAL home record is Ned Williamson's 1884 record of 27.

Because, if you're going to be arbitrary about things, it's best to REALLY DO IT UP!

This. The amount of arbitrary and after the fact qualifications being put in to produce the outcome people want the outcome to be instead of the actual outcome is a little ridiculous. We all know what the actual record is. Doesn’t mean I like it, but it is what it is.

[robw1959]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Ruth and Cobb played in an all-white league, did not have to play at night or deal with all the time zone changes, I think it probably all evens out more or less.

I can appreciate those difficulties, BUT . . . Babe Ruth is still the true king. He hit homers over 450+ foot fences, for crying out loud. Everyone here should get a copy of the book, "The Year Babe Ruth hit 104 Home Runs." During the 1921 season, his pattern of batted balls would have accounted for over 100 homers in modern ballparks and under modern rules. That year, Ruth hit a 500+ foot home run in every American League park he visited, and, of course, hit more 450+ foot shots than anyone in history. The author (Bill Jenkinson) performed in-depth statistical analysis to make a fair comparison of the conditions under which the game was played in Ruth's era and baseball as it's played today.

[Mike D.]

Originally Posted by bmattioli

Judge will get $40 Million a year and a 8 year contract. Yankees had their chance now the Redsox will swoop in.. Dude had an amazing year and timing is everything..

I don't think you're far off on what he gets. I don't think (hope) he gets it from the Red Sox. I'd put the chances at him returning to the Yankees at 75% personally.

I also don't think the contract is going to be a good one for the team. He's already had plenty of injury issues, and that doesn't usually get better after age 30.

Fun fact: There have been 5 players who have hit 61 or more home runs in a single season. None are in the Hall of Fame. If Judge is to make it, he's got a lot of work to do. He's got a shot, for sure, but lots of work.

Also, I think at least one of the other guys gets there before Judge is retired.

[chalupacollects]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Maris had 58 through game 154.

OOps forgot AL went to 162 games in 61 while NL didn't go to 162 until 62...

[bmattioli]

Originally Posted by chalupacollects

OOps forgot AL went to 162 games in 61 while NL didn't go to 162 until 62...

Interesting. did not know this fact. Huge "what if"..

[Bigdaddy]

How many other baseball seasonal records get a * and different record holders for different number of games played? Hits? Strikeouts? Triples?? Wins by a team??? Wins by a pitcher???

Throw out the *s and the game counting - this is a record for a season, however MLB defines a season in that year. Like it or not, Judge now holds the AL record. Alone. No *. No explanation needed.

[Casey2296]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Babe Ruth haz Cars and Planes and Penicillin and Indoor Plumbing.

Ned Williamson had to deal with dirt playing fields filled with manure and pot holes, dysentery, traveling to road games by horse or on foot, and the basic misunderstanding that Opium and Blood-letting were performance enhancers.

I'm feeling you, I think the true home run King is the Ape that threw the bone in the air during the opening scene of Stanley Kubrick's 2001: A Space Odyssey

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Casey2296

I'm feeling you, I think the true home run King is the Ape that threw the bone in the air during the opening scene of Stanley Kubrick's 2001: A Space Odyssey

One of the great uses of music in a movie scene for sure. Brilliant.

[cammb]

Originally Posted by Bigdaddy

How many other baseball seasonal records get a * and different record holders for different number of games played? Hits? Strikeouts? Triples?? Wins by a team??? Wins by a pitcher???

Throw out the *s and the game counting - this is a record for a season, however MLB defines a season in that year. Like it or not, Judge now holds the AL record. Alone. No *. No explanation needed.

What about Sosa and Maggie?

[campyfan39]

I think if the * was applied to Maris it should be applied to Judge.
I am not saying I am in favor of it I just see a double standard there. Neither beat Ruth in 154 games.

Lots to like about the young man, his family, character etc. I don't like the Yankees but have found him hard to dislike.

Finally, I appreciate the posts on career statistics. I think the addition of expanded rounds of playoffs also skews career totals. But it is what it is and I am looking forward to coming home early from work tomorrow and watching baseball all day

[steve B]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Personally, I'm not going to be impressed until somebody hits 80 HR's with a wiffle ball bat, while blind-folded with their back facing the pitcher in the batters box.

.....and they have to get it done by the All-Star break.

It's what the Babe would have done in the modern pansy ass game we call "baseball".

If the Red Sox had signed Kingman that one time.... you might have seen at least part of that.

[packs]

There is no asterisk next to Maris's record. It was removed in 1991.