question about the national sports collectors convention

[travrosty]

it looks like the national is scheduled for baltimore, cleveland, and chicago for the next several years and no where else.

it seems it only rotates between a few locations? why is that? what cities would you like to see it be held if it was up to you? Why can't it be in Las Vegas or Miami or Dallas? It seems heavy on the east coast and a few midwest locales like chicago or cleveland. When it's not held in these locales, is it a clunker and that's why it's only in three cities? I have heard of it being in Atlanta, and Atlantic city before but it seems like it's a three city monopoly now.

I went to the one in Anaheim in 1991. Does the heavy concentration of east coast dealers unwittingly influence it being mainly on the eastern half of the United States? I suppose they don't want to lug all their stuff clear across the country to go to the west coast.


Can someone list all the years and host cities since its inception?

[Leon]

I think the decisions on host cities are based mostly on economics and ease of working with the potential venues.

[perezfan]

It stinks!

They should hold it where you can easily get a direct flight. Cleveland + Baltimore require connections from many cities (mine included- Seattle). Chicago is a great hub that's central to all, but the other two are horrible for anyone living west of the Mississippi.

They have completely snubbed the West.... San Diego and Las Vegas would be two of the best locations possible. Both Convention Centers are state of the art, and they are fun locations to visit.

Las Vegas is just too obvious to waste time typing about, and San Diego has attractions like Sea World, the Zoo, Mission Bay, the Ocean, Tijuana, etc. It's great for families tying in a vacation. Plus, dozens of hotels are within 3 minutes of the Convention Center... not to mention the Gaslamp District (30 seconds away) with dozens of great restaurants, bars, etc.

Whoever organizes that convention must have blinders on. There's no reason they can't mix in a West Coast venue once every 3-4 years.

[travrosty]

Originally Posted by perezfan

It stinks!

They should hold it where you can easily get a direct flight. Cleveland + Baltimore require connections from many cities (mine included- Seattle). Chicago is a great hub that's central to all, but the other two are horrible for anyone living west of the Mississippi.

They have completely snubbed the West.... San Diego and Las Vegas would be two of the best locations possible. Both Convention Centers are state of the art, and they are fun locations to visit.

Las Vegas is just too obvious to waste time typing about, and San Diego has attractions like Sea World, the Zoo, Mission Bay, the Ocean, Tijuana, etc. It's great for families tying in a vacation. Plus, dozens of hotels are within 3 minutes of the Convention Center... not to mention the Gaslamp District (30 seconds away) with dozens of great restaurants, bars, etc.

Whoever organizes that convention must have blinders on. There's no reason they can't mix in a West Coast venue once every 3-4 years.

good points, i agree, they should mix it up a lilttle, i wonder who is in charge of setting up the locations?

Looks like baltimore, chicago, cleveland all locked up through 2018, with 2017 to be determined. no plans for even going back to anaheim as i guess they have problems getting commitments and assurances from the venue. but why not try other west coast venues like las vegas or san diego?

The national rifle association has a huge convention every year and they go all over, charlotte, pittsburgh, denver, st. louis, milwaukee, etc.

not knocking baltimore, cleveland and chicago but they should branch out. I guess it wasn't always this way?

[GrayGhost]

Back in the day when I had the funds. I went to four in about as diverse a locale as you can get. Chicago, St Louis, Atlanta and Atlantic city. My favorite one remains AC, as it was my first one, plus I loved the ocean/casino, etc. St Louis followed, then Chicago and Atlanta , which was the first time I ever flew..haha.

All from 1988-95 era. Id love to go this year, but besides Funds, I work in a baseball tourney at that time too, so prob no dice

[Scott Garner]

I suspect that the reason that Las Vegas is never an option is because the event may not draw a large enough crowd and Vegas may not be viewed as "family friendly" for kids. I attended a convention in Denver at the newly remodled convention center. It was spectacular, FWIW...

[Rob D.]

The following is a very informative thread, especially starting at post No. 14, if you'd like some insight on what goes into choosing National sites:

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=114661

[bobbvc]

Another vote for San Diego. Petco Park is right across the street from the Convention Center. Would also get huge local walk up traffic.

[chris122868]

I wish it would come back to INDIANAPOLIS INDIANA !!!!!!!!!!

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by bobbvc

Another vote for San Diego. Petco Park is right across the street from the Convention Center. Would also get huge local walk up traffic.

Agreed! +1

[travrosty]

yes, lets have it in san diego. 4 votes for san diego. all opposed.......

motion passes.

[novakjr]

I noticed in the thread that was posted, that there was a big knock on the IX Center in Cleveland, as being shabby. I'll have to agree. If I remember correctly, Cleveland had recently changed years to '14. Currently the website still lists the IX as the venue, bit I suspect that date change may have been done so that the Convention can be held at the new Medical Mart and Convention Center in downtown... Over the last year, I've been doing much of the re-bar work on the project, an I'll say that the building will be a HUGE upgrade over the IX as far as quality(slight downgrade in size though), especially since it will be within walking distance of many hotels, the rock hall, tower city mall, and the new casino. Assuming my suspicions are correct about the venue change, this should be a great time...I'll be severely disappointed if the IX is still used for the convention..

[Exhibitman]

It is all about money, folks. The people who own the National want a venue with cheap fees and willingness to make a long-term commitment at rock bottom prices. You are never going to see a first-rate venue in a first-rate city host the show because the powers that be fear that they could not line their pockets sufficiently if they upgraded the experience. Nevermind the contrary evidence of Comicon in San Diego.

The National organizers love Cleveland because it is dirt-cheap and desperate for business. I do not think that the event will shift away from the IX [pronounced "Ick"] Center because it is too cheap and profitable to hold it elsewhere.

Anaheim won't sign a contract years in the future at rock bottom prices. That puts the kibosh on Anaheim.

There is a sizable east and midwest dealer faction that pisses and moans about traveling west of the Rockies because they drive to and from the show. That effectively kills LA, SF, Vegas and other points west.

New York has been rejected because of the cost of doing business there--union fees for vendors at the convention center. You cannot just carry in your stuff and set up; you have to use [and pay] the convention center's contract labor to do it.

The other theory on Vegas is that it would distract collectors from the show, i.e., cause them to spend money on something other than cards. Unrealistic; you stand a better chance of getting out of Iran alive on an El Al 747 than you do of getting a National conventiongoer to spend money on something other than cards, alcohol or cheap eats.

While personally I don't mind a show that pulls in 1/4 of the visitors that a Comicon does--less competition--it would be nice to have a kick-ass show experience with all the multimedia and other events available in addtion to the bourse itself. That said, I spend my time at the show, not on the town, so I judge the experience solely from the show and the hotels and related facilities. Baltimore wasn't bad. The facility was decent, the hotels were close by, and it went quite well. The only complaint I had was travel issues, but I went to NYC first--able to fly direct from Burbank to JFK--then took the train down to Baltimore, which was quite a pleasant way to do it. I plan to do that again this year. Cleveland is a PITA for me. There's only 1 direct carrier--Continental--but my main complaint about that place is the shabby accommodations and facilities, and atrocious food. Just not a pleasant experience. CHI is OK; I can get a good variety of flights and the hotels and restaurants around the venue are decent. The convention facility itself is middling quality; has that weird break in the floor where they put the Olympics peiple the last time. IMO the best facility/hotel/destination show I've been to was Anaheim in 2006. That was really first rate all around.

[novakjr]

I might actually agree that the IX might be more profitable, but I think the city of Cleveland will force a move the Medmart/Convention Center(if not for 2014, for sure in 2018)....For 1, it's downtown, closer to the other businesses that they want to drive business to, while holding it at the IX allows money to be spent in other cities, since it's on the outskirts of the city... Dan Gilbert owns the casino, and he's a large business voice in the city. He'll definitely want the convention at the MM/CC. The Rock Hall and Tower City mall will definitely want it there. Hell, the Cleveland Indians will probably want it there, since the Jake(I'm sorry, the PROG) is also within walking distance.. They might be able to get a bigger discount from the city if held at the MM/CC.

Also the new Head of Convention Sales for the MM/CC held the same position at the IX for the past 8 years. So I imagine he might bring the National with him..

[travrosty]

I didn't know any of the specifics when i started this thread, but by reading the old thread and other observations, my hunches were right. the people that set it up want it on the eastern midwest/east coast and it keeps going to the same locations, for monetary reasons. Looks like it will be The Cleveland Show from now on.

shame because it should really get moved around, and mixed in with other locales.

[Bilko G]

Id love to see it come out West once every 4 or 5 years at least. Los Angeles, San Diego Seattle etc.

[Leon]

I think the one short sentence of my reasoning above in this thread might have been the most succinct, correct and best answer I have ever given about a subject on this board. It pretty much summed it up.

I am with Adam a bit on the show etc.....As I have said a thousand times, it could be in a box in the desert. If there were air conditioning and any kind of paltry or even sub-standard food and beverage, for survival, that is all I need. I go to the show for one reason, the show.

Also, it's not completely set in stone, and you heard it here first, but if you want to ask Mike Berkus any questions about the National he is set to speak at the Net54baseball Dinner (at the National) again. I am lining up things now.....It will be on Friday again if all goes as planned.

[Rich Klein]

NET 54 DINNER ROCKS!~

SO LOOKING FORWARD TO THAT

Rich

Excuse the caps, best news I read all day

[mjkm90]

I agree with Leon. I ONLY go to the National to see memorabilia and my Buds. I'm so damned tired from walking miles and miles that any bed feels good and I'm so hungry that a sack-o-burgers works for me. The less I spend on housing and food, the more memorabilia I come home with.

When I go on vacation I'll drop whatever it takes to have a good time and see the world, but not for a show.

I'm fine with the show owners making money. The less it costs the dealers, the more of them will show up and the less they will charge for merchandise. keep it inexpensive and spartan.

[Exhibitman]

How did everyone feel about the Olympics room at the CHI show last year? I thought it was interesting to see:

--European collectors [though the old German guy with the 1936 Hitler Olympics memorabilia did have a creepy Major Strasser vibe to him];
--Different athletes and memorabilia than the norm; and
--thin people and women at a card show.

I actually picked up one item for my collection in there, a 1936 ticket for the late, lamented Los Angeles Red Car system to the Olympic boxing trials venue.

[HexsHeroes]

Originally Posted by mjkm90

i agree with leon. I only go to the national to see memorabilia and my buds. I'm so damned tired from walking miles and miles that any bed feels good and i'm so hungry that a sack-o-burgers works for me. The less i spend on housing and food, the more memorabilia i come home with.

When i go on vacation i'll drop whatever it takes to have a good time and see the world, but not for a show.

I'm fine with the show owners making money. The less it costs the dealers, the more of them will show up and the less they will charge for merchandise. Keep it inexpensive and spartan.

.

+1

[HexsHeroes]

.


. . . about use of Cincinnati as a National site ?

I realize that it's still in the midwest, versus east coast, west coast, but as a hub for Delta, doesn't it offer better flight in/out options than does Cleveland ? Not sure of what convention space is available, or how the cost of such compares to Cleveland.

Just a thought . . .

[perezfan]

Would love to see it go to Cincy. Better direct flights, and a great baseball town. Mix it up, for goodness sake!

[Jewish-collector]

I'm glad to hear that there will be a Net54 dinner this year. It is the very best part of the National experience !!!

I have heard that they started limiting the number of dealers for the National at some number (not sure what the number is) SO THAT THEY WILL be able to have a slightly smaller National in other cities. They tried Baltimore & it was a fantastic success. They need to try other cities now.

[brett 75]

Anyone every have the thought of an East coast & West coast Nationals ? I'm sure there are enough quality dealers on both coasts to pull off large enough shows on both coasts to satisfy everyone ? Brett

[novakjr]

Originally Posted by brett 75

Anyone every have the thought of an East coast & West coast Nationals ? I'm sure there are enough quality dealers on both coasts to pull off large enough shows on both coasts to satisfy everyone ? Brett

I was thinking about mentioning the same thing. Possibly one in the spring and the other in the fall.

[Butch7999]

From the information in the thread [ http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...=114661&page=2 ]
to which Rob D. (post #7) provided a link, it seems like floorspace is a primary criterion -- minimum 300,000 square feet,
ideally 400,000+. That is some serious acreage. Really, how many towns have a convention center or exhibition hall of that size?

[Jewish-collector]

That was their old thinking. As I mentioned, I have now heard that they started limiting the number of dealers for the National SO THAT THEY WILL be able to have a slightly smaller National in different cities. Many cities definately have a venue that now can able to hold a little smaller National.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Butch7999

From the information in the thread [ http://www.net54baseball.com/showthr...=114661&page=2 ]
to which Rob D. (post #7) provided a link, it seems like floorspace is a primary criterion -- minimum 300,000 square feet,
ideally 400,000+. That is some serious acreage. Really, how many towns have a convention center or exhibition hall of that size?

The SQUARE FOOTAGE stuff is a red herring. Nearly every major city has a facility large enough for the show. In just a few minutes on line I was able to find these:

Los Angeles: South Hall 346,890 SF
San Francisco: Moscone North-South combined 442,000 SF
Las Vegas: Sands Expo: Hall G 380,000 SF
San Diego: ground floor 525,701 SF
Miami: convention center has over 500,000 SF

[travrosty]

here in minneapolis they have over 400,000 square feet. i agree it seems like many venues have enough square feet but won't be considered to host the convention?

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by travrosty

here in minneapolis they have over 400,000 square feet. i agree it seems like many venues have enough square feet but won't be considered to host the convention?

Denver's Convention Center might fit into this category too. I attended a convention there 2 years ago. They've done a really great job on the remodel and have added a lot of square footage. Ther rumer is that they want their square footage to rival Las Vegas as a venue. Downtown Denver is very cool and the Colorado Rockies are nearby as well... Not a great team, but certainly a great ballpark to visit if ever in the mile high city.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by Scott Garner

Denver's Convention Center might fit into this category too. I attended a convention there 2 years ago. They've done a really great job on the remodel and have added a lot of square footage. Ther rumer is that they want their square footage to rival Las Vegas as a venue. Downtown Denver is very cool and the Colorado Rockies are nearby as well... Not a great team, but certainly a great ballpark to visit if ever in the mile high city.

Nope... Makes far too much sense. Too good a city, too many direct flights, and too far west. They will never go for it

[UD]

Since i am and old fart and have been to most of these i will answer
the question.....about the history of the national.
1980.....la
1981.....detroit
1982.....st louis
1983....chicago.....(.my first)
1984 ....parsippany, nj
1985......anaheim
1986.....arlington, tx
1987.....sf
1988.....atlantic city, nj (good)
1989....chicago
1990....arlington
1991.... Anaheim (ofs)
1992 atlanta, ga
1993 chicago
1994 houston
1995 st. Louis
1996 anaheim
1997 atlanta, ga (ug)
1998 cleveland
1999 chicago
2000 anaheim
2001 cleveland
2002 chicago
2003 cleveland
2004 atlantic city
2005 anaheim
2007 cleveland
2008 chicago
2009 cleveland
2010 baltimore
2011 chicago
and looking fwd to balto this year.....the city was very receptive 2 years ago. Hope this helps to all history buffs like myself. Come by my booth and say hello.
Ud (uncle dick)

[ValKehl]

Can you add 2006 to your listing?

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by UD

Since i am and old fart and have been to most of these i will answer
the question.....about the history of the national.
1980.....la
1981.....detroit
1982.....st louis
1983....chicago.....(.my first)
1984 ....parsippany, nj
1985......anaheim
1986.....arlington, tx
1987.....sf
1988.....atlantic city, nj (good)
1989....chicago
1990....arlington
1991.... Anaheim (ofs)
1992 atlanta, ga
1993 chicago
1994 houston
1995 st. Louis
1996 anaheim
1997 atlanta, ga (ug)
1998 cleveland
1999 chicago
2000 anaheim
2001 cleveland
2002 chicago
2003 cleveland
2004 atlantic city
2005 anaheim
2007 cleveland
2008 chicago
2009 cleveland
2010 baltimore
2011 chicago
and looking fwd to balto this year.....the city was very receptive 2 years ago. Hope this helps to all history buffs like myself. Come by my booth and say hello.
Ud (uncle dick)

Uncle Dick,
Thanks!
I thought 1999 was in Atlanta? Maybe I'm misremembering (ala Clemens), but I recall that the Atlanda National ran in tandem with the 1999 HOF Induction. . I was there to attend Nolan Ryan's induction.

Atlanta edged out Houston for the venue in the vote in 1999...