T206 triple strike/quadruple srtrike?

[EVAJOY91]

Happy holidays - thanks going out to all members who have given me so much help on this t206 error card. I have been this great hobby for over 25 years. Yesterday 12/24/13 was the craziest day i have had so far in this hobby. Starting at 8am i was contacted by 4 auction houses about this card. The big three rev, bill goodwin and ken golden all of which i respect so much for their great work in this hobby. All wanted me to consign this rare card to their upcoming auction. They all made me great offers and why their company is the "best"choice for this rare t206. We all agree that this card is triple struck. But i'm getting emails that it may have been struck 4x. I have attached one new photo upside down.
What do you think?

I will decide this monday on the auction house that i will consign to for their upcoming auction in 2014. Estimate on this card is now $20,000 - $25,000 by two of the mentioned above.

Members, please look again at the new photo and let me know what you think. Triple strike or quadruple strike. Thanks

[ullmandds]

You may want to move this out of the 19th c buy/sell thread...for better response.

Great card...good luck!

[ullmandds]

for the record...i see 3 strikes...not 4.

[Leon]

If you post anymore threads please be careful where you are posting them. I moved this one also.

I am not very good at determining the number of overprints on these (my only one, I am still unsure if it has 4, 5 or some other number) but since we are here I don't think yours is more than a 10k card. I think 8-10k....but I have been wrong so maybe am this time too..... And if yours is a 20k card what does that make this one? (shown for the OP as he might not have seen it.) Whomever is telling you it's a 20k-25k card, have them buy it from you at that price . ..I hope you get as much as you can for it and thanks again for posting. Glad the forum has been able to help a bit..regards

[Jacklitsch]

I see at least four strikes.

[Mikehealer]

I would think you would need a ski mask and gun to get $20,000-$25,000 for it, but I'm wrong much more often the older I get. Whatever you decide, good luck.

[atx840]

There are three strikes.

One upside down miscut strike (4 corner), a regular slightly offset strike plus a third offset/miscut strike.

7-9k with the right bidders.

[Jacklitsch]

Chris...do you count MILL and OL as one strike?

[ullmandds]

steve...the old...and the mill were created by 1 pass of the printers plate...they're just way off center.

[thehoodedcoder]

then where is the D in old?

its missing which suggests that they are not the same strike.

notice in leon's card, the part of piedmont to the right of the card and the piedmont on the left of the card, together make a full image of the piedmont logo.

you don't have that on the old mill card.

kevin

[atx840]

It's a handcut, 100 year old worn scrap card, one upside down offset strike.

[Sean]

I only see three strikes as well. It appears that there is a large border between the OL and MILL, which keeps the D from fully printing.
Not that it matters. Three strikes is enough to make this a great anamoly.

And for the record: let me know when you're taking offers on that Mullaney, Leon.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Sean

I only see three strikes as well. It appears that there is a large border between the OL and MILL, which keeps the D from fully printing.
Not that it matters. Three strikes is enough to make this a great anamoly.

And for the record: let me know when you're taking offers on that Mullaney, Leon.

I always listen to offers though he isn't for sale. I had a board member offer me what I paid, several years ago.....but that was a bit under 10k and that wouldn't do it. However, this isn't my thread so we should be cognizant of that....LL

[ruth-gehrig]

Aren't auction houses notoriuous for over inflating estimates to get you to consign??

[mrvster]

I'm still drooling over this card.....It has FOUR strikes.......you must count the frame lines.... two up/two down.....

HOFer....crap....three strikes.....the frame lines had me seeing quad

my guess....15,500 K with juice at Goodwin....the beauty of this card...

Leon.....you know that's my whale(your rosetta T206).....besides the triple stamped om I missed years ago....

man, I need to hit the lottery

[CW]

I see 3 strikes and my guess is an $8K - $15K card, with a lean to the lower end.

[atx840]

Here is a breakdown of the back, over time the edges likely wore down.

[Gradedcardman]

Nice job Chris. That is really great work !!!

[insccollectibles]

I agree great job on the breakdown Chris.

[CW]

ICWUDT, BIDKHTHUDI.

I see what you did there, but I don't know how the hell you did it.

Pretty cool to see those all laid out seperately. I could even see the prospective AH paying you a few bucks to use that in the listing. Cool stuff, Chris!

[mrvster]

great! that was awesome....

[Leon]

So here is a stupid question. The example Chris showed, of the process and pics associated, on the 2nd one from the left it looks like there is a stamp in each of the 4 corners. Why isn't that 4 stamps?

[mrvster]

not a stupid question at all.....because it was one "strike" of the plate......its just off center/miscut to show 4 parts of the upside down back....


every "strike" or impession of the plate to the cardboard....

this card was printer scrap....the pressman(Thank you Chris for the dissection/illustration)....took a sheet of error/discarded sheets with front images......he starts to align the back ads for printing.....instead of grabbing new stock, he grabs a "garbage" sheet from the scrap pile....sets up his wells/plate changes for a new ad......adjusts the mechanical end......he may send a sheet upside down not caring which direction just to adjust alignment/ink flow....grabs the sheet, the first "strike" occurs, it's the upside down 4 back o.m. portion he inadvertently prints......he makes some adjustments, flips the sheet, re aligns , hence, the second strike right side up/offset......he grabs the sheet, religns again, and shoots another "strike" ....impression OM # three is then created......this sheet has now served it's duty, is thrown back into the scrap pile........


This is a scenario of this particular card.....the card is then thrown in the dumpster/or taken home by the pressman.......later they are hand cut off the scrap sheet and tossed aside/thrown away, hell, they are garbage right????

Now these unique little pieces of art are created....totally "unique" like snowflakes.....even similar ones off the same sheets have their own characteristics.....more offset ghosts/registration/color issues etc....


100 year old chase cards....one of a kinds.....COOL ASS CARDS

mesmerizing....

Leon.....you lucky man......your card was created by a pressman who really believed in conservation/ or was just to lazy to grab another sheet

he has tied your particular sheet to many ads/processes of the litho...

WOW...


the brown OM in your example makes me crap a pickle not to mention the ghost and multi ads....


if these pressman only knew what they were creating

their "screw ups" are now coveted by freaks like me


Blank Backs were spared the humiliation of being ran through a few more times....


I have been searching for years for a blank back with a back ad overprinted on the front!!

[mrvster]

I think your Mullaney is the only example of brown OM UPSIDE DOWN I have seen


please, please, please do not ever decide to sell that, unless trade to me

[mrvster]

btw....Thanks for Grim again

Can you dissect Leons like the om??

I see:

1 4 back pied

1 epdg reg miscut top/bottom/ 1 epdg upside down

1 brown old mill upside down

1 ghost impression Young

1 yellow pass

6 strikes of the plate???????????????

[atx840]

Hey Leon,

On the backs of uncut finished sheets the back adds would look like a large grid. Several rows and columns. It's likely this large grid was printed all at once, one strike.

If the sheet wasn't aligned properly when the backs were struck they would be offset compared to the front images. When being cut from the front you'd get misaligned backs.

Some were offset enough to show two and sometimes four parts of an add. These are from another column and/or row. 4 corners, 1 strike

The OM has two four corner strikes, one upside down and one upright.

Clear as mud.

[MVSNYC]

Johnny- you're a snowflake.



Just drove by Brick, heading to Cape May.

[thescooper]

I'll give you a hundred bucks for it

[mrvster]

your taste in the aesthetics of the freaks is impeccable

[mrvster]

to $500.00

[Leon]

Originally Posted by atx840

Hey Leon,

On the backs of uncut finished sheets the back adds would look like a large grid. Several rows and columns. It's likely this large grid was printed all at once, one strike.

If the sheet wasn't aligned properly when the backs were struck they would be offset compared to the front images. When being cut from the front you'd get misaligned backs.

Some were offset enough to show two and sometimes four parts of an add. These are from another column and/or row. 4 corners, 1 strike

The OM has two four corner strikes, one upside down and one upright.

Clear as mud.

Hey Chris
I would greatly enjoy you dissecting my Mullaney the way you did the Old Mill......any chance?

[wonkaticket]

Mike,

As I said to you in my PM I think the numbers of 20-25k are very aggressive and a bit unrealistic and I would caution you to be prepared for a number very much lower than that. As I said my educated guess 5-8.5k. But I guess anything can happen.

Also I won’t be bidding and have no interest in the card short of trying to put you and Jim B together for his Wiliis run. So I’m one guy out of the picture in terms of driving the price up….

Mike also I think it’s time to just pick an auction house or what you want to do privately. I understand you’re excited about the sale and that’s really cool for you.

However to me there’s fine line of using the BST for sales or using the BST/Board for publicity. A hundred threads on how many strikes it has, the folks you have talked too, your market estimates etc. isn’t going to make your card go for more. Not trying to sound mean but if everyone started multiple threads promoting their own items that may go to auction etc. it sort of defeats the purpose of the BST IMO. Perhaps Leon disagrees?

Also as I said I wish you the best with the sale.

Cheers,

John

[Sean]

I agree Mike. This thread was very cool, but if you go with a major AH you won't need more publicity.

[Sean]

By the way, after we know the final sale price of the card, please let us know how much the AH estimated that it might sell for. I would like to know how much they pump up their estimates in order to get consignments.