Does anyone collect raw cards exclusively in this age of TPG???

[auggiedoggy]

I was curious to know if there are collectors out there that purposely avoid slabbed cards and collect the old fashioned way. In this age of slabbed cards, where even reprints are sent off to PSA, we now use the "raw" descriptor. Back in the day we just called it card collecting.

Leon, if this topic has been done to death then deep-six this thread and we can move on ...

[Wite3]

There are many of us...I tend to only collect raw and when I do end up with a slab, I often liberate the card. I can count on one hand the amount of graded cards in my collection at this point.

Joshua

[4815162342]

This might have something to do with it: http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=168612

[bobbyw8469]

I collect raw when I am set building.

[SmokyBurgess]

I primary loved and collected cards not entombing the player...until recently...as I just like baseball types now, will get graded examples because of the altering, fraud, deception going on.

Peace of mind.

[BradH]

Originally Posted by auggiedoggy

I was curious to know if there are collectors out there that purposely avoid slabbed cards and collect the old fashioned way....

I don't purposely avoid slabbed cards, and have purchased many when the price is right, but I too have cracked most of them out. I feel that I'm definitely an "old fashioned" collector. I love the cards for what they are and not for the grade or the potential future dollar value, so buying them raw has never been an issue for me. Maybe that's dumb or naive, but that's just the way I do it (and I have nothing against those who insist on slabs).

For example, I started working on a 1951 Bowman set last summer and am basically doing it in raw VG condition. I've purchased probably 15-20 in PSA/SGC slabs that were graded as 4s and 5s, and I promptly broke them out and slipped them into my three-ring binder. When it comes time for me to get the more expensive Mantle and Mays cards, I won't have any problem buying them raw if I feel good about the card and the seller.

I did the same thing with my '33 DeLong set and I love it in the binder.

[brianp-beme]

I went 24 years of collecting vintage without ever owning a single graded card, and still 95% of what I pick up now is raw. Of course it helps that I have low standards.

Brian

[KCRfan1]

I always try to buy raw. I can usually find nicer cards at better prices than graded examples.

[conor912]

Often times I can't even find what I'm looking for raw.

[ALR-bishop]

My cards are not "raw". They are cards in their natural state...

[bbcard1]

Call me a cracker unless I am buying for resale.

[auggiedoggy]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

My cads are not "raw". They are cards in their natural state...

Yes they are but "raw" is now a commonly used expression. Before TPG, cards were simply cards.

[Bocabirdman]

Only recently, I have began to accept slabs into my collection. I had found that the remaining T206 are becoming much more difficult to find raw in a suitable condition. I prefer raw but I had to accept a dose of reality. Out of the first 270 cards , I had 3 slabs. I just passed 300 cards and I have added 20 slabs. I still MIGHT liberate them. I dunno........

[auggiedoggy]

Originally Posted by Wite3

I often liberate the card. I can count on one hand the amount of graded cards in my collection at this point.

Joshua

Is that easy to do without damaging the card inside or is there a technique to it. I've not tried that yet but I have a 98-card set that is 3/4 raw and I don't look forward to the time and expense involved in getting it graded.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Wite3

There are many of us...I tend to only collect raw and when I do end up with a slab, I often liberate the card. I can count on one hand the amount of graded cards in my collection at this point.

Joshua

me 2

[Paul S]

Old Skool folk here. It's like The Who's rock opera Tommy -- 'See me, feel me, touch me.'

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by Paul S

Old Skool folk here. It's like The Who's rock opera Tommy -- 'See me, feel me, touch me.'

I believe I could fit two entire raw T206 sets in the custom T206 oak box I bought from a forum member. That's keeping them in sleeves only (no top-loader). Even the rigid card-savers add a lot of volume that's unnecessary unless you need to ship them or leave them laying around. Just my opinion - since I primarily sell them in PSA or SGC holders I probably sound hypocritical, but that's just because valuation/pricing is so much simpler.

[Cardboard Junkie]

I used to be a "raw only" guy. Now I am a "graded only" guy....and I prefer PSA. Dave.

[Paul S]

Originally Posted by Runscott

,,,since I primarily sell them in PSA or SGC holders I probably sound hypocritical, but that's just because valuation/pricing is so much simpler.

That's how I would sell mine as well, in most cases , to the general public.

[doug.goodman]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

My cards are not "raw". They are cards in their natural state...

As are mine.


I'm quite handy with a kitchen knife when it comes to removing cards from those plastic cases that the people who get paid for their opinions provide.

Doug

[jerseygary]

When I pick up cards I only buy them unslabbed. I figure if I need to have someone else tell me what it is, what condition it is in and if it even real then I shouldn't be collecting what ever it is. Kind of takes the fun out of it for me. "Fun" is the word here because I tend to only collect for the fun of it. I think the slabs are very ugly and the labels are too "computer-y" for my taste. To me there's nothing as pretty as a free and easy loose stack of '33 Goudeys' sitting on my drawing table!

[tedzan]

This display tells you where I stand on this subject.

I just love to flip thru my albums of card sets contained within quality plastic pages. And for my high value cards,
I prefer high quality mylar, instead of hard plastic rectangles with arbitrary numbers that may not actually reflect
the card's grade.






TED Z
__________________________________________________ ______________________

LOOKING FOR these T206 guys to complete my AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 sub-set

AMES....CAMNITZ....CRAWFORD (bat)....DOYLE (port)....JORDAN (bat)....MARQUARD
McGRAW (port-cap).....McQUILLAN (bat).....TINKER (bat off).....WILTSE (port-cap)

[auggiedoggy]

Originally Posted by tedzan

This display tells you where I stand on this subject.

I just love to flip thru my albums of card sets contained within quality plastic pages. And for my high value cards,
I prefer high quality mylar, instead of hard plastic rectangles with arbitrary numbers that may not actually reflect
the card's grade.

TED Z
__________________________________________________ ______________________

LOOKING FOR these T206 guys to complete my AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 sub-set

AMES....CAMNITZ....CRAWFORD (bat)....DOYLE (port)....JORDAN (bat)....MARQUARD
McGRAW (port-cap).....McQUILLAN (bat).....TINKER (bat off).....WILTSE (port-cap)

A picture is worth a thousand words.

So, I should let the boys loose is what you're inferring?

[Matthew H]

Originally Posted by bbcard1

Call me a cracker unless I am buying for resale.

+1. I have 9 cards still in slabs because they never made it into my collection. I can't wait to get rid of them.

If I had a t206 card graded PSA 8 I would leave it in the holder, but I'll never buy one that high grade, I just don't trust grading at all. I have one old judge that is near mint, but I bought it raw so it gets to stay that way.. If I had a graded 8 old judge and I wanted to keep it, I'd probably end up cracking it, so that I can look at the edges.

[DHogan]

I'm a set builder. My cards for sets are all raw. For my player (Hogan) collection, most are raw. I buy the card. Not the grade or holder. Now that I have a great job. I can buy more.

[Tao_Moko]

I have special tools to crack them but they vary by the TPG which ones I use. Butterknife, jewelers screwdriver, gem hammer and letter opener. Be warned - the Beckett holders are a bear! I've damaged more than one with a slip of the prying device when I first started.

[kmac32]

My W572 collection is completely raw while my E121, T 207 Cubs, and various Elmer Miller cards are slabbed.

[aelefson]

I have no graded cards. I will not even look at graded cards for sale.

Alan

[WWGjohn]

My whole collection is unslabbed with just a few graded when I could not find anything else. Like many others I'm a set collector and unslabbed is the only way I casn come close to a complete set.

John

[tbob]

All of my E (caramel) and M and D card sets are in slabs, all of my tobacco card sets except the 1909 Obak set and T210s are raw in binders...

[ullmandds]

Interesting concept...it would be a great way to narrow your focus...as many cards just are not available raw?! As much as I hate slabs...they have become a way of life.

[itjclarke]

Everything I have pre about 2006-2007 is raw and will stay raw (by numbers vast majority of my collection). More than 50% of what I've bought since is graded.

It took me a while to accept owning cards in holders that I can not open.. and I still love my raw cards, but it's highly unlikely I'd ever pop cards out that I paid graded prices for.. especially anything that's signed. Just me, but I can't stand the thought of eventually upgrading a given card, and selling the lesser for 20% less I paid because I cracked the holder.

[Matthew H]

Originally Posted by itjclarke

I can't stand the thought of eventually upgrading a given card, and selling the lesser for 20% less I paid because I cracked the holder.

You can always get something graded again. I've put a lot of thought into this, I enjoy cards 100x more raw, if a future buyer wants a card to be graded, something can be worked out.

Cracking a card out and owning it raw is well worth the price of re-grading. That's my opinion. It also keep me on my toes as far as judging condition myself.... If you buy a graded card and you feel like you'll lose money by cracking the holder, it might not be graded correctly.

[VintageGamerN00b]

I'm putting together a '59 Topps set as a gift for my dad and am presenting it in custom binders. Unslabbed cards are so much prettier than PSA graded ones, in my opinion. I'm not necessarily opposed to graded cards if I'm collecting to resell, but for vintage cards that will stay in my collection (or that of someone I know), I only buy ungraded.

I would imagine the majority of the forum members here share this view, especially because many of them are as good as or better than the graders and would never pay $15 to be told something they already know.

[itjclarke]

Originally Posted by Matthew H

You can always get something graded again. I've put a lot of thought into this, I enjoy cards 100x more raw, if a future buyer wants a card to be graded, something can be worked out.

Cracking a card out and owning it raw is well worth the price of re-grading. That's my opinion. It also keep me on my toes as far as judging condition myself.... If you buy a graded card and you feel like you'll lose money by cracking the holder, it might not be graded correctly.

No right or wrong in collecting... unless of course you end up doing something you don't really want to do, whether pressured by outside influence or other, but I digress.

Inititally I COULD NOT STAND graded holders. I remember trying to "open" the first one I got and then feeling really dumb. I've since learned to live with them, and don't really mind them anymore (this may change if I ever create a man room display). Love my raw cards too.

I just don't ever want to pay the $7,$8,$10, $12 (whatever the hell it is) per card to get them regraded so I'd be able to make them more sellable down the road... just seems like it could/would add up really quick. I don't buy to sell, but have upgraded a number of cards and am thankful my lower grades in holders simply because it gives me a pretty good rough expectation of what I'd get for them. I'm sure I have a few overgraded cards, and definitely have a few undergraded.. but most are where they belong, so I'm not worried about losing the TPG's #, as much as just paying money I don't want to spend.

Again, no wrong or right here and to each his own. Crackers keep crackin.. flippers keep flippin.. hoarders keep hoardin.. thievers keep thievin... sorry, strike the last comment

[7nohitter]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

I collect raw when I am set building.

Me too...I HAVE purchased many '57's for my set that are graded, but as soon as I receive them I crack them out.

[Jayworld]

I have and always will collect "raw" cards. Been collecting now for 38 years and counting. All my cards are in Ultra Pro pages in albums, with a handful of "odd" sized cards (T201, Topps 1955 Doubleheaders) in rigid card holders. I don't worry about buying raw, as I buy from 2-3 very reputable dealers on eBay, Deans Cards, and here on the boards. I consider anyone who lists in the B/S/T forum to be reputable. This forum is a very safe place to buy, sell, and just talk cards. Love it!

[sandmountainslim]

I only collect low-mid grade T206 and only raw unslabbed.

[npa589]

For Cubs team subsets that I'm building, if I don't buy raw --- they will be freed, but this isn't to say that some TBG examples are saved from my little flat-head and hammer. Sometimes after I buy a card, it's hard for me to follow through with cracking open a PSA 5 T206 Pfeister when, whether it's sold raw in a couple years or less, or if I send it back to get graded (which probably makes less sense), I know I am decreasing its market value. This is true regardless of what the % increase/decrease is in T206s from now to the time of resale.

I surmise this is why many collectors have resolved to only buy raw. I haven't been able to do that yet, it's hard enough trying to put together a T206 Cubs master set while not purchasing any graded cards!

[Exhibitman]

I am replacing my slabbed cards with raw cards stored in albums because I find I enjoy them more that way. Most of what I still have slabbed are sets or partial sets that I will probably finish or sell that way, or delicate items that need the protection of a slab. That said, when my pusher, er, slabber of choice runs a sufficiently tasty special I will send in raw T or E sets to get them slabbed for potential future resale. Business is business after all...

[travrosty]

There is no such thing as raw. They are baseball cards.

[bigfanNY]

In a solid 40 years of collecting I have NEVER purchased a graded card. As someone who has just embarked on cataloging my collection for resale This topic has a great deal of relevance to me. I took a very nice 47 Jackie Robinson Bond Bread to a show to sell and offers were a fraction of the cards worth and everyone said they would have to have it graded to sell. (large show here in NY area) a 1947 Bond bread Jackie Robinson fielding no ball. No reasonable offers got it graded a 6 and now very easy to sell at market or above. Would I prefer if using current pricing models like Vintage card Prices I could sell my collection Raw to knowledgeable folks like here on Net 54 Of course it would save me and everyone bucks. But reality is that if I have cards graded Prices are better and there is no complaints about I didn't notice corner on the scan etc. On markets like Ebay or at auction houses or even if I set up a table at a major show like National or Philly Grading seems to make economic sense. I do not like it But..

[auggiedoggy]

Originally Posted by bigfanNY

In a solid 40 years of collecting I have NEVER purchased a graded card. As someone who has just embarked on cataloging my collection for resale This topic has a great deal of relevance to me. I took a very nice 47 Jackie Robinson Bond Bread to a show to sell and offers were a fraction of the cards worth and everyone said they would have to have it graded to sell. (large show here in NY area) a 1947 Bond bread Jackie Robinson fielding no ball. No reasonable offers got it graded a 6 and now very easy to sell at market or above. Would I prefer if using current pricing models like Vintage card Prices I could sell my collection Raw to knowledgeable folks like here on Net 54 Of course it would save me and everyone bucks. But reality is that if I have cards graded Prices are better and there is no complaints about I didn't notice corner on the scan etc. On markets like Ebay or at auction houses or even if I set up a table at a major show like National or Philly Grading seems to make economic sense. I do not like it But..

Love it or hate its become a necessary evil if you want to sell to the masses. As you say, grading eliminates many questions from potential buyers. The buyer either agrees with the TPG company assessment and buys the card or in a few cases, the buyer does not agree with the grade and doesn't buy the card. When it comes to high-priced HOFers, I personally want the card to be graded. If not then the seller better allow returns.

[jerseygary]

I only collect ungraded/slabbed cards. I'm old enough to tell for myself what grade a card is and like to handle cards like I've done since I was a kid. I was careful then and I'm careful now. Nothing looks nicer to me than a stack of '33 Goudey's sitting on my desk.

Personally I think the slabs are very ugly and the tags on the top look like a supermarket price tag. Maybe if the TPG's did a better design on top I would be less enthusiastic when I bust them out. About 5 years ago I did some work with GAI redesigning the top tags to make them more appealing but nothing ever came of it before they went under.

Perhaps I'd change my mind if I had a super high-grade Ruth or just collected for resale, but I just do it because I love the old cards.

[conor912]

I have a small handful of dealers I will buy raw from, otherwise I buy graded and free them. I decided long ago that holding a slabbed card in my hand, I was spending more time fixated on the flip than I was on the card and it was ruining my enjoyment of them. I cracked open everything I owned and am much happier for it.

[ZenPop]

Originally Posted by tedzan

This display tells you where I stand on this subject.

I just love to flip thru my albums of card sets contained within quality plastic pages. And for my high value cards,
I prefer high quality mylar, instead of hard plastic rectangles with arbitrary numbers that may not actually reflect
the card's grade.






TED Z
__________________________________________________ ______________________

LOOKING FOR these T206 guys to complete my AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 sub-set

AMES....CAMNITZ....CRAWFORD (bat)....DOYLE (port)....JORDAN (bat)....MARQUARD
McGRAW (port-cap).....McQUILLAN (bat).....TINKER (bat off).....WILTSE (port-cap)

That's awesome, Ted.

I have yet to acquire a graded card. I will bid on one, every once in a while... but I collect for the love the designs and the team and/or player. The "raw" ones are mostly more affordable and I usually don't spend a lot, so I'm guessing that there's a much less chance of fakes making their way into my collection. An odd scrawl or kid's name can actually add to the charm of the card. (not all the time, mind you... ha ha)

[Leon]

I have most of my more expensive cards graded. I like an impartial and experienced TPG looking at them to see if there was anything I missed. I only want altered cards if I know they are altered. No, of course TPG's aren't perfect, but they fit my needs perfectly. Also, since I don't collect high grade I very rarely worry about alterations in my collection. (of course there could be one or some but I am just not worried about it). I still have hundreds, if not thousands of raw cards.

And yes, Travis, we call cards that aren't professionally encased, raw.

[Theo_450]

Have you ever ridden a horse “barebacked”? Graded slabs are like a saddle. Sometimes you need a saddle, but barebacked really gets you in touch with the horse. Sorry if that is off color, but it is true.

[kmac32]

Originally Posted by Theo_450

Have you ever ridden a horse “barebacked”? Graded slabs are like a saddle. Sometimes you need a saddle, but barebacked really gets you in touch with the horse. Sorry if that is off color, but it is true.

Understand the horse analogy completely.

[jerseygary]

Living in Kentucky and coming from a long line of Polish cavalry officers, I concur with your equine analogy about raw cards!