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Old 11-19-2011, 05:51 PM
drumback drumback is offline
Mark Peavey
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Default M101-2 Sporting News supplement backs

I am trying to document information regarding the M101-2 Sporting News set, in particular, the various backs that exist. If anyone on the board has knowledge of other back variations, or other verified fronts with ads on the back, please let me know. Here is what I have been able to document so far:

M101-2 Sporting News backs

There are five known back variations for M101-2 Sporting News supplements.

The first back, issued sometime after the 1912 season, has the heading, “FREE! FREE!! FREE!!!” at the top. The publisher is offering 20 free pictures as incentive to subscribe to the Sporting News. Near the bottom, above the publisher’s name, is printed, “Additional pictures will cost five cents each.”

84 different supplements are listed as available on this back. The 16 NOT available include #1 Bresnahan, #3 Mathewson, #4 Cobb, #5 Lajoie, #8 Walsh, #10 Wagner, #35 Cobb/Wagner, #49 Cole, and all of the last eight in the series, #s 93-100. The first seven of these were extremely popular players, and were no doubt snatched up very quickly. The omission of Cole is a mystery, but very likely it was just an error, and he was meant to be included. Cole IS available on back #2.

The fact that #s 93-100 were not available is almost certainly due to the fact that they had not been printed yet. Therefore, this back was printed sometime after #92 Herrmann (issued 12-26-12) and prior to #93 Daubert (issued 10-23-13). Most likely, it was sent out in the mail to entice new subscribers during the 1913 season.

Confirmed fronts with the first back are limited to #87 Griffith and #88 Hauser.

The second back is very similar to the first in that it also has the heading “FREE! FREE!! FREE!!!” at the top. However, there are differences of note. On this back, the words “Additional pictures will cost five cents each” is no longer present. Also, the new subscriber is given the choice of 20 pictures for a one year subscription, or 90 pictures for a two year subscription.

93 different supplements are listed as available on back #2. The seven NOT available are #1 Bresnahan, #3 Mathewson, #4 Cobb, #5 Lajoie, #8 Walsh, #10 Wagner, and #35 Cobb/Wagner. Included for the first time are #s 93-100.

Since the last supplement, #100 Birmingham, is included and was issued on December 11, 1913, this back was most likely mailed to potential subscribers during the 1914 season.

Confirmed fronts with the second back include #55 Wallace and #84 Wood. There are also unconfirmed reports of #65 Schulte, #88 Hauser and a second of Wood.

The third back is quite different from the first two. At the top is the heading “DO YOU WANT seventy-five baseball action pictures free of all charges?” Significantly, the new subscriber no longer gets to choose which ones he wants, almost certainly an indication of an overall dwindling supply. Near the bottom, these 75 are referred to as “a complete set of 75”.
The number of popular subjects no longer available is increased to 16, and now includes #2 Young/Criger, #7 Chance, #9 Rucker, #11 Jennings, #17 The Pirates, #18 The Tigers, #38 Plank, #39 Johnson/Street, and #51 The Athletics.

This back can easily be tied to the year 1914 in that several players are now listed with their Federal League teams. 1915, the second and final year of the Federal League, can be probably be ruled out by the fact that Plank and Bender are still listed as playing for the Athletics - not St. Louis and Baltimore, respectively, where they played in 1915.

Confirmed fronts with the third back include #66 White, #76 Callahan (2), #79 Wheat, #83 Stahl and #84 Wood.

Thus, Hauser and Wood are the only players to be pictured with two different advertising backs.

The fourth back is printed in red and black and features a drastic change in design. No longer is the potential subscriber given a list of supplements available. Instead, he will receive “a set of 75 baseball pictures”, and a set of M101-3 postcards as well, plus a copy of the 1916 Sporting News Record Book. This back includes picture, printed in red, of the supplements featuring Carrigan, Lobert and Zimmerman.

Most likely, this back was mailed late 1915 or early 1916.

The fifth back, though printed in green, not red, is very similar to the fourth. The only notable change in content is that the new subscriber will now receive “a set of 70 baseball pictures”, not 75, as indicated on the fourth back.

Thus, the dwindling supply of supplements confirms this as the last back in the series, mailed to potential readers in 1916.

Finally, this chronology of distribution seems reasonable:

1. Back one distributed during the 1913 season.
2. Back two distributed during the 1914 season.
3. Back three, distributed later in 1914 to note Federal League players
4. Back four, distributed late 1915 and/or early 1916.
5. Back five, distributed during the 1916 season.
Attached Images
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Last edited by drumback; 11-19-2011 at 08:53 PM.
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  #2  
Old 11-19-2011, 07:33 PM
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tiger8mush tiger8mush is offline
Rob G.
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Awesome writeup Mark!

So a couple of remaining questions:

1) Which Supplements are possible with an ad-back? It seems like the ad-backed Supplements were of ones already issued that they must've had extras of. Since none were available of #1 Bresnahan, #3 Mathewson, #4 Cobb, #5 Lajoie, #8 Walsh, #10 Wagner, #35 Cobb/Wagner, and #49 Cole, we can probably assume they wouldn't have ad backs. #2 Young/Criger, #7 Chance, #9 Rucker, #11 Jennings, #17 The Pirates, #18 The Tigers, #38 Plank, #39 Johnson/Street, and #51 The Athletics, as you mention, weren't available by the 3rd ad-back so a guess may be that we may not find those either with ad backs since the supply may have already been low to begin with on those and they went fast. With #55 Wallace (printed 21-Dec-1910) being the earliest known with an ad back, there is probably a good chance that none predating this very much will surface.

2) Distribution method for the advertisements? So perhaps they took some of the Supplements, threw ads on the back, and included them in future issues of The Sporting News? Or put them on newsstands? One thing they all seem to have in common are the two vertical and two horizontal fold lines. Why would they have been folded in such a way? Perhaps they were included in some sporting product like ball gloves or baseballs?

3) Why is #49 Cole not available in the first ad-back release but it is available in the 2nd release?

Thanks again for the interesting writeup!
Rob
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  #3  
Old 11-20-2011, 09:12 AM
doug.goodman doug.goodman is offline
Doug Goodman
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Thank you for the info, and the hard work, very interesting.

I've been working on the set for years (96 down, 4 to go) but have never seen an ad back.

Doug
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  #4  
Old 11-21-2011, 09:06 AM
thegashousegang thegashousegang is offline
Jimmy M
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Default Nice job

I don't have anything to contribute, but great work so far. I'm about 40% into the set, and no ad-backs yet.

Doug, good luck in completing your set.
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  #5  
Old 11-23-2011, 06:00 PM
drumback drumback is offline
Mark Peavey
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Default M101-2

It seems reasonable to assume the double sized team supplements will not be found with ad backs, as the ad is the same size as the other 96.

With such a small sampling of ad backs, it's really not possible to draw any clear conclusions. I'm guessing, though, that since there doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to the players with ad backs, there are many other different front/back combinations to be found.

It would great to find out how they were distributed. Perhaps they were mailed? I wonder if the Sporting News has an archivist that could provide some answers. Seems like a long shot, but who knows?
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  #6  
Old 11-23-2011, 08:57 PM
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Runscott Runscott is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doug.goodman View Post
Thank you for the info, and the hard work, very interesting.

I've been working on the set for years (96 down, 4 to go) but have never seen an ad back.

Doug
Doug - excuse my ignorance, as I've never collected these, but why are the ad backs so tough to find (I assume, since you haven't seen any), given that they were issued for 1913? Is it because they weren't the normal ones included as supplements, but had to be ordered?

Which ones are you missing?

Just asking all these questions because I have some of these arriving in the mail some day and would like to understand the issue better.
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Old 11-23-2011, 10:10 PM
doug.goodman doug.goodman is offline
Doug Goodman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Runscott View Post
Doug - excuse my ignorance, as I've never collected these, but why are the ad backs so tough to find (I assume, since you haven't seen any), given that they were issued for 1913? Is it because they weren't the normal ones included as supplements, but had to be ordered?

Which ones are you missing?

Just asking all these questions because I have some of these arriving in the mail some day and would like to understand the issue better.
Everything I know about ad backs I learned in this forum, and most of that knowledge came from this thread.

I am missing the Cobb, Pittsburgh team and Detroit team from 1909, and the Cobb / Wagner from 1910.

I think all four of them might be listed on ebay right now in buy-it-nows for just short of the cost of my right arm.

Doug
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  #8  
Old 11-23-2011, 10:58 PM
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Runscott Runscott is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doug.goodman View Post
Everything I know about ad backs I learned in this forum, and most of that knowledge came from this thread.

I am missing the Cobb, Pittsburgh team and Detroit team from 1909, and the Cobb / Wagner from 1910.

I think all four of them might be listed on ebay right now in buy-it-nows for just short of the cost of my right arm.

Doug
Thanks Doug.

Last edited by Runscott; 11-23-2011 at 11:03 PM.
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  #9  
Old 01-01-2012, 01:01 PM
Danny Smith Danny Smith is offline
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Is there anywhere that lists exactly when each of the supplements in the set was issued? I have a couple blank backs.

Danny
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  #10  
Old 01-02-2012, 11:18 AM
doug.goodman doug.goodman is offline
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Each supplement has a date on it, here's the list :

1909-07-22 Roger Bresnahan, St. Louis
1909-07-29 Denton Young / Louis Criger
1909-08-05 Christopher Mathewson
1909-08-12 Tyrus Cobb
1909-08-19 Napoleon Lajoie
1909-08-26 Sherwood MaGee, Philadelphia
1909-09-02 Frank Chance
1909-09-09 Edward Walsh, Chicago (AL)
1909-09-16 Nap Rucker
1909-09-23 Honus Wagner
1909-09-30 Hugh Jennings
1909-10-07 Fred Clarke, Pittsburg
1909-10-14 Byron Bancroft Johnson, Pres. AL
1909-10-21 Charles Comiskey, Owner White Sox
1909-10-28 Edward Collins, Philadelphia
1909-11-04 James McAleer, Washington
1909-11-11 Pittsburgh Team
1909-11-18 Detroit Team
1909-11-25 George Bell, Brooklyn NL
1909-12-02 Tris Speaker, Boston
1909-12-09 Mordecai Brown
1909-12-16 Hal Chase, New York (AL)
1909-12-23 Thomas Leach
1909-12-30 Owen Bush, Detroit
1910-01-06 John Evers
1910-01-13 Harry Krause, Philadelphia
1910-01-20 Chas. B. Adams, Pittsburg
1910-01-27 Addie Joss
1910-02-03 Orval Overall
1910-02-10 Samuel Crawford
1910-02-17 Fred Merkle, New York (NL)
1910-02-24 George Mullin, Detroit
1910-03-03 Edward Konetchy, St. Louis
1910-03-10 George Gibson / Arthur Raymond
1910-03-17 Ty Cobb / Hans Wagner
1910-03-24 Connie Mack
1910-03-31 Evans, O’Loughlin, AL; Klem, Johnstone, NL
1910-04-07 Edward Plank, Philadelphia
1910-09-01 Walter Johnson / Charles Street
1910-09-08 John Kling
1910-09-15 Frank Baker, Athletics
1910-09-22 Charles Dooin
1910-09-29 Wm. F. Carrigan, Boston
1910-10-06 John McLean, Cincinnati
1910-10-13 John Coombs, Philadelphia
1910-10-20 Joe Tinker
1910-10-27 John Taylor, Owner, Boston
1910-11-03 Russell Ford, New York (AL)
1910-11-10 Leonard Cole, Chicago (NL)
1910-11-17 Harry Lord, Chicago White Sox
1910-11-24 Philadelphia American Team
1910-12-01 Chicago National Team
1910-12-08 Charles Bender, Philadelphia
1910-12-15 Arthur Hofman, Chicago (AL)
1910-12-21 Bobby Wallace, St. Louis
1910-12-28 John J McGraw
1911-01-05 Harry Davis, Philadelphia
1911-01-12 James Archer, Chicago (NL)
1911-01-19 Ira Thomas, Philadelphia
1911-01-26 Robert Byrnes, Pittsburg
1911-02-02 Clyde Milan
1911-02-09 John Meyer, New York (NL)
1911-02-16 Roger Bescher, Cincinnati
1911-02-23 John Barry, Philadelphia
1911-03-02 Frank Schulte
1911-03-09 Harris White, Chicago (AL)
1911-03-16 Lawrence Doyle, New York (NL)
1911-03-23 Joe Jackson
1911-10-26 Martin O'Toole / William Kelly
1911-11-02 Vean Gregg
1911-11-09 Richard Marquard
1911-11-16 John McInnis, Athletics
1911-11-23 Grover C Alexander
1911-11-30 Del Gainer
1911-12-07 Fred Snodgrass, New York (NL)
1911-12-14 James Callahan, Chicago (AL)
1911-12-21 Robert Harmon, St. Louis
1911-12-28 George Stovall, Cleveland
1912-01-04 Zack Wheat
1912-01-11 Frank Bodie
1912-10-10 Boston American Team, AL Champions
1912-10-17 New York National Team
1912-10-24 Jake Stahl, Mgr., Boston
1912-10-31 Joe Wood, Boston
1912-11-07 Charles Wagner
1912-11-14 Lew Ritchie
1912-11-21 Clark Giffith
1912-11-28 Arnold Hauser
1912-12-05 Charles Herzog
1912-12-12 Jas. Lavender, Chicago (NL)
1912-12-19 Jeff Tesreau, New York (NL)
1912-12-26 August Herrmann, Owner Cincinnati
1913-10-23 Jake Daubert
1913-10-30 Heinie Zimmerman
1913-11-06 Ray Schalk
1913-11-13 Hans Lobert
1913-11-20 Albert Demaree
1913-11-27 Arthur Fletcher
1913-12-04 Charles Somers
1913-12-11 Joe Birmingham

Last edited by doug.goodman; 01-02-2012 at 11:18 AM.
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