Joe Doyle N.Y. NAT'L and it's 11 "cousins"......PART 2

[steve B]

That's pretty interesting.

Certainly something to think about.

The repair done on the Doyle from all indications was simply stoning off the unwanted "Natl". I think the cards showing remnants of the N are solid evidence of that being done. The alternative would be remaking the entire stone for that color.

But that also means that we'll probably never know. The repair would have been done early, and there are enough regular Doyles that any that were intended to be that early would get lost in the crowd.

It's possible they caught it, made the correction and finished the sheets already started intending to carry over the other 11 into the 350 series. The couple populations I looked at for epdg are really close, so maybe.

Then the corrected version got put onto another sheet that didn't include the other 11 because the lead time pushed production back enough that the other 11 guys were already out of the 350s

Food for thought, we'd know more if we could get a population on the ones showing a partial repair. Not much more since we don't know how many positions had the partial repair, but a bit more.

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by steve B

That's pretty interesting.


Food for thought, we'd know more if we could get a population on the ones showing a partial repair. Not much more since we don't know how many positions had the partial repair, but a bit more.

Steve I ran a Net54 survey on the Joe Doyle printer's mark some years ago. The "poor man's" Joe Doyle error card (as I have coined it) appears approx. 7 % of the sampled cards.
Sample size was approx. 200+ cards......I think. I'll try and find this thread and post it here.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.

[steve B]

That's good enough for me, 7% is consistent with one position on a sheet roughly 14 cards tall. (12 is only around 8%, so a pretty wide range of other sizes work too.) So it makes sense if they missed a bit on one location while doing the repair.

[Bpm0014]

The repair done on the Doyle from all indications was simply stoning off the unwanted "Natl". I think the cards showing remnants of the N are solid evidence of that being done.

Is there a premium on these cards? I have a Doyle with a pretty neat portion of the NY Nat'l. Actually just a piece of the first N. But really neat....

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by steve B

That's good enough for me, 7% is consistent with one position on a sheet roughly 14 cards tall. (12 is only around 8%, so a pretty wide range of other sizes work too.) So it makes sense if they missed a bit on one location while doing the repair.

Hey Steve

My records indicate 16 cards of Joe Doyle with printer's mark from a survey of 204 samples.....resulting in 7.9 %.



............................................l..... .................................................. ..............…....l Printer's Mark




TED Z

T206 Reference
.

[Jantz]

Ted,

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the Doyle Nat'L (on the left) that you posted a fake?

Jantz

[tedzan]

Hi Jantz

You are correct, it is a re-print. I'm searching to find my scan of the real Doyle Nat'L card I had in Photobucket.
But, as you know Photobucket is now useless. So, for comparison's sake I posted this one.
When I find my real Joe Doyle scan, I will replace this reprint.

Anyhow, for now it serves the purpose of this display.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.

[tedzan]

OK Jantz....I found my scan of the real Joe Doyle Nat'L card, and I have replaced the re-printed one in the above post.


TED Z

T206 Reference
.

[tedzan]

Originally Posted by tedzan

Hey Steve

My records indicate 16 cards of Joe Doyle with printer's mark from a survey of 204 samples.....resulting in 7.9 %.



.............................................^.... .................................................. .........................^ Printer's Mark




TED Z

T206 Reference
.

Hi Brendan

Depicted here is my "poor man's" Joe Doyle error card. All 16 of these Doyle's that I have seen with this Printer's Mark look exactly like this one.
So, I'm curious if your card is similar to this one, or does your card show more of the lower left of the "N" ?

Anyhow, that tiny remnant mark is approx. 1/70th of the Nat'L lettering. So, given a typical value of 70,000 for a real Joe Doyle error card, then
pro-rating this Mark's influence on this Joe Doyle card results in a value of approx. 1000


TED Z

T206 Reference
.

[Bpm0014]

Thanks fellas! I'll send a scan as soon as I get home. It's definitely noticeable...

[Bpm0014]

Pic 1 (on right)

[Pat R]

Originally Posted by steve B

That's pretty interesting.

Certainly something to think about.

The repair done on the Doyle from all indications was simply stoning off the unwanted "Natl". I think the cards showing remnants of the N are solid evidence of that being done. The alternative would be remaking the entire stone for that color.

But that also means that we'll probably never know. The repair would have been done early, and there are enough regular Doyles that any that were intended to be that early would get lost in the crowd.

It's possible they caught it, made the correction and finished the sheets already started intending to carry over the other 11 into the 350 series. The couple populations I looked at for epdg are really close, so maybe.

Then the corrected version got put onto another sheet that didn't include the other 11 because the lead time pushed production back enough that the other 11 guys were already out of the 350s

Food for thought, we'd know more if we could get a population on the ones showing a partial repair. Not much more since we don't know how many positions had the partial repair, but a bit more.

There is a flaw on both that shows that they used the same sheet after they
removed the NAT'L.

Doyle NY Nat'L.jpg
Doyle NY Nat'L Back.jpg
Doyle.jpg

[Luke]

The Georgia connection is really cool. But the Doyle wouldn't have been on the same sheet as the Elite 11 guys. It's also very unlikely that the 11 were ever side-by-side on a sheet (because we know they weren't side-by-side on Piedmont 150 sheets).