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  #1  
Old 09-25-2011, 11:03 AM
Cardboard Junkie Cardboard Junkie is offline
David Pierson
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Default Question About 52 Topps Printing.

Hey mates! Aloha! My question is.....how were the backs of 52 topps printed? Was it one plate for the red ink and another for the black? How would it be physically possible to print a black star over a red star on the famous Campos card. Would TGP be able to tell if a small black star were stamped on top of a normal red star campos? Once I saw a Campos with a black over red star on the left star not the right? WTF? Please explain. Thanks.
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  #2  
Old 09-25-2011, 12:09 PM
Brianruns10 Brianruns10 is offline
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Yes, two separate plates. If you compare several of the same card, it is possible to slight variances in the alignment, especially the stitches on the baseball which can be a bit all over the place!

The Campos especially, if you compare different examples on ebay and google images, you can make out some where the two layers didn't quite line up, and the correct red star is slightly visible beneath the black overlay.

As for how this occurred, there is a lot of speculation, and I cannot offer much more than that, being not too knowledgeable on the actual process of printing these cards. I think it is safe to say that somehow, on the plate for the black devices, a star was inadvertently added, leading to the black overlay. It would make sense, then, that there are so few Campos black stars...an error like that, I think, would've been caught fairly quickly. A black star where there shouldn't have been any would've probably leaped out on a spot check, and the error would've been corrected.
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  #3  
Old 09-25-2011, 02:43 PM
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David Pierson
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Default interesting

good hypothosis but i don't think there was much checking done at any level. For example the glaring error of the sain/page cards was easily spotted, and probably brought to topps attention by the players. However the Zernial #31 position is listed as "ontfield" on all versions black (both printings) and red back.(Also the newly discover house yellow tiger error was never caught) I just suspect that under extreme microscopic and scientific examination that the black star Campos's might all be faked? Just thinking out loud. dave.
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  #4  
Old 09-25-2011, 04:28 PM
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Al Richter
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Default Campos

If it was faked, or could easily be faked, I wonder why there are not a lot more of them. On the House, there do not seem to be many of these either, do you think it was an initial error that was corrected, or a later error/print defect that was corrected. In any even, I am glad I have both of them already. I also have the Campos were the upper left front border, top and side, are missing. That was discussed in SCD not long back. It may be more scarce than the black star

It is interesting the Zernial was never fixed, maybe people were too transfixed by those balls
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  #5  
Old 09-26-2011, 09:38 PM
Volod Volod is offline
Steve
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Not having given these anomalies much thought, I hope this isn't an irrelevant or naive question, but I wonder if any uncut sheets of 1952 Topps surfaced over the years that happened to include the Campos card. That is, if such a sheet contained a Campos with any of the errors, it would seem extremely strange indeed that no other cards on the sheet were printed with the same error.
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  #6  
Old 09-27-2011, 06:19 PM
Brianruns10 Brianruns10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Volod View Post
That is, if such a sheet contained a Campos with any of the errors, it would seem extremely strange indeed that no other cards on the sheet were printed with the same error.
I think it makes perfect sense it would only happen on the Campos. After all, that's the nature of an error: a one time thing, a mistake that made it past initial quality control. If there was more than one instance, than it would suggest intent, which would be very odd.

As is, I think it's a matter of when they were creating the printing plate, the star device from the red layer somehow made it onto the black as well. I'm not sure how...I'll leave that to someone who knows more about the whole printing process.
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  #7  
Old 09-28-2011, 05:58 AM
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Dave.Horn.ish
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brianruns10 View Post
I think it makes perfect sense it would only happen on the Campos. After all, that's the nature of an error: a one time thing, a mistake that made it past initial quality control. If there was more than one instance, than it would suggest intent, which would be very odd.

As is, I think it's a matter of when they were creating the printing plate, the star device from the red layer somehow made it onto the black as well. I'm not sure how...I'll leave that to someone who knows more about the whole printing process.

Masking error?
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  #8  
Old 09-29-2011, 10:36 AM
steve B steve B is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toppcat View Post
Masking error?
Most likely.

There would be original art, probably a pasteup for the whole sheet.
That would have been photographed by a very large camera that made a sheet size negative.
Then opaque paper would be used to make a mask to block out the parts not desired in a particular color.
Those would be used to expose the plates.

So if the mask was torn a bit or made wrong, the star would have been exposed and the plate would print a black star.

Repairing that error would be as simple as applying a bit of opaque tape over the star, or taping down the torn bit. It could even be corrected directly on the plate with a special limestone crayon.

Correcting the Zernial woud require at the least a small portion of new original art, a new negative -Either complete or a small piece spliced in, a new mask if it wasn't spliced, and a new plate. Lots of work.

Steve B
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  #9  
Old 09-29-2011, 11:01 AM
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Al Richter
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Default Printing Info

Thanks for the input Steve
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  #10  
Old 02-26-2012, 08:28 PM
Republicaninmass Republicaninmass is offline
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Default Somthin strange

Just found this Campos, where the top left of the star is black, I might be able to get a tighter scan, but it is definately there




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Last edited by Republicaninmass; 02-26-2012 at 08:28 PM.
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