41 Goudeys - What am I missing?

[steve B]

I'm pretty amazed at what a few of these brought.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1941-GOUDEY-...item588f7bab0e

$212.49 It's a common isn't it? Not a single print. And only vg-ex.
And that's not the only one. Of the nine he had listed 5 of them went for over $170 and one was 280.

Pretty strong prices, The other 4 were all under 100 and 3 under 50. 40-50 seems a bit more normal.

So what have I missed? two people working on registry sets?

Steve B

[philliesphan]

I no longer remember the intricacies of this set, Steve, I do think that there may be a [small] handful of folks putting together Master Color 1941 Goudey sets. And, in that regard, there may be "commons" that may be extra ordinarily tough in one of the four colors.

Much akin to E94 collecting, perhaps, with regard to background colors and master sets.

[deadballera]

some colors are tougher to find

the cardboard with this issue was easily damaged...finding cards in higher grades are difficult.

[Exhibitman]

Bid pattern. Two bidders butting heads with snipes drove it from $50 up to its close. Must have needed them for sets. The 'loser' this time may well end up with the next one at a fraction of the final price here.

[steve B]

Interesting. I hadn't heard that some colors are tougher. Like most sets I've been wandering my way towards completing it. Maybe it;s tougher than I'd thought.

Steve B

[GrayGhost]

this is one of the ugliest sets, but I do have ONE card for my type collection. Quality control person was layed off and went to work for PLayball that year, where he then lost his job when they stopped making cards too.

[ValKehl]

I really don't know anything re the 1941 Goudeys. Is one particular color reckoned to be the toughest for most players? For my type collection, I have been looking for a decent George Case card in red, as I have had Case in the other 3 colors for some time. Is red usually the toughest color? I have seen more green Cases than any other color.
Val

[Griffins]

Some of the cards that aren't listed as short prints are a lot tougher than the listed short prints.
I was the underbidder on one card I needed- one of the last 2 I need. Should've been a $30 card, my snipe of $178 was topped. I know a few other people that needed a few of the other cards and that certainly must've helped drive the bidding.
Right now you probably have 5 or 6 people working on the set in all 4 colors and Crouch, Coffman and a few others are on a bunch of wantlists.

Val, red backgrounds are by far the toughest, with blues a distant 2nd. Yellows and greens are pretty equal as the easiest.
The shortprints are tough, but as I stated above some of the others in the last 6 or 7 cards of the set (excluding #33, Mel Ott) are arguably tougher than the short prints.

[Big Ben]

Just an fyi....

Not sure about the prices realized for these cards, but I looked them up in a 2009 Beckett Almanac and found the following about 1941 Goudey.

"Cards 21-25 are especially scare in relation to the rest of the set. In fact, the eight hardest to find cards in the set are, in order, 22, 24, 23, 25, 21, 27, 29, and 32."

[Griffins]

I'd put #32 Coffman tougher than any of the "short prints".

[FrankWakefield]

The 41 Goudeys are sleepers. Folks after old cards gather the white border tobacco cards, the 33 Goudeys, then they look at E90-1s, gold borders, 34 Goudeys, brown borders, Diamond Stars, DeLongs... 41 Goudeys are way down on the list. Many don't collect any, a few collect one as a type card. Eventually, some collectors move on to 41 Goudeys and try to gather more than one.

Some of those players are only on a few cards, that drives them a bit.

I was outbid on this one. I gave Mr. Crouch's daughter one I had, sold her two more, and now I have none. I thought I'd be able to replace at least one, but I haven't. And the cards I sold her were for MUCH less than this card brought.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/380364366759...84.m1435.l2649

I may well not ever get a replacement 41 Goudey of Bill Crouch.

[BleedinBlue]

I was the winner of the two Coffman's and the underbidder on the Crouch. I had actually bid much, much higher on the two Coffman's and would have gone higher on the Crouch if the three cards weren't closing all at the same time. Dang budget. Do a quick poll and you will find these two cards are on just about every wantlist for the 1941 Goudey set, regardless of color. Add the color variations and a Red Crouch and a Red Coffman are tough, tough cards. I've spent 10 years on this set and have only seen 3 Red Coffman's. I know of a fourth but so far that's it. I'm sure there are many more out there but the lack of collecting interest in this set doesn't drive people to put them out there on the market.

I realize this is a dog of a set but try to put one together sometime. I bet you can get to 30 cards without much trouble. After that it can be a long, long journey to 33.

Anthony,

I finished up my master set earlier this year and have decided to put together a second master set. What the heck, I was only 20 cards away from a second set. Anyway, I was looking at that Blue Garms and was thinking of you. I was stunned where that one closed out but that is another tough card to find. I know of one other master set and that was the last card that collector needed to finish his up.

Brian

[steve B]

Thanks guys, that's great to know.

I'm about 1/3 of the way to a set, and way short of a master set.
I do have more red ones, so that's good.

Of the last few cards in the set, I pretty much have whatever isn't on the Beckett list except forthe Ott. Looks like this one will be a bigger challenge than I'd thought.

Steve B

[WWGjohn]

I would echo what others have said. I was stuck on the Crouch card for 2 years and I only built a basic set. That card is definitely one of the toughest cards in the set and it almost never shows up on Ebay. If you live far away from shows as I do this set can be a real pain to complete. My hat's off to any who have put together a master set.

John

[D. Bergin]

I always wondered about this set. What's with the odd border cuts?

I see these number graded all the time in holders, but the borders always seem horrifically hand-cut.

Strip cards with the same type of cuts would never get any better then an "A", but I see "5's" all the time that look like a grade schooler trimmed them out of a poster.

[Leon]

Great thread guys. Once again this is what the board is all about, collaboration and helping one another with vintage card information. Just think if Burdick and his peers had the internet?

As far as weird border cuts. What are ya'll talking about?

[barrysloate]

Don't I recognize that photo of Babe Young from the 1949 Bowman set? Or is my memory shot?

[alanu]

I really like the Mel Ott from this issue, in the '33 goudeys he looks like someone just kicked his dog

[tbob]

Originally Posted by philliesphan

I no longer remember the intricacies of this set, Steve, I do think that there may be a [small] handful of folks putting together Master Color 1941 Goudey sets. And, in that regard, there may be "commons" that may be extra ordinarily tough in one of the four colors.

Much akin to E94 collecting, perhaps, with regard to background colors and master sets.

Good Lord, I hope there aren't color/player combos in that set which are as rare as some of those in the E94 masters et. I have been pulling my hair out for years over some of those

[GrayGhost]

http://thevintagesportscards.blogspo...41-goudey.html

Good piece on the set. I can't believe those were issued one to a pack w gum w such HIDEOUS quality control.

[BleedinBlue]

This is a tough master set to complete. Given the scarcity of the cards in the first place, combined with the known and unknown short prints plus the uneven color distribution makes certain player/color combinations very difficult. But it can be done given patience and funding. Goudey's lack of quality control adds another element to the chase as you try to pursue cards which are presentable. I've finished the task of building a master set. Now I'm trying to upgrade the ones I have to collect a presentable set of cards.

Originally Posted by tbob

Good Lord, I hope there aren't color/player combos in that set which are as rare as some of those in the E94 masters et. I have been pulling my hair out for years over some of those

[spec]

Is it possible that collector preference and focus have skewed the color availability of 1941 Goudeys over the past decade or so? My set, assembled 10-20 years ago with no attention paid to color, includes 12 red, 9 yellow, 6 blue and 6 green. My duplicates, mostly shabby and not including the Crouch needed by a previous poster, tend to balance those numbers, suggesting I encountered a rather normal distribution of colors back in the day. I do recall that Joe Sullivan was by far the toughest for me to find.

[Griffins]

Spec- I'm not so sure. Most of my (near) master set was assembled by buying numerous entire 33 card mixed color sets, taking what cards I needed, and assembling the dupes into another set for sale. Inevitably the set I would pick up would contain very few reds, a few more blues, and a large balance of greens and yellows. Given that these sets were often the only '41 Goudeys the seller had, I think it would be a strong indicator of which color is easier and which toughe.
A few years ago Brian C and I talked PSA into including the color on the flip in order to have it in the pop report. Hopefully over time some sort of trend would develop to help corroborate the relative scarcity of each color.

[steve B]

It's interesting about the red, I have almost as many red ones as all the others combined. I haven't been deliberately looking for them either.

Of course, my collection is odd. I have more 41s than 33s or 34s.


Steve B

[fkw]

Has anyone ever tried to complete the set with the extremely miscut "Name at Top" cards???