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#51
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Again, there is nothing here that at all that rises to the indiscretions that Will has engaged in with this hobby.
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#52
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Let’s say it is unaltered, just for giggles. As far as I am aware Morris never admits any card he sells is altered at all - he grades it and puts “minimum size” next to his grade range. Where is that? Again, not a single person has claimed or implied Morris and Jaimet have risen to the same level of indiscretion. What was actually said, is that this policy being argued by a previous poster who has left the conversation now is 100% exactly the same as the Jaimet standard of disclosure we were all having a good laugh over. That a seller need not disclose alteration if they refund a buyer who catches it and complains. People seem to find the exact same standard reasonable and unreasonable based on who they are used to benefit. Last edited by G1911; 02-16-2023 at 11:55 AM. |
#53
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Al, too true, and I felt like such a jerk after all my bellowing.
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#54
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Seems to me that between the Ebay review and the Seller's agreement to refund if buyer is unhappy (as in no need to prove it was trimmed) there is adequate protection. Combined with my confidence in this seller generally, I would not have a problem bidding, nor would I consider his opinion that the card is untrimmed to be some sort of attempt to cheat me. EDITED TO ADD: Maybe Ted Z. can chime in, since he collects these from back when they were issued.
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If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other. - Ulysses S. Grant, military commander, 18th US President. Last edited by nolemmings; 02-16-2023 at 01:01 PM. |
#55
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So after all this discussion on this card, the basic gripe is that someone that works for him marked the card as "LOW GRADE" instead of "FILLER". If you read through their Ebay disclosure on how they grade cards, that seems to be the only issue with this card. Had it been marked "FILLER" it is covered under their description. I don't collect this issue, so I have no idea if it is trimmed, factory mis-cut or just fine, I also don't have the card in hand so I'm not going to make any determination if someone trimmed it.
When I was set building I purchased a lot of cards from Greg Morris Cards, and yes, I got some trimmed one's and there were no questions asked when I returned them. I also purchased a lot of cards on the BST area of this board in large lots and I ran into a trimmed card every now and then, it's part of the hobby and has been for over 40 years. Trimmed cards aren't going away, one just needs to accept the fact that you're going to own some at some point, especially if you want to collect high grade vintage. The nice thing is a lot of these trimmed cards are sold "raw" today because TPG's have gotten better at catching some of them over the years. As for GM Cards to be paying people to constantly be making changes to listings at the whims of everyone that wants to make a comment about their cards, I would ignore it too as a business owner. They are running a business that is good at getting large volumes of raw cards listed on a weekly basis and available to collectors. I would prefer that his employees are listing cards not making corrections to listing titles instead, and I'm sure in order to continue their business their employees need to be listing cards. If you think the card is trimmed, simply don't buy it and move on to the next one. I would much rather take my chances with a seller like GM Cards who will return the trimmed card than the hoard of sellers on Ebay that are selling trimmed cards in TPG holders and tell you to "Pound Sand" when you try to return it because it was graded by PSA or SGC. |
#56
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So threads like this bother me. I agree with many of the posters that GM's standards have dipped recently. I hope these problems are temporary and plans are in process to fix the issues. I agree with G1911 and others that the Will Jaimet business model is not a good solution, and not one that GM should be satisfied with. |
#57
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#58
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Caveat Emptor is the motto we stand behind...
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Trying to wrap up my master mays set, with just a few left: 1968 American Oil left side 1971 Bazooka numbered complete panel |
#59
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I am not Greg Morris Cards' lawyer but he does apparently list cards as altered (in the title) as well as disclosing other material info about a card. To know this one simply has to look at any of his listings and see the FAQ where he details these disclosures. I cannot speak to this particular card as to why it was not stated it is small or trimmed, assuming that it is. I suspect the person answering questions on eBay is not the same person who has the authority to amend listings. Maybe they took it upon themselves to not raise the issue with someone who might have amended the listing. I guess I am not as black and white as you. In this case, right or wrong, if I am not comfortable with this card I am not bidding regardless of the return privilege or what I have been told. Again, call me stupid, stubborn or but I really do not see the Jaimet comparison as applicable given the circumstances in their history in the hobby which exist for these two sellers. Jaimet is a sole proprietor with a horrible reputation and is entirely untrustworthy. GMC is a company who has a terrific reputation who has always stood behind what they sell. That you see their responses are the same or similar is taking this out of context at least how I judge situations where I might not agree with how something was handled.
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( h @ $ e A n + l e y |
#60
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GMC’s terrific reputation, your bidding practices, anybody’s stupidity or stubbornness, your opinion that a card cannot be called trimmed without before and after photos (I have never seen this as a standard before - I guess I don’t need to disclose a trimmed card since I don’t have B&A’s of trimmed cards I own), are very different points and topics from the claim actually made. You are arguing statements the transcript shows were not ever made. |
#61
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Looks like they ended the auction.
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#62
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Ended because of this thread most likely
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
#63
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It's happened to us all, some more than once.
Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk |
#64
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That makes sense. The card would have failed the authentication process, so this saves time and effort of the potential buyer, ebay, CSG and GM themselves.
Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk |
#65
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I sent a follow-up email with a link to JollyElm's gift above (great job by the way) and an hour later GM took down the listing.
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Actively building a 1953 Bowman Color PSA Registry Set (Currently 150/160) and attempting a 1947 Tip Top Bread Set. |
#66
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I am very interested in a 47 Tip Top Spahn so I was watching the auction closely. When I went to set my snipe, I just wasn't comfortable with the card. Looked far too narrow. I trust my first impression when it comes to the overall look of a card and this one just does not look right. There is also a real problem with reprints; apparently, some very good ones have been made. They are easily caught in hand if you have experience with the set, not so much online. The good reprints I've seen are narrower, probably to conceal the lines that would be on the edges from the reshoot of the original.
I think a card like this has to be in a slab if you are going to sell it online. I cannot do my due diligence as a buyer if I cannot examine the card from all angles in-person, check the stock, etc. That's where the TPGs come in handy. I know they miss stuff, but they also catch a lot of stuff. If the card makes it into a slab the odds of my getting a reprint or an altered card are much lower.
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Read my blog; it will make all your dreams come true. https://adamstevenwarshaw.substack.com/ Or not... Last edited by Exhibitman; 02-17-2023 at 08:26 AM. |
#67
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#68
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The surely properly listed and disclosed Clemente “auto” has also been pulled as well, it appears.
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#69
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Wait, every questionable card 'outed' here on net54 is suddenly being taken down?? Gentlemen, I do declare that GM has a mole in our ranks!!!!!!!!!!!
__________________
All the cool kids love my YouTube Channel:
Elm's Adventures in Cardboard Land https://www.youtube.com/@TheJollyElm Looking to trade? Here's my bucket: https://www.flickr.com/photos/152396...57685904801706 “I was such a dangerous hitter I even got intentional walks during batting practice.” Casey Stengel Spelling "Yastrzemski" correctly without needing to look it up since the 1980s. Overpaying yesterday is simply underpaying tomorrow. |
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