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T206 REFERENCE...... the "poor man's" T206 Joe Doyle "Nat'L" card
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http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...C150x30xxz.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ohnson208x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...t150x12xxx.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign150x11.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...yab350x19x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ITxSGC30xx.jpg ....Sweet Caporal ...... Sovereign ......... Piedmont_____The "House" that created these Tobacco cards_____ Sovereign…. American Beauty .…. UZIT [/B]This thread will provide references to major contributions posted on Net54 these past 14 years that have formed a better understanding of "The Monster" [as Bill Heitman so aptly coined his T206 book (circa 1980)]. Let's start with the 2005-2006 publication of Scot Reader's Inside T206 An excellent, very informative, and well written book that inspired many of us Net54ers to post our experiences and theory's regarding the complexities of the T206 series. One of the early and very significant T206 threads was posted in June 2006 by Barry Arnold, titled T206 EPDG- - - how rare in your collection ? This thread sparked lots of brainstorming among Net54ers regarding T206's. It included surveys; and, various aspects of the T206 series were explored.....resulting in 363 meaningful posts. Furthermore, between many of us Net54ers, this thread was...."the beginning of a beautiful friendship" (to quote Humphrey Bogart in Casablanca). In the Summer of 2006, Bill Brown posted his T206 Super-Set (excel) spreadsheet. Bill received 1000's of inputs from Net54ers for this spreadsheet. It was a great start in the pursuit of what a T206 "master" set would be comprised of....T206 Super-Set Sept 2007, I started a thread titled Joe Doyle NAT'L and it's 11 "cousins"....SURVEY to explore certain PIEDMONT 350 cards that I considered as rare as the Joe Doyle "error" card. I eventually referred to these particular T206's as the Elite 11 Subsequent posts in this thread will expand on theory's regarding the structure of the T206 series and the front/back permutations that have resulted. A fair number of the theory's presented on Net54 (since 2006) have withstood the test of time. Providing accurate lists of which front/back combos were printed. And, which ones are No-Prints. So, stay tuned......many more T206 "oldies but goodies" References and Reflections will be posted here. And, feel free to contribute any meaningful T206 stories, or experiences collecting T206's that you have. __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ___________________________________ INDEX Post #1......Introduction....plus Scot Reader's " Inside T206 " book, and 3 significant T206 threads (circa..2006) for starters. Set your user settings to display 50 posts per Page. Then click on the topic of interest, then scan page for Post # noted. Post #2......The beginning of the six "Super-Prints" Post #4......SOVEREIGN phantom "350/460" series (apple green cards) Post #5......350/460 series backs identified Post #8......350/460 series mutually-exclusive cards Post #22.....T206 Plank mystery Post #25.....T206 DRUM's...."A-B-C-D" connection Post #26.....A-B-C-D connection expanded Post #28.....1910 COUPON (T213-1) sub-set Post #30.....Ty Cobb / Ty Cobb back Post #31.....T206 Checklists....plus 1910 COUPON, T215-1 and Ty Cobb/Ty Cobb Posts #33 & 34.....Richard Russell's unique T206 collection Posts #35 - 36 & 38.....Exclusive 12 group (460-only series) Post #39.....AMERICAN BEAUTY 350 No Frame subjects = DRUM subjects Posts #44 & 48.....Collecting T206 sets....tell us your story's Post #54.....T206 all-PIEDMONT set Post #65......SOVEREIGN set story Post #69......SWEET CAPORAL, Factory #30 set story Posts #72 & 74......AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 adventure Posts #76 - 77......T206 cards RE-FRONTED (or re-backed)....FAKE's ! Post #93.....T206 "Proofs" Post #96.....UZIT checklist Post #97.....Spring of 1911....T206 era ends....the start of the "Golden era" begins Post #98.....ATC Factory's associated with the White-Bordered cards (1909 - 1911) Posts #101 & 106.....BROAD LEAF 460 checklist Post #107.....Hobby greats....Frank Nagy and Bill Heitman Post #108.....CAROLINA BRIGHTS checklist Post #124.....PIEDMONT 460, Factory #42 checklist Posts #128 - 131.....Why are Connie Mack, Jack Coombs, Shoeless Joe Jackson, Smoky Joe Wood missing in the T206 set ? Posts #134 & 138.....Timeline of the T206 POLAR BEAR cards Post #144.....T206 OLD MILL (Major League series) cards Post #146..... T206 OLD MILL Southern League cards Post #161.....Southern League cards (continued) Post #162.....T206 Southern Leaguers Brown OLD MILL cards Post #171.....The mysterious T206 brown LENOX cards Post #181.....SWEET CAPORAL 460, Factory #30 backs (w/o Factory #42 overprint) Post #190.....El Principe de Gales T206 cards Post #196.....SWEET CAPORAL 350-460, Factory #42 overprint cards Post #198.....Regional source of the Elite 11 cards Posts #201 >> 227.....Show-n-tell us of your favorite T206's Posts #231 >> 248.....Show-n-tell us of your T206 Run(s) Posts #263 >> 276.....T206 color printing errors......let's see some of these interesting T206's Posts #282 >> 294.....The mysterious nature of the Red HINDU cards Posts #302 >> 316.....Show-n-tell us of your MAGIE cards Posts #328 >> 333.....T206 150-only subjects...... Posts #334 >> 346.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206 Posts #353 >> 358.....PIEDMONT set structure & checklist Posts #360 >> 366.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206 Post #368.....Reminiscing about T206's in 2005 Post #378.....Remembering Jantz Morey Posts #379 >> 385.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206 Posts #386 >> 402.....T206 printed sheet structure Posts #405 >> 440.....Show us your BROAD LEAF 350 cards Posts #441 >> 450.....Comparable printing patterns of the T206's and T205's Posts #453 >> 467.....Guess the price of a near complete T206 set Posts #469 >> 470.....Guess the selling price of a COMPLETE SOVEREIGN set Posts #471 >> 474.....Guess selling price of a near complete PIEDMONT set Posts #476 >> 479.....Guess selling price of a complete SWEET CAP, F#30 set Posts #481 >> 515.....Show-n-Tell us of your T206 "finds" Posts #516 >> 536....."Bang the DRUM Slowly" while showing us your DRUM cards Posts #537 >> 551.....Guess how many Demmitt & O'Hara St Louis cards exist ? Posts #553 >> 554.....FYI: T206 rosters of the 16 Major League teams Posts #561 >> 570.....FYI: T206 rosters of the 16 Major League teams Posts #571 >> 572.....FYI: 350 Series Minor Leaguer's checklist and trivia Posts #573 >> 573.....T206 Southern League cards illustrated Posts #574 >> 579.....T206 "Monster" obsession ? ....Check-out this one ! Posts #580 >> 597.....Do the T215-1 cards belong in the T206 set ? Posts #598 >> 600.....Any guesses why no CHESTERFIELD or LUCKY STRIKE T-cards ? Posts #601 >> 603.....Any guesses why no CHESTERFIELD or LUCKY STRIKE T-cards ? Posts #605 >> 621.....the TOLSTOI story Posts #622 >> 623.....Meet me at Philly, we can Talk T206's Posts #624 >> 635.....CYCLE 460 checklist Posts #636 >> 650.....The "MONSTER" Master Set achievement Posts #651 >> 664.....The "MONSTER" Master Set achievement Posts #665 >> 669.....UPGRADING T206 cards Posts #671 >> 674.....And then, there are times to down-grade your T206's Posts #675 >> 692.....Black LENOX checklist Posts #693 >> 697.....Check-out Jamie B's multi-brand T206 card Posts #698 >> 700.....Revisting the mysterious Ty Cobb card with TY COBB back Posts #701 >> 713.....Reprising the Ty Cobb / TY COBB card debate Posts #714 >> 726.....CYCLE 350 checklist..... where have all the CYCLE 350 cards gone ? Posts #727 >> 741.....the enigmatic Lajoie (with bat)..... Post your inputs and/or cards Posts #742 >> 750.....The elusive ELITE 11....show them, if you have them Posts #751 >> 760.....The elusive ELITE 11....show them, if you have them Posts #761 >> 800.....How do you collect T206's: Graded or Ungraded ?...show us your cards Posts #801 >> 821.....How do you collect T206's: Graded or Ungraded ?...show us your cards Posts #824 >> 832.....Possible sources of the T206 Wagner cards Posts #833 >> 850.....T206 BLANK-BACKS...if you have them, post them here Posts #851 >> 853.....T206 BLANK-BACKS...if you have them, post them here Posts #854 >> 883.....What backs are your favorite(s), and do you collect runs of them ? Posts #884 >> 900.....Group of 36 subjects (350 Series) that are CB, EPDG, OM, PB NO-PRINTS Posts #901 >> 916.....Group of 36 subjects (350 Series) that are CB, EPDG, OM, PB NO-PRINTS Posts #917 >> 944.....MISSION (99%) ACCOMPLISHED American Beauty 460 run. Show your favorite run Posts #945 >> 950.....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards Posts #951 >> 961.....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards Posts #962 >> 984.....Possible sources of the T206 Wagner cards (Re-visited) Posts #985 >> 1000....... the "poor man's" T206 Joe Doyle "Nat'L" card Posts #1001 >> 1002..... the "poor man's" T206 Joe Doyle "Nat'L" card Posts #1004 >> 1034.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's Posts #1035 >> 1050.....Show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top Posts #1051 >> 1061.....Show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top In this thread, I've tried to present some very complex aspects of the Series structure of the T206 set in a style which is understandable to most of the T206 collectors. However, if not clear, don't be shy about asking questions. Post your questions on this thread. Or, email me directly with your questions.... tedzan11@comcast.net In either event, I will gladly do my best to provide you clear and meaningful answer(s). TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE...... the "poor man's" T206 Joe Doyle "Nat'L" card
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https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...mont350x13.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...BatP460x12.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eetCap11xx.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...dmont42x12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign350x13.jpg Two more new inputs to this Joe Doyle survey. Neither of these 2 inputs have this "printer's mark" in their caption. This 13-year Survey suggests to us that we can expect to find this "printer's mark" on a Joe Doyle card on the average of only ONE out of every 16 cards. https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...ersMark75x.jpg - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Printer's mark - -^ UPDATED May 28, 2020 (374 unique samples) T-brand.............Mark.....No-Mark Piedmont 350........13..........147 Sweet Cap 350.......7...........140 Polar Bear..............4............32 Old Mill..................1.............7 Sovereign 350.........0...........17 Tolstoi....................0.............6 EPDG.....................0.............2 ____________________________ Totals.................. 23 ........ 351 23 - Joe Doyle cards with this printer's mark...... 23/374 = 6.15% Hey guys, interest in this topic has diminished; therefore, unless there are any more responses......this ends the Joe Doyle "printer's mark" substitute for his "Nat'L" card. Moving on to the next T206 topic, so stay tuned. TED Z . |
This is a very friendly bump so we know this hugely important file didn't get lost in our database crash.
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T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
* * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...fdBaker12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eetCap12xx.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eign460x14.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...bbBat12xzz.jpg Tell us of your first experience(s) regarding the BB card Show where you acquired your first T206 cards. I'll begin with my story which is from 40 years ago. In the 1970's - 1980's, two of the major BB card Shows in the East were in Willow Grove and Valley Forge (Pennsylvania). They were situated in the George Washington Motor Lodge Convention Halls. Bob Schmierer and Ted Taylor promoted the Willow Grove Show. Tony and Rose Carrafiell promoted the Valley Forge Show. Major Dealers loaded with unbelievable stuff were set-up at these Shows In 1980, Bill Heitman published his book "The T206 Monster". It motivated me to start a T206 set, so I drove to Willow Grove. Upon entering the Show, I was amazed at the size of the crowd. After several hours of maneuvering, I achieved my goals. I acquired a bunch of T206's, some 1949 LEAF's, 1949 BOWMAN stars and 1952 TOPP's. Enough said, here are the highlights of my BB card purchases on that 1st visit to the Willow Grove Show. I'm happy to say that these cards are still in my collection. This is my very first T206 (cost me $20) http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...aseblue50x.jpg . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...seblue50xb.jpg 1949 LEAF Stan Musial rare light blue variation (paid $25)........and, 1949 BOWMAN Paige (which I traded two 1952 TOPPS Hi #s for) https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...ialLtBlueX.jpg . . . . https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...leroypaige.jpg 1952 TOPPS Billy Martin's rookie card (paid $15) https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...illyMartin.jpg https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...torLodgeVF.jpg Look forward to reading your stories. TED Z . |
Mine wasn’t at a card show, I hope that’s ok. I’m from the middle of nowhere Kansas. We didn’t have many shows to go to but somehow at about 12 years old I got on the Fritsch catalog mailing list. I can still picture what I think that black and white newspaper print cover looked like, because it’s the only reason I knew T206s were special. There was a Doyle, a Magie, a Plank and a Wagner. Inside, the prices for a couple of those cards were in ranges I knew my piggy bank couldn’t hold.
There must have been an advertisement for an auction house because within a year I was on the phone during visits to my grandparents house bidding on cards. I never won a T206. Fast forward a couple years and we’re about to take a roadtrip to Philadelphia to visit family. I was 14 and checked out a Pennsylvania yellowpages from the library and wrote down every card shop that had big advertisements around philly. This was 1987 so there were a few. I mowed and collected cans for 3 weeks trying to make money for the trip. On the way we stopped at one shop in Lancaster, I’ll never forget it because every once in a while I’ll have a dream about thumbing through raw T206s there. I bought these 3 cards and even though they’re Piedmont and Sweet Cap 350s, they’re a permanent part of the (mostly) off-back monster binder I just started building last year...my first major purchases since 1987. https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/00...g?v=1594685161 |
T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
Hi Jason
Any means of acquiring the first T206 cards for your collection goes. I didn't mean to limit this topic only to BB card Show acquisitions. And, your's is a great story. Brought back 1980's memories of Larry Fritsch. Thanks for posting. TED Z . |
I moved to Arlington Ma in 1977, and being closer to the big city (I was from small towns, lots of land but under 10K people) I figured there might be someplace that sold old baseball cards. How little I knew that there were hardly any shops anywhere....
But there was one in town! started hanging out there, and really liked the T206s, but wasn't really ready to spring a whole 1.50 for a decent one. One day the guy running the shop said he had something for me. A T206! and only 20 cents! who cared if it didn't have one of the pastel scenery backgrounds? Or that it had creases so bad it was nearly torn in half? It was Mine! They even let me use some scotch invisible tape to make sure it made it home in one piece. I'd post the scan, but ….. maybe later when I don't have to hunt through my computer for it. The guys at Halls would occasionally save stuff for me, especially nearly unsaleable items that might encourage me to collect more... My P-2 is even worse, but was free... A good investment on their part. |
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Hi Ted!
Summer of '91, a few years after moving to Bethlehem, PA (from Long Island), I started going to local card shows. I vividly remember going to a show at the Trolley Station Mall and seeing my first T206 cards; I was hooked from the beginning. I've been fascinated with them ever since, almost 30 years. Here's some of my first cards, 2 of which I got that day in 1991, and still have... |
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At my first show in 1981 I picked up these two T206 cards (plus 3 other 1910 era Hall of Famer cards) at the first table upon entering (on the right hand side, in case you were wondering) for all of the piggy bank money I brought, which was not a lot. I checked out the rest of the show, but had no more to spend. They were my first vintage cards, and I still have all five of them.
Brian |
T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
Steve....Mike....Brian
Some very interesting stories, guys. Thanks for posting them. Hey Mike We may have met back then, I used to set-up at shows in the Allentown area. TED Z . |
I don't remember the specific show (some show in Northern Virginia), and I am not sure the year (probably around 1986), but my first T206 was a Bresnahan Batting, and I am pretty sure it was a Piedmont (not sure the series). I loved it. It was so small and old and I thought it was very special. Whenever I "traded" with friends -- and we did that all the time -- everyone wanted my tobacco card, but no 1975 Gary Carter, 1983 Boggs or 1984 Donruss Mattingly could pry Roger from me. I don't think i knew at the time that he was a Hall of Famer.
A few years later I picked up a Cy Young with Glove, which then became my all-time favorite card. Each time I got back into collecting (this being my 3rd time), Cy Young with Glove with an early must purchase. |
T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
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Thanks for telling us your story. And now 34 years later you have a complete 524-card T206 set.... https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=284539 A "MEGA" Congratulations to you.....you are the man ! Take care my friend, TED Z . |
Ted, very possible! I used to goto shows also at the Whitehall Mall, Palmer Mall, Phillipsburg Mall, Merchant Square Mall, etc...
I think we first met at the old Fort Washington shows, circa early 90’s. And obviously we have done a few stealth deals in NJ & NYC! ;) |
T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
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Mike The first Fort Washington (Philly) Shows was in March 1993. I think your recollection is correct when we first met at my booth. We've been wheeling-n-dealing for about 26 years now. It's amazing how time flies when you're having fun. Take care my friend. TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
* * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...fdBaker12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eetCap12xx.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eign460x14.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...bbBat12xzz.jpg Continuing from Post #1004 regarding the Willow Grove Show. My good ole buddy, Dan Paley, was a H.S. classmate of Bob Schmierer who gave us Dealer tables at the Show. What an experience it was in the early 1980's. I felt like I went from an amateur dealer to a "professional" dealer overnite that first weekend. Anyhow the story I'm getting to here is the dealer across from my set-up. Some of you old-timers may remember Wayne Miller. Friday afternoon, on his 12-feet of table space, he'd place a large white sheet. He would arrange 100's of T206 cards on the sheet. A large group of commons on the left (priced at $2 - 4). The stars on the right. You could purchase any one of the 4 Cobb cards (Vg - Ex) for a mere $15 - 20 each. Typically by Saturday, he had sold all his T206's. Sunday he would replenish his inventory and by the end of the Show he had only a few left to take home. It was quite a sight to watch Wayne's operation. Needless to say, I acquired a good number of T206 cards from him. On display here is a Willow Grove Show program from those years. It contained several pages of very worthwhile information (Dealers, Table layout, etc.) regarding the Show. On the back of this program was an advertisement for the tremendous Seafood Restaurant (only a short walk from the Convention Center). The Boston Sea Party was a very popular restaurant in the 1970's-1990's. T'was a consistently excellent franchise, as I will attest to, having eaten at this one, in Denver, Carol Stream (IL) and Cherry Hill (NJ). https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...vesept1983.jpg . . https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...rtyMar1983.jpg Gee guys.....I'm sure you have some really interesting T206 stories to tell.....so why not share them with us. TED Z . |
Thanks for the prompt Ted. I have shared this story before. I begged my mom to buy Steve Clark's The Complete Book of Baseball Cards from Pickwick bookstore in the Montclair (California) Plaza mall circa 1978. Which she did because I never asked for much. The T206 images in that book sparked my life-long love affair with the set. But I didn't acquire my first T206s until 1981 at a baseball card shop in Claremont, CA called "The Baseball Card Shoppe." I guess the extra "pe" after "shop" made it sound more erudite. Thumbing through page after page in shopkeeper Mark's T206 binder, I found nice EX copies of Alperman, Gilbert, Rhodes and Schreck, which I bought for $3 each. Alas, I couldn't afford the EX Cobb in the holder for $75 or the other Hall of Famers offered for about $50 per.
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T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
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Great story, thanks for sharing it with us. It's interesting that in 1981 a Cobb was selling for $75. I guess that was "California prices" back then. On the East coast, a Cobb (Ex) was selling for about $40 in 1981. Take care my friend, TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
* * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...fdBaker12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eetCap12xx.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eign460x14.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...bbBat12xzz.jpg Hey guys, We've had several very interesting stories posted here. I could continue telling my stories from 44 years ago, but I rather hear your stories. It's always fun to reminisce about our early BB hobby days. Therefore, I'm bumping this thread back up to Net54's 1st page hoping you will chime in with your story. Don't be shy, just let it fly :) If no new stories are posted here, I will have to tell you my story of how I acquired these two "gems" at a New Jersey show (Spring 1982). A really great experience. https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...iedmont150.jpg . . . . . . . . . . . . https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...afPaige25x.jpg Thanks, TED Z . |
I unfortunately don't have any old card show stories acquiring my first T206's. But I remember T206's at the shows I'd go to. My first card show was in 1985. I was a bit late with the card shows. Earlier on, I was going to coin shows starting in 1980. But back to cards. I wasn't really in my comfort zone until 1989. But before that, I just didn't feel welcome at the vintage tables. Dealers didn't take me seriously and were not interested in talking to me like they were with others their own age. By 1989 I was more comfortable around them but I really didn't know anything about the cards from that time period and knew nothing about reprints. 1989 was an insane time to be at a card show. With the new release of Upper Deck and the Fleer Billy Ripken FF Error, it was an incredible experience. I didn't purchase my first T206 which was also my first pre-war card, until 2010. I had spent a couple years before that trying to learn as much as I could, just by searching the internet. It was Net54 where I learned the most. After my first few purchases of T206's, I then joined Net54. Starting T206's and joining Net54 were two of the best decisions I've made. I've gone from knowing nothing about the set, to being an advanced collector of T206's. Unfortunately I haven't added too many to my set since money is tighter and prices have sky rocketed. I occasionally think about what I could have in exchange for my T206 collection. Maybe one day I'll look further into it.
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T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
Ron
Interesting story, in just 10 years you have achieved a lot regarding Tobacco cards....the real stuff and knowledge there of. Thanks for posting. TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
* * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...fdBaker12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eetCap12xx.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eign460x14.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...bbBat12xzz.jpg In the early 1980's, the biggest BB card Show in NJ was situated in the Meadowlands. Most of the big-time Dealers back then set up at this Show, starting with Barry Halper. My 2 main missions that day in the Spring of 1982 were....acquiring some 1949 LEAF 2nd series (short-print) cards for my set. And to further my new project, The Monster. I made the rounds of the dealer tables, and found quite a number of T206 cards to choose from. I spotted this sharp-looking Walter Johnson. I had to get it for my T206 set. A friendly dealer from St. Louis sold it to me for ? ? I leave it up to you to figure out what I paid for this Ex-MT card :) At the far end of the showroom, I met Rick Starks and Jim Johnson, dealers from Erie (PA). I'll never forget them...... They made my day ! Their display had a 1949 LEAF Satchell Paige rookie card. I did not have much cash left, but I did have some cards for trade. Rick selected my 1955 TOPPS Ted Williams and my Reggie Jackson rookie. The value of those 2 cards did not quite equal the price of the Paige card. I had just $100 left with me and I offered it to them. Rick gave me back $20, so that I would have some cash for gas on my long trip back home. We talked a while about the source of rare LEAF cards. Jim said they had acquired a large collection on a buying trip in Ohio that had a good number of these rare LEAF cards. I noticed that they also had 4 more LEAF (Short-Prints)...... Whitey Kurowski, Danny Murtaugh, Eddie Stewart, and Harry Walker. I asked them if they could mail them to me. Rick packaged up these 4 cards and gave them to me and told me to mail them a check when I returned home. Subsequently, at the Willow Grove Show, Rick and Jim brought me about a couple of dozen 1949 LEAF Short-Print cards. They priced them at $25 each, which was a very fair price back in those days. This made quite a dent in my want-list towards completing this most difficult of the post-WWII sets. https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...iedmont150.jpg . . https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...edmont150b.jpg https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...afPaige25x.jpg . https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...fPaige25xb.jpg TED Z . |
I was 10 years old in the mid eighties and got my first "office" job after having grown up doing farm labor. That job was at a baseball card shop in Portsmouth Ohio. I was a subscriber to Lew Lipset's The Old Judge and really interested in the history of baseball. I had the key to open the shop, combo to unlock the safe and was even granted buying power 🤣. There were still walk ins with shoe boxes, but not often. A lot of early '70's cards in beat up shape mostly. However, one day a Clark Griffith portrait walked in the door and was had for $10. It had tape on it, creased and stained ,but that was all it took. I had the fever and still do 35 years later. My 13 years in the Marine Corps were largely absent for collecting but otherwise it has been a part of my life.
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I can't contribute much to this thread since I'm still learning and grew up during the junk era of the 90's. Just getting into vintage the last few years and the stories here are awesome! Thanks Ted and everyone for sharing!
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T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
Kali Mera....Costa
I'm assuming you are Greek. Thanks for the compliments. This is the place to be for vintage BB card knowledge. TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
* * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *
https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...C150x30xxz.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...CobbSGCx12.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...ohnson208x.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...raphicbldg.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eetCap12xx.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eign460x14.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...bbBat12xzz.jpg The guy responsible for my "fascination" for collecting T206 front/back permutations is our old Net54 member Barry Sloate. I remember this as it was only yesterday, when I responded to Barry's SCD Adv. in the Spring of 1983. Barry was selling cards from a 1949 BOWMAN set. I needed some tough Hi #'s to complete my 2nd set. We were on the phone for over an hour....Talkin' BB cards. Besides BOWMAN's, we also talked T206's. Barry sold me this Lundgren, it was the very first T206 in my collection that had a Tobacco brand other than the usual PIEDMONT, SWEET CAPORAL, or OLD MILL. And, as they say.... "the rest is history". Furthermore, years later when I started my all - SOVEREIGN set of T206's, Barry had acquired a large collection of T206's. Included in this find was a significant number of SOVEREIGN cards. He contacted me, and I purchased 270 different SOVEREIGN cards. That was quite a boost for me, since 408 cards are needed to complete this set. http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...bsEPDGx25b.jpg . . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ubsEPDGx25.jpg TED Z . |
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http://www.myt206.com/lundgrenfront.jpghttp://www.myt206.com/lundgrenback.jpg |
T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
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Ron Truly a great story. And, what an amazing coincidence, we both posted stories regarding exactly the same T206 card. Imagine the probability of this occurrence ? After all, it's not just any "old run of the mill T206." It's one of the toughest T206's in the Elite 11 group. I really appreciate you posting your story here. Quote:
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T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
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A rough calculation results in at least 1 Million to 1 probability factor of both of us coming up with our totally independent stories revolving around the identical T206 Lundgren card. However, it is evident from our numerous conversations on Net54 over the years, that this extraordinary coincidence may not be as unusual as it appears to be. We do think alike in quite a number of factors regarding the T206 cards. As the saying goes: "great minds think alike" :) TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
* * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *
https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...C150x30xxz.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...CobbSGCx12.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...ohnson208x.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...raphicbldg.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eetCap12xx.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eign460x14.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...bbBat12xzz.jpg Just a friendly bump to get some more interesting stories on how you got started on your adventure collecting T206 cards......whether it was putting together the set, or specializing in your particular project(s) regarding T206's. Before I leave you, here's my short-story regarding my first DRUM card. Circa 1984 at Willow Grove, a mid-west dealer had four DRUM cards for sale. He wanted $100 for each of them (they were VgEx cards). I offered $350 for the four. He adamantly said....NO ! I said I'd think about them. The more I thought about them, the more I wanted them. At the end of the day, I went back to his table with $400, but he had sold them. I told Barry Sloate about my foolish regret regarding the four DRUMS. Barry made me a $100 bet that I would not find another T206 DRUM within a year. Six months later, Barry says he has a DRUM card for me. And, I can have it for free since he lost our bet. So here is my first DRUM card. If I recall correctly, it is the only known DRUM card of Moeller. However, I may be proven wrong about that. https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...oellerdrum.jpg . . https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...oellerdrum.jpg OK, time for your sharing your stories with us. TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
* * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *
https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...C150x30xxz.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...CobbSGCx12.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...ohnson208x.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...raphicbldg.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eetCap12xx.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eign460x14.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...bbBat12xzz.jpg Well, no responses to my request here, so here's my follow-up DRUM story(s)............ Twelve years ago at the Reading Philly Show, Toby (bigfish) "made my day". I acquired this Frank Delehanty DRUM from Toby to complete my first A - B - C - D subset. http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ntyABCDx50.jpg http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...tyABCDx50b.jpg Then, around that time (2009), Barry Arnold, a good ole Net54 buddy contacted me wondering if I had a extra DRUM card so he could complete his T206 back collection. I offered Barry my Moeller DRUM card, and he was really happy with the very reasonable deal we made for it. I received this DRUM card from Barry (Sloate), and gave it to Barry Arnold) :) This Elberfeld is my nicest looking DRUM card. He is one of 36 (or 37 **) subjects from the 350/460 series which were printed with the DRUM back. https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...feldDRUM_1.jpg . . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...6DRUMx50bx.jpg ** Note.....Mullin (batting) in this series has not yet been confirmed with a DRUM back. Alright, this is the last time here that I will ask for your stories. I'm sure that some of you have some exciting T206 story (or two) to share with us here. TED Z . |
I dont have much to offer as I started collecting t206 a couple of years ago because of this forum and have bought everything through here but I wanted to say that I do enjoy your stories Ted please keep them coming!
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Ted, didn't we do some trade involving that Elberfeld Drum & a Murphy BL460 years ago?
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T206 REFERENCE.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's
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Yes we did, and I sort of regret doing that deal. All our other cash / trade deals have been fine. Take care, TED Z . |
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I believe the player above the 'shaving cream in glove' Konetchy was determined to be the Jennings portrait by some good folks at the Net54 website. Here is a link to this very useful and interesting site...check it out!
https://www.net54baseball.com/forumdisplay.php?f=2 Brian (always willing to pointlessly steer people into making several loops around the roundabout) |
T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top
Thanks Ben and Jason for posting your cards.
And, thanks Brian....the card above your Konetchy is definitely Jennings (portrait), as they both were printed in the 150 Series. Here's a tough AB 460 Frank Smith (Chicago & Boston) card with same name (top & bottom). http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ChiBost50x.jpg TED Z . |
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Whenever we've done deals, I think we can agree they were fair during that time. |
T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top
Here's the 460 Series George Bell with name on top.
https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...blNameT206.jpg TED Z . |
Somewhere this miscut Smith's neighbor (most likely) has a top/bottom name. Old Mill back
https://i.imgur.com/hhEyNNQh.jpg?1 |
T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top
* * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *
https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...C150x30xxz.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...CobbSGCx12.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...ohnson208x.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...raphicbldg.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eetCap12xx.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eign460x14.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...bbBat12xzz.jpg Next to my Plank.... this Eddie Collins card is my favorite T206 in my SWEET CAPORAL, Factory #30 set. https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...blNameT206.jpg TED Z . |
Ted, apologies, I owe you a call back! I got your message, but been slammed. We will talk soon.
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T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top
And, here is Carl Frederick Rudolf "Bonehead" Merkle
https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...blNameT206.jpg TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top
Jake Thielman had a 4-year career in the Majors (1905 - 1908) mainly as a Pitcher and a part-time Rightfielder.
https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...blNameT206.jpg TED Z . |
Love that Thielman card. It’s so wrong but right.
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T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top
Okay....there are millions of T206's with one Name....and some T206's with 2 same Names.
But, not often seen are T206's with 2 different Names. Anyway, very rarely will you find a T206 with No Names. If you have one, why not show it. I will start this show with this one............ https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...RyanNoName.jpg PIEDMONT 350 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . OLD MILL TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top
"Wild Bill" Donovan was the first Pitcher to Win 25 games in both Leagues.
In 1901, in the National League with Brooklyn (25 - 15). Then 1907 in the American League with Detroit (25 - 4). He had 185 career victories over a span of 18 years. https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...opNameT206.jpg TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top
Hey guys,
Some nice examples have been posted here. Let's see some more T206's with any one (or more) of these various types of anomalies. So, if you have them, how's about displaying them in this "show-room" ? Thanks, TED Z . |
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