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  #1051  
Old 08-24-2020, 06:35 AM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
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Default T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE...Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *


.... Sweet Caporal ..... Sovereign ......... Piedmont_____The "House" that created these Tobacco cards_____ Sovereign….American Beauty...…. UZIT


This thread will provide references to major contributions posted on Net54 these past 14 years that have formed a better understanding of "The Monster" [as Bill Heitman
so aptly coined his T206 book (circa 1980)].

Let's start with the 2005-2006 publication of Scot Reader's Inside T206
An excellent, very informative, and well written book that inspired many of us Net54ers to post our experiences and theory's regarding the complexities of the T206 series.

One of the early and very significant T206 threads was posted in June 2006 by Barry Arnold, titled T206 EPDG- - - how rare in your collection ?
This thread sparked lots of brainstorming among Net54ers regarding T206's. It included surveys; and, various aspects of the T206 series were explored.....resulting in 363
meaningful posts. Furthermore, between many of us Net54ers, it was "the start of of a beautiful friendship" (to quote Claude Raines to Humphrey Bogart in Casablanca).

In the Summer of 2006, Bill Brown posted his T206 Super-Set (excel) spreadsheet. Bill received 1000's of inputs from Net54ers for this spreadsheet. It was a great start
in the pursuit of what a T206 "master" set would be comprised of....T206 Super-Set

Sept 2007, I started a thread titled Joe Doyle NAT'L and it's 11 "cousins"....SURVEY to explore certain PIEDMONT 350 cards that I considered as rare as the Joe Doyle
"error" card. I eventually referred to these particular T206's as the Elite 11


Subsequent posts in this thread will expand on theory's regarding the structure of the T206 series and the front/back permutations that have resulted. A fair number of the
theory's presented on Net54 (since 2006) have withstood the test of time. Providing accurate lists of which front/back combos were printed. And, which ones are No-Prints.

So, stay tuned......many more T206 "oldies but goodies" References and Reflections will be posted here.

And, feel free to contribute any meaningful T206 stories, or experiences collecting T206's that you have.

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ___________________________________

INDEX

Post #1......Introduction....plus Scot Reader's " Inside T206 " book, and 3 significant T206 threads (circa..2006) for starters.

Set your user settings to display 50 posts per Page. Then click on the topic of interest, then scan page for Post # noted.


Post #2......The beginning of the six "Super-Prints"

Post #4......SOVEREIGN phantom "350/460" series (apple green cards)

Post #5......350/460 series backs identified

Post #8......350/460 series mutually-exclusive cards

Post #22.....T206 Plank mystery

Post #25.....T206 DRUM's...."A-B-C-D" connection

Post #26.....A-B-C-D connection expanded

Post #28.....1910 COUPON (T213-1) sub-set

Post #30.....Ty Cobb / Ty Cobb back

Post #31.....T206 Checklists....plus 1910 COUPON, T215-1 and Ty Cobb/Ty Cobb

Posts #33 & 34.....Richard Russell's unique T206 collection

Posts #35 - 36 & 38.....Exclusive 12 group (460-only series)

Post #39.....AMERICAN BEAUTY 350 No Frame subjects = DRUM subjects

Posts #44 & 48.....Collecting T206 sets....tell us your story's

Post #54.....T206 all-PIEDMONT set

Post #65......SOVEREIGN set story

Post #69......SWEET CAPORAL, Factory #30 set story

Posts #72 & 74......AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 adventure

Posts #76 - 77......T206 cards RE-FRONTED (or re-backed)....FAKE's !

Post #93.....T206 "Proofs"

Post #96.....UZIT checklist

Post #97.....Spring of 1911....T206 era ends....the start of the "Golden era" begins

Post #98.....ATC Factory's associated with the White-Bordered cards (1909 - 1911)

Posts #101 & 106.....BROAD LEAF 460 checklist

Post #107.....Hobby greats....Frank Nagy and Bill Heitman

Post #108.....CAROLINA BRIGHTS checklist

Post #124.....PIEDMONT 460, Factory #42 checklist

Posts #128 - 131.....Why are Connie Mack, Jack Coombs, Shoeless Joe Jackson, Smoky Joe Wood missing in the T206 set ?

Posts #134 & 138.....Timeline of the T206 POLAR BEAR cards

Post #144.....T206 OLD MILL (Major League series) cards

Post #146..... T206 OLD MILL Southern League cards

Post #161.....Southern League cards (continued)

Post #162.....T206 Southern Leaguers Brown OLD MILL cards

Post #171.....The mysterious T206 brown LENOX cards

Post #181.....SWEET CAPORAL 460, Factory #30 backs (w/o Factory #42 overprint)

Post #190.....El Principe de Gales T206 cards

Post #196.....SWEET CAPORAL 350-460, Factory #42 overprint cards

Post #198.....Regional source of the Elite 11 cards

Posts #201 >> 227.....Show-n-tell us of your favorite T206's

Posts #231 >> 248.....Show-n-tell us of your T206 Run(s)

Posts #263 >> 276.....T206 color printing errors......let's see some of these interesting T206's

Posts #282 >> 294.....The mysterious nature of the Red HINDU cards

Posts #302 >> 316.....Show-n-tell us of your MAGIE cards

Posts #328 >> 333.....T206 150-only subjects......

Posts #334 >> 346.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206

Posts #353 >> 358.....PIEDMONT set structure & checklist

Posts #360 >> 366.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206

Post #368.....Reminiscing about T206's in 2005

Post #378.....Remembering Jantz Morey

Posts #379 >> 385.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206

Posts #386 >> 402.....T206 printed sheet structure

Posts #405 >> 440.....Show us your BROAD LEAF 350 cards

Posts #441 >> 450.....Comparable printing patterns of the T206's and T205's

Posts #453 >> 467.....Guess the price of a near complete T206 set

Posts #469 >> 470.....Guess the selling price of a COMPLETE SOVEREIGN set

Posts #471 >> 474.....Guess selling price of a near complete PIEDMONT set

Posts #476 >> 479.....Guess selling price of a complete SWEET CAP, F#30 set

Posts #481 >> 515.....Show-n-Tell us of your T206 "finds"

Posts #516 >> 536....."Bang the DRUM Slowly" while showing us your DRUM cards

Posts #537 >> 551.....Guess how many Demmitt & O'Hara St Louis cards exist ?

Posts #553 >> 554.....FYI: T206 rosters of the 16 Major League teams

Posts #561 >> 570.....FYI: T206 rosters of the 16 Major League teams

Posts #571 >> 572.....FYI: 350 Series Minor Leaguer's checklist and trivia

Posts #573 >> 573.....T206 Southern League cards illustrated

Posts #574 >> 579.....T206 "Monster" obsession ? ....Check-out this one !

Posts #580 >> 597.....Do the T215-1 cards belong in the T206 set ?

Posts #598 >> 600.....Any guesses why no CHESTERFIELD or LUCKY STRIKE T-cards ?

Posts #601 >> 603.....Any guesses why no CHESTERFIELD or LUCKY STRIKE T-cards ?

Posts #605 >> 621.....the TOLSTOI story

Posts #622 >> 623.....Meet me at Philly, we can Talk T206's

Posts #624 >> 635.....CYCLE 460 checklist

Posts #636 >> 650.....The "MONSTER" Master Set achievement

Posts #651 >> 664.....The "MONSTER" Master Set achievement

Posts #665 >> 669.....UPGRADING T206 cards

Posts #671 >> 674.....And then, there are times to down-grade your T206's

Posts #675 >> 692.....Black LENOX checklist

Posts #693 >> 697.....Check-out Jamie B's multi-brand T206 card

Posts #698 >> 700.....Revisting the mysterious Ty Cobb card with TY COBB back

Posts #701 >> 713.....Reprising the Ty Cobb / TY COBB card debate

Posts #714 >> 726.....CYCLE 350 checklist..... where have all the CYCLE 350 cards gone ?

Posts #727 >> 741.....the enigmatic Lajoie (with bat)..... Post your inputs and/or cards

Posts #742 >> 750.....The elusive ELITE 11....show them, if you have them

Posts #751 >> 760.....The elusive ELITE 11....show them, if you have them

Posts #761 >> 800.....How do you collect T206's: Graded or Ungraded ?...show us your cards

Posts #801 >> 821.....How do you collect T206's: Graded or Ungraded ?...show us your cards

Posts #824 >> 832.....Possible sources of the T206 Wagner cards

Posts #833 >> 850.....T206 BLANK-BACKS...if you have them, post them here

Posts #851 >> 853.....T206 BLANK-BACKS...if you have them, post them here

Posts #854 >> 883.....What backs are your favorite(s), and do you collect runs of them ?

Posts #884 >> 900.....Group of 36 subjects (350 Series) that are CB, EPDG, OM, PB NO-PRINTS

Posts #901 >> 916.....Group of 36 subjects (350 Series) that are CB, EPDG, OM, PB NO-PRINTS

Posts #917 >> 944.....MISSION (99%) ACCOMPLISHED American Beauty 460 run. Show your favorite run

Posts #945 >> 950.....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards

Posts #951 >> 961.....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards

Posts #962 >> 984.....Possible sources of the T206 Wagner cards (Re-visited)

Posts #985 >> 1000....... the "poor man's" T206 Joe Doyle "Nat'L" card

Posts #1001 >> 1002..... the "poor man's" T206 Joe Doyle "Nat'L" card

Posts #1004 >> 1034.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's

Posts #1035 >> 1050.....Show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top

Posts #1051 >> 1066.....Show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top


In this thread, I've tried to present some very complex aspects of the Series structure of the T206 set in a style which is understandable to most of the T206 collectors.
However, if not clear, don't be shy about asking questions. Post your questions on this thread. Or, email me directly with your questions.... tedzan11@comcast.net
In either event, I will gladly do my best to provide you clear and meaningful answer(s).


TED Z
.

Last edited by tedzan; 09-14-2020 at 08:46 PM. Reason: Updated INDEX.
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  #1052  
Old 08-24-2020, 07:02 PM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Pennsylvania & Maine
Posts: 8,394
Default T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top

Southpaw pitcher Bill Burns had a similar pitching style as Eddie Plank, which was a "crossfire" motion (that really
rattled Ty Cobb). Burns pitched for 5 different teams during his 5-year career (1908 - 1912) in the Major Leagues.
Burns was one of the group of men who allegedly participated in the "Black-Sox" scandal in the 1919 World Series.





TED Z
.
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  #1053  
Old 08-25-2020, 07:05 PM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
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Posts: 8,394
Default T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top

And, here are two more double same name cards.....and, two single name on top cards.






Still waiting for you guys to display your cards.


TED Z
.

Last edited by tedzan; 08-26-2020 at 03:55 PM. Reason: Corrected typo.
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  #1054  
Old 08-25-2020, 07:54 PM
stutor stutor is offline
Sonny Tutor
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 39
Default Beaumont

This one has been posted here before...but not while I've owned it.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Beaumont Ginger P150 Double Name SGC 3.jpg (72.5 KB, 138 views)
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  #1055  
Old 08-25-2020, 09:03 PM
RCMcKenzie's Avatar
RCMcKenzie RCMcKenzie is offline
Rob
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Default

Here's a Hannifan almost no-name that I've had for a while..and a Crawford almost 2 names
Attached Images
File Type: jpg t206hannifan.jpg (70.7 KB, 132 views)
File Type: jpg t206hannifanb.jpg (77.3 KB, 129 views)
File Type: jpg t206crawford2names157.jpg (45.9 KB, 134 views)
File Type: jpg t206crawford2namesb158.jpg (54.9 KB, 139 views)
__________________
Want to buy or trade for T213-1 (Bob Rhoades)
Other Louisiana issues T216 T215 T214 T213 Etc
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  #1056  
Old 08-26-2020, 06:28 AM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
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Default T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top

Sonny and Rob

Great cards, thanks for posting them.

The Beaumont with Seymour on top is real gem.


TED Z
.
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  #1057  
Old 08-28-2020, 05:47 PM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
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Default T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top

Giving this thread a friendly bump with another double same name T206. And, perhaps some of you will add to this gallery of anomalies.





TED Z
.
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  #1058  
Old 08-29-2020, 12:17 AM
Ronnie73 Ronnie73 is offline
Ron Kornacki - Uncle Nacki
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Default

This is one topic I don't think I have anything to share. Mainly because I purposely stayed away from miscut cards. I might have a couple minor one's but would have to dig out the cards and devote a day to see what I might have. I do have plans to scan the fronts and backs of all my T206's and share them on a website for everyone to see but that might turn out to be a winter project. Plus I'm still working on my T205 website and a T59 Flags site as well.

Future websites:

myt206.com
t205resource.com
t59flags.com
__________________
Ron - Uncle Nacki

T206 Master Monster Front/Back Set Collector - www.youtube.com/unclenacki
T206 Basic "The Monster" Set 514/524
T206 Advanced "Master Monster" Front/Back Set ????/5256
COMPLETE T206 BACK SUBSETS
Old Mill Southern Leagues - Black Ink 48/48
Sweet Caporal 350-460 Factory 30 Full Color "No Prints" 28/28
NEAR COMPLETE T206 BACK SUBSETS
Polar Bear 245/250
Sovereign 460 50/52
Sweet Caporal 150 Factory 649 Overprint 31/34
Piedmont 350 "Elite 11" 9/11

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  #1059  
Old 08-29-2020, 07:01 PM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
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Default T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top

Hi Ron

I am looking forward to seeing your T205Resource website again. Perhaps you can give me a ballpark figure of how many T205's were printed
with the PIEDMONT Factory #42 back ?

I've recently picked up a bunch of them; and, was wondering how many would be in a run (if I was foolish enough to take on this challenge) ?


. .


TED Z
.
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  #1060  
Old 08-29-2020, 08:33 PM
BBT206 BBT206 is offline
Bill Brown
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Default T206 Dahlen Boston, Wagner

dahlenbo.pd150.wag.jpg
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  #1061  
Old 08-30-2020, 06:30 AM
Ronnie73 Ronnie73 is offline
Ron Kornacki - Uncle Nacki
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tedzan View Post
Hi Ron

I am looking forward to seeing your T205Resource website again. Perhaps you can give me a ballpark figure of how many T205's were printed
with the PIEDMONT Factory #42 back ?

I've recently picked up a bunch of them; and, was wondering how many would be in a run (if I was foolish enough to take on this challenge) ?

TED Z
.
I don't have my checklists complete yet but the Piedmont 42's are in the mid 70's. I just listed a group of T205's for sale that included 10 different Piedmont 42's.
__________________
Ron - Uncle Nacki

T206 Master Monster Front/Back Set Collector - www.youtube.com/unclenacki
T206 Basic "The Monster" Set 514/524
T206 Advanced "Master Monster" Front/Back Set ????/5256
COMPLETE T206 BACK SUBSETS
Old Mill Southern Leagues - Black Ink 48/48
Sweet Caporal 350-460 Factory 30 Full Color "No Prints" 28/28
NEAR COMPLETE T206 BACK SUBSETS
Polar Bear 245/250
Sovereign 460 50/52
Sweet Caporal 150 Factory 649 Overprint 31/34
Piedmont 350 "Elite 11" 9/11

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  #1062  
Old 08-30-2020, 05:27 PM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
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Default T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBT206 View Post
Hi Bill

Very nice Dahlen....with Wagner on top, you have both Boston teams represented. Boston Nat'L on the bottom and Boston American on the top.
Thanks for posting this card.


TED Z
.
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  #1063  
Old 08-31-2020, 06:58 PM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
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Posts: 8,394
Default T206 REFERENCE....show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top

And, here's another double-same-name T206. Barely legible; however, under magnification, the top name is the same.





TED Z
.
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  #1064  
Old 09-02-2020, 09:30 AM
runandgun runandgun is offline
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Posts: 20
Default

This site is amazing as far as the work done to identify so many rare issues. I did discover a brand new BL 460 according to the list I just viewed. It is a Magee. Ill post an image of it a bit later. Thanks for all you do.
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  #1065  
Old 09-04-2020, 08:36 PM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by runandgun View Post
This site is amazing as far as the work done to identify so many rare issues. I did discover a brand new BL 460 according to the list I just viewed. It is a Magee. Ill post an image of it a bit later. Thanks for all you do.

Hi runandgun

I appreciate your compliments.

I checked out your post today, and I must say that the Magee BROAD LEAF 460 card is absolutely amazing.

I added it to my BROAD LEAF 460 confirmed list in Post #101 in this thread.

Thanks, again.


TED Z
.
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  #1066  
Old 09-14-2020, 07:45 PM
tedzan tedzan is offline
Ted Zanidakis
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Posts: 8,394
Default T206 BROAD LEAF 460 group

Near the end of the T206 press runs (circa late 1910-early 1911), American Lithographic separated the 63 subjects in the 350/460 series into two print groups. I have
identified these 2 groups as A and B.

Illustrated here are the 35 subjects that were theoretically printed with the BROAD LEAF 460 back. To date, 29 of them are confirmed with the BROAD LEAF 460 backs.

Identified here are the 6 subjects from Group A that have yet to be discovered with BROAD LEAF 460 backs. I expect that these 6 guys will eventually be discovered with
the BROAD LEAF 460 back.

Group A ......

---------- Ames --------------------------------------------- Bender -------- ------------------------------------ Chance ------------------- Chase ------------------ Chase
.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- L. Doyle










TED Z

T206 Reference
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Last edited by tedzan; 09-16-2020 at 11:01 AM. Reason: Added information.
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