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#1801
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Read. The argument from the thread's openly and oft stated troll is that because one can choose to break the law, choice remains. He then doubles down and agree with "In a sense every single action ever taken in the history of humanity is a choice" in #1770, and uses that as the justification. The problem with his justification should be obvious to any person who can read at a third grade level. If, because in some sense, a person always has a choice of how to respond to pressure or coercion or force, then every action taken (for an action cannot be taken after death) in the history of humanity qualifies as leaving a 'choice'. A state and society run by this logic, would be most extreme totalitarian state possible, one beyond any that has ever existed. It removes any possible restriction, rejects any morality or limits. If every action still gives the victim choice in this sense, and this is acceptable, there is no possible action that goes too far. Ever. This is the worst possible justification. Hence why every other poster, except you and the self-proclaimed troll, are engaging with the actual question. Nobody denies that there is sometimes necessity of coercion; a society cannot function with, say, a murderer on the loose and no action taken against them because their victims have the choice to try and run or to fight or to submit. There are gates around the coercion, very strong gates and the times and circumstances of coercion are very limited and defined by law. Civilization is not inherently coercive, because the coercive element is not the totality or primary driver and coercion is only used under pre-defined and very specific circumstances. In a good society, the coercion is only used for the bare minimum necessary for a functioning and safe society. In a bad one, for many more purposes. But no regime in the history of the world has gone as far as the justification here allows. Hence why the rest of the debate, between both sides, has been whether or not this case justifies coercion, in this case mostly economic pressure as the coercive element. I get that you are really excited about forcing political opponents into doing what you want, but one would think you would seek a less extremist justification than an open totalitarian defense. Like we were debating before the troll. I liked when the left was liberal and literate and not openly endorsing total authoritarianism over a 'vaccine' that does not function like a vaccine. |
#1802
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Respectfully, when you start throwing around brainwashing and reconditioning I just stop reading your posts so I won’t be responding to them.
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#1803
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Of course people were forced to get the vaccine. Its ignorant to think otherwise. Unless you dont think threatening someone's livelihood is forcing them to do something
Could any one of you, regardless of political affiliation , walk away from a 9 million dollar payday? Sure, Cube had a "choice" and was financially comfortable making it. Others, would have had to go aheqd and get the shot or risk losing 9 million for their...ahem...choice https://www.rollingstone.com/music/m...ne-1234635633/
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"Trolling Ebay right now" © Always looking for signed 1952 topps as well as variations and errors |
#1804
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You still haven't realized it yet, have you, that every part of this, right from the very beginning, has all been a lie and everything from masks to mandates was all intentional and all designed to control you, do you? But, I get it. You love your govt daddy and believe they would never do such a thing to you, don't you? Michael Yeadon, the former VP of Pfizer thinks everyone of these evil bastards (your hero's) should be hung, (and he is against capital punishment) and forgotten about. You, on the other hand are incapable of even seeing what it is they did to people and society and still think everything they did was all aboveboard, innocent and unintentional. Like you said to me sometime ago, I wish you luck going forward. https://www.tiktok.com/@anzactruther..._t=8b4bAYbq0u5
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52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 Last edited by irv; 04-01-2023 at 02:49 PM. |
#1805
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#1806
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You, sir, have an impeccable judgment of character.
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“interesting to some absolute garbage to others.” —- “Error cards and variations are for morons, IMHO.” |
#1807
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#1808
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M.!.c.h.@.3.L. . H.v.n.T _____________________________ Don't believe everything you think |
#1809
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Are you getting your info from that same clown, the "blogger" the "cartoonist" from Skeptical Science in John Cook? Great source, Mike. I guess when one gets desperate to find info that agrees with their beliefs, a cartoonist is better than nothing.
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52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#1810
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To be fair that probably is something you actually believe. ![]() |
#1811
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He very directly said this. The argument that because there is a possible choice to break the law or accept the consequences of pressure, the action is justified. That was the argument. Very directly. It is right here, on this same page, in the transcript. Learn to read. Quote:
I don't think I said any action taken under the label of safety is justified. I would love to see that post! My specific example you cut out was that we have laws against murder, because a society cannot function without some limiters. A minisucle reduction in an absolute risk rate for a flu is, and here's an area where a reasonable argument could actually happen, not doing a whole lot for the security of the citizen body that drives people to live together in societies. Quote:
I am greatly amused every time our posters who keep rejecting the need for textual, evidentiary or logically consistent bases like to play false straw man. Nowhere did I say we have a totalitarian state - no nation in the history of the world has operated on bnorth's postulation you are defending as I have written multiple times. Our example is the logic used to justify the position; not an actual state. Are you genuinely unable to read? |
#1812
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He really does believe that. Pretty amazing.
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#1813
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This coming from the guy that got himself and his children vaccinated because he was told to.
Pretty amazing is right.
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52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#1814
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CDC and FDA contracts show they prepared for massive amounts of serious adverse events months before Covid-19 vaccines were rolled out
https://thecanadianindependent.subst...utm_medium=web
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52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#1815
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#1816
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Attorney General
@JeffLandry 's opening statement on Missouri v. Biden and the US Government's censorship industrial complex: "The White House pressured YouTube to reduce watch time of 'borderline' content by 70%, the FBI boasted a 50% success rate in getting platforms to censor misinformation, the Election Integrity Partnership bragged that 35% of URLs shared with Facebook, Twitter, TikTok, and YouTube were either labeled, removed or soft blocked. As a result of this collaboration between social media companies and the CDC, NIH, and NIAID, American citizens, scientists, and journalists were shadowbanned, censored, silenced, and de-platformed for their valid concerns about lockdowns, masks, COVID vaccines, and more." https://twitter.com/KanekoaTheGreat/...FQ4EWg26s%3D19
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52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#1817
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"In an unlikely but conceivable turn of events, what if that scientist becomes infected with the virus, which leads to an outbreak and ultimately triggers a pandemic? Many ask reasonable questions given the possibility of such a scenario - however remote - should the initial experiments have been performed and/or published in the first place, and what are the processes involved in that decision? Scientists working in this field might say - as indeed I have said - that the benefits of such experiments and the resulting knowledge outweigh the risks."
Anthony Fauci October 2012
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“interesting to some absolute garbage to others.” —- “Error cards and variations are for morons, IMHO.” |
#1818
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Their job was to ensure these weren't released based on what they knew.
But keep on defending them, Ben. You're a good little compliant lamb that they adore and love so much.
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52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#1819
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#1820
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What exactly is "these"? serious question.
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#1821
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52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#1822
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I don't know whether to laugh at you or feel sorry for you, Ben.
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52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#1823
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#1824
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Number one, don’t ever mention someone else’s kids. Most sane people know that you don’t go there. You are not one of those so i give you one free pass. Number two, I listen to medical doctors over idiots like you.
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#1825
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I get it, I honestly still hope you are just going all in on playing some silly conspiracy theorist character and don't believe the stuff you post.
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#1826
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These doctors, and counting, plus all the others with the pending lawsuits knew better but I suppose in your world, these are all just conspiracy theorists too? Any idea why your govt wanted this info censored/banned? Trust me, it wasn't your health and well being they were concerned with. https://gbdeclaration.org/
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52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#1827
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There is something seriously wrong with you, Ben. I hope you get the help you need, seriously.
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52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#1828
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Have you always felt the government was out to get you or has it only been a recent thing that you have discovered the truth? Serious question
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#1829
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private business was following the government, unless you really believe if the govt was silent on the issue everything else would be the same...public and private are intertwined in many ways.
Last edited by 1952boyntoncollector; 04-01-2023 at 09:02 PM. |
#1830
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And they knew all this before they even rolled them out. But that's OK, according to some, because money and control, destroying lives, killing people, even kids, and being a guinea pig for the govt and big pharma is more important.
![]() https://rumble.com/v2fh4lu-new-the-w...y-kids-an.html EMA’s failure to pull COVID 19 jabs even though risk-benefit balance nullified EU safety report on Pfizer-BioNTech mRNA vaccine reveals damning data. It is high time to hold the EMA and the EU Commission and their complicit partners – starting with WHO and FDA, CDC – accountable for their dereliction of duty in failing to protect public health by ignoring the glaring safety signals and standing by the obviously erroneous statement that the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine’s ‘benefit-risk profile remains favourable.’ This long existing safety report, published in August, 2021 serves as solid evidence that parties involved in evaluation and decision to allow COVID-19 ‘vaccinations’ to market were aware of the devastating impact they brought about. They did not only fail in their duty to properly evaluate mRNA ‘vaccinations’ before application on humans but they continue ignoring safety indicators at hand causing unmeasurable harm and destruction. https://childrenshealthdefense.eu/eu...nce-nullified/ Again, like the former VP of Pfizer, Michael Yeadon stated, the main people behind this need to be hung and the rest imprisoned for the rest of their pathetic lives and I couldn't agree more. https://www.tiktok.com/@anzactruther..._t=8b4bAYbq0u5
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52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#1831
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I can't believe I'm getting sucked in again.
![]() The 'mandate' that government employees and some business chose to enact, required the A) administration of the vaccine OR B) testing and other safeguards OR C) find another job. That was the CHOICE that a very small percentage of the population had to make. Nearly all subject to this predicament, statistically, chose A or B. Where all happy about it, no. BUT they had not one, but THREE CHOICES. And judging from some of the opinions posted here, those who chose C shouldn't have had any trouble finding employment in a like minded enterprise that is woke to the conspiracy, happily working beside other unmasked, unvaccinated co-workers who chose to actively do nothing. Or retire and collect government entitlements or state unemployment, and sign up for Obamacare while opening an Etsy store selling custom tin-foiled hats.
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"If you ever discover the sneakers for far more shoes in your everyday individual, and also have a wool, will not disregard the going connected with sneakers by Isabel Marant a person." =AcellaGet Last edited by Deertick; 04-02-2023 at 11:04 AM. |
#1832
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#1833
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Get a vaccine or leave...your employment is no longer based on merit, intelligence or performance! That's the liberal way! Who is John Galt?
__________________
"Trolling Ebay right now" © Always looking for signed 1952 topps as well as variations and errors |
#1834
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__________________
"Trolling Ebay right now" © Always looking for signed 1952 topps as well as variations and errors |
#1835
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and cant sue if they get sick from the shot on top of that...
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#1836
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It appears that you missed the entire point of Deertick's post. It's not get the vaccine or leave. Its get the vaccine or get tested weekly. I work for a liberal municipality in Virginia, and that is exactly what happened. The people that didn't want to get the vaccine just had to get tested weekly. Not really that big of a deal.
Last edited by cgjackson222; 04-02-2023 at 07:01 PM. |
#1837
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1952Boynton--you've written literally dozens of posts saying that people got fired for not getting the vaccine. Are you conceding that you were wrong, and that people generally just needed to get tested to avoid being let go?
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#1838
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He is just mad as a lawyer he can't make money by taking advantage of anyone wanting to sue by taking the lions share IF he wins the case.
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#1839
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It takes a special kind of person to not admit when they are wrong. He is that special person.
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#1840
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One, again, it’s a dbag move to talk about other people’s kids. I am not surprised you join Irv in doing it. Two, nice invented number.
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#1841
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But I believe this was the exception to the rule. And a judge ordered NYC to reinstate workers fired over the mandate. https://www.npr.org/2022/12/27/11443...k-city-workers But the Biden COVID vaccination mandate (which I believe the Supreme Court struck down) allowed federal workers to retain their jobs if they got tested weekly. And I believe many municipalities followed that guideline. So the general point that the Federal Government didn't directly fire people because they didn't get the covid vaccine is true. Last edited by cgjackson222; 04-02-2023 at 07:50 PM. |
#1842
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![]() Their govt daddy knew these shots didn't stop contraction nor transmission, so what they implemented is fascist and totalitarian. Control the media, social and mainstream, suppress, shame and shun those who speak out against their narrative, use various methods of control (firing people) deny basic liberties, expect/command obedience to authority, use of police to force compliance and persecute those that don't. If you're young or ignorant, or both, and are not familiar with these things, it's time you educated yourselves. We've been through this before, about 80 yrs ago, and were told nothing like this would ever happen again. ![]()
__________________
52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 Last edited by irv; 04-02-2023 at 08:05 PM. |
#1843
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For what it's worth, idiot, we are not talking about your kids, we are talking about what you did to them. Why is that so hard for you to figure out??
__________________
52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#1844
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#1845
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Just curious why the numbers were not as "deadly" among healthcare workers if masks didnt work so well.
Breaking news, its because they washed their hands. The #1 way to prevent a virus! I know, news to the people still living in 1918. Some new terrible virus... combat same way as the old virus. I did get an extra booster for my son for measles when the real anti-vaxxers, the Hasid, starting having an outbreak of cases. Depends on your circumstances and your demographic but should always be ones choice. For my job, whether you are vaxxer or not, you are still required to test, even as soon as last week, for covid. I guess I could just quit and work at Lowes if I dont like it, but I am forced to take tests. I did hit one asymptomatic positive, however at 47 I have no comorbidities. I'm wondering what side effects from testing there will be?
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"Trolling Ebay right now" © Always looking for signed 1952 topps as well as variations and errors Last edited by Republicaninmass; 04-03-2023 at 06:37 AM. |
#1846
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#1847
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Desensitized gag reflex? Saving money on tissues?
__________________
"If you ever discover the sneakers for far more shoes in your everyday individual, and also have a wool, will not disregard the going connected with sneakers by Isabel Marant a person." =AcellaGet |
#1848
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i think there were like 50 posts about 'choice' to leave..there appears to be an argument of whether there was real choice on many of the occasions when people lost their jobs...... also to act like you were treated the same and to get the same promotions as others when labeled 'anti vax', easy to sit here now and look back but you forget 'emergency rooms were full etc attitude that pervaded' and how employees were viewed .. i am not sure also if the employees on some occasions had to pay for the weekly tests or were those all to be paid by the employer....when you got 5 employees and you got to pay weekly for one versus another one. that could impact employment, if you are an employee and have to pay for tests versus others that could also impact you as well... ..
Last edited by 1952boyntoncollector; 04-03-2023 at 08:03 AM. |
#1849
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Where did I claim you called me a name? Hmm, where?
What I said was, "The ”troll” happens to be correct. Your name calling doesn’t change that fact." Here let me explain that to you. You called Ben a "troll." I said he was correct despite your need to call him a "troll." See. I never said you called me a name. I don't think even a third-grader would think I claimed you were calling me a name from that. Quote:
Again, not even a third-grader would be naive enough to think that highlighting "In a sense every single action ever taken in the history of humanity is a choice" means every resulting action is justified. Learn to read, indeed. Quote:
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I only entered this fray to point out to Ben that his choice argument was correct and I get dragged in to this. So, if you'll excuse me, I'm thinking of watching a movie. It's about a woman in a concentration camp during WWII. She has two kids and is told that she has to pick which of her two kids will be gassed. If she doesn't, both will be gassed. Horrible options. It's called "Sophie's Choice." You might remember all the complaints about the title. Yeah, me neither.
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M.!.c.h.@.3.L. . H.v.n.T _____________________________ Don't believe everything you think |
#1850
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Nevermind.
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“interesting to some absolute garbage to others.” —- “Error cards and variations are for morons, IMHO.” Last edited by Cliff Bowman; 04-03-2023 at 11:36 PM. |
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