1954 Bowman #66 Ted Williams Grading Advice

[capt14k]

I guess I should have known when PSA eliminated qualifiers that top to bottom centering on Williams would prevent it from being higher than a 3 based on their 90/10 minimum? There are no creases or hidden wrinkles. I went through the card I don't know how many times. I am going to try to call PSA and confirm that it was only because of the top to bottom centering. Left to Right centering is pretty good.

With that being said how can PSA 3 that looks like it went through the wash be comparable to PSA 3 that is strictly due to centering?

I thought for sure this would be a case where PSA would put a qualifier. My questions are:

1) Should I try to resubmit to PSA
2) submit to SGC?
3) If resubmitting should I leave in the case?

I valued the card at $1,500 raw. Now I have spent nearly $200 with PSA to have it graded. Looking at recent sales on eBay prices are actually near where I wanted to be. I would be more than happy with $2,200 and I think mine is a lot nicer than a PSA 3 that sold on ebay for $2,200. I certainly think it is as nice as the SGC 4 that sold for $2k. Of course another PSA 3 sold for $1335 and that I wouldn't be happy with. Below are pictures for comparison.

Last question is

4) What would reasonable value be if left as a PSA 3 vs if I sent to SGC and they graded it say a 5, which is what a comparable 1954 Bowman Campanella was just graded by SGC. Honestly I thought the Williams was nicer than the Campanella.


My Williams that PSA graded a 3





Campanella that SGC just graded 5







SGC 3.5 $1885



PSA 3 $2200





PSA 3 $1300





SGC 4 $2,000 which is what I would hope to at worse get from SGC





PSA 7 OC $2400 what I was hoping to get as a highest possible grade with OC qualifier from PSA. I figured at worst it would be a 5.






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[Eddiez]

I'm not sure of the value but I can tell you don't send it to SGC they are grading harder on centering than PSA. I can tell you a nice looking PSA 3 will sell a decent amount higher than a card that looks like it's on the bottom end of the grade.

[capt14k]

Originally Posted by Eddiez

I'm not sure of the value but I can tell you don't send it to SGC they are grading harder on centering than PSA. I can tell you a nice looking PSA 3 will sell a decent amount higher than a card that looks like it's on the bottom end of the grade.

I have heard that about SGC as well, but the Campanella just came back a 5 from them.

That's what I was hoping to hear that collectors recognize the difference and value between 3s. They certainly are not all created equal based on the 3s pictured above. Those cards look like they went through a wash cycle.

Thank you for the reply.

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[raulus]

How are you planning to sell it? eBay buy it now? eBay auction? Net54 B/S/T or auction? Some other venue? And how soon do you need the cash?

I would be inclined to try to sell it at the current grade using a price that works for you, either with eBay buy it now, net54 B/S/T, or some other venue where you can control the price (I hear fakebook may also be an option).

I suspect that someone who likes the eye appeal of your card will be willing to pay a premium over other examples at the same grade that are less visually appealing. But it might take a little while to sell, so you'll need to be patient.

As has already been mentioned, the reports are that SGC has been tough on centering lately, which is probably reason enough to not go there.

There's certainly a bit of a twist on the peter principle at play when it comes to graded cards, where they get resubmitted until they finally get the grade that the submitter thinks they deserve. The only trouble is that if you're spending lots of cash and waiting for months each time, you could end up wasting hundreds of dollars, and wait for several months or years until you finally get there. As such, I would be inclined to not bother with trying to re-submit it, but instead attempt to find a buyer based on one of the above ideas.

For all you know, whoever buys it will either pop it out of the case anyway because they only want raw cards, or because they plan to attempt to re-submit it themselves to get a higher grade. And you can let them invest the time and cash into getting there.

[capt14k]

Originally Posted by raulus

How are you planning to sell it? eBay buy it now? eBay auction? Net54 B/S/T or auction? Some other venue? And how soon do you need the cash?

I would be inclined to try to sell it at the current grade using a price that works for you, either with eBay buy it now, net54 B/S/T, or some other venue where you can control the price (I hear fakebook may also be an option).

I suspect that someone who likes the eye appeal of your card will be willing to pay a premium over other examples at the same grade that are less visually appealing. But it might take a little while to sell, so you'll need to be patient.

As has already been mentioned, the reports are that SGC has been tough on centering lately, which is probably reason enough to not go there.

There's certainly a bit of a twist on the peter principle at play when it comes to graded cards, where they get resubmitted until they finally get the grade that the submitter thinks they deserve. The only trouble is that if you're spending lots of cash and waiting for months each time, you could end up wasting hundreds of dollars, and wait for several months or years until you finally get there. As such, I would be inclined to not bother with trying to re-submit it, but instead attempt to find a buyer based on one of the above ideas.

For all you know, whoever buys it will either pop it out of the case anyway because they only want raw cards, or because they plan to attempt to re-submit it themselves to get a higher grade. And you can let them invest the time and cash into getting there.

Good points. Honestly I never had cards graded until a couple weeks ago, and mainly on the advice of others, and what I see graded cards sell for.

I sent 1954 Mantle to PSA and got a 5. Then I sent about 20 cards to SGC and got 5-8 on them, I was ok with the grades. The 3 on Williams made me go back to my original feelings about graded cards, and those doing the grading. I never needed some overweight dork telling me what a card's grade and value is.

Unfortunately it seems most will only buy graded cards, and they pay a ridiculous amount more for them. Recently I bought a lot of cards already graded for the set to upgrade the set. However Grading and over saturatuion is why I stopped collecting cards in the first place.

I have been selling my collection for over a year. Started with wax, then average sets, now I'm onto higher end sets and singles. I'm not in a huge rush, but I am tired of storing cards. Most funds will just get reinvested in my current collection which is military firearms. So the sooner I sell the sooner I can get a Matching Wartime PPK lol.

I likely will post on ebay buy it now and Net54 at 10% less than ebay.


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[G1911]

Originally Posted by capt14k

the sooner I sell the sooner I can get a Matching Wartime PPK lol.

This is the only good reason to sell a Ted Williams baseball card

[JollyElm]

Card grading is such a crapshoot, and it seems to keep getting worse. I suggest you don't waste the money by resubmitting, and just accept the grade as it is and make the move that works best for you with said grade. Since there is only a sliver of white on the bottom, I think most 'normal' (whatever that means) collectors can see how great the card looks other than that, so you should be able to get a nice price for it without paying for repeat opinions from the TPGs.

[capt14k]

Originally Posted by JollyElm

Card grading is such a crapshoot, and it seems to keep getting worse. I suggest you don't waste the money by resubmitting, and just accept the grade as it is and make the move that works best for you with said grade. Since there is only a sliver of white on the bottom, I think most 'normal' (whatever that means) collectors can see how great the card looks other than that, so you should be able to get a nice price for it without paying for repeat opinions from the TPGs.

Thank you. I agree. I'm glad I asked before doing. Especially since this is my first foray into grading.


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[capt14k]

PSA posted the pictures of my Williams card that they graded a 3 which I thought was low. The picture they posted shows scratches that definitely were not there. I am hoping it is on the plastic but how poor is their handling for the plastic to get so scratched up so quickly? If these are scratches PSA caused to the card how is that handled? This is just one reason I always avoided grading. Tracking shows card isnt due to be delivered til Wednesday. I so hope that is the plastic and not the card, and during their QA check someone thoought it was on the card and lowered the grade, but sadly I think there is a snowball's chance in hell of that being the case.

Before




After




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[G1911]

The horizontal line across his neck is in both the before and after photos.

[capt14k]

Originally Posted by G1911

The horizontal line across his neck is in both the before and after photos.

Yes that was there, I'm talking about the vertical lines on his face and left arm.


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[capt14k]

Originally Posted by JollyElm

Card grading is such a crapshoot, and it seems to keep getting worse. I suggest you don't waste the money by resubmitting, and just accept the grade as it is and make the move that works best for you with said grade. Since there is only a sliver of white on the bottom, I think most 'normal' (whatever that means) collectors can see how great the card looks other than that, so you should be able to get a nice price for it without paying for repeat opinions from the TPGs.

Now I am wondering. Just had a member here compare sales of went through the wash PSA 3 to mine, because as I figured a 3 is a 3 in the minds of those that depend on someone who can't get out of their own way to tell them the grade of a card. I have passed by more 8s buying cards for 1954 Bowman, 1955 Topps, and 1970 Topps sets than I have bid on them. Obviously there are some knowledgeable collectors and I saw that the other night when the same seller with the same card ending a minute apart and the PSA 7 sold for more than the PSA 8. However I think the majority just look at the numbers.

If anyone doesn't know to tell actual sales price of accepted offer on ebay 130point website is a good tool.






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[JollyElm]

The question you have to ask yourself about a resubmission is what realistic chance do you have of getting anything other than a 3, especially with the intensely harsher new grading standards? I imagine PSA would never up the number, considering they haven't even returned it yet from their initial assessment of it as a 3. It would be silly for them to say, "Whoops. We were wrong." And if it's possible a different TPG would up the number a bit, their cards 'always' sell for less, so that would be a wash or worse with the grading fees.

Definitely follow your gut.

[capt14k]

Originally Posted by JollyElm

The question you have to ask yourself about a resubmission is what realistic chance do you have of getting anything other than a 3, especially with the intensely harsher new grading standards? I imagine PSA would never up the number, considering they haven't even returned it yet from their initial assessment of it as a 3. It would be silly for them to say, "Whoops. We were wrong." And if it's possible a different TPG would up the number a bit, their cards 'always' sell for less, so that would be a wash or worse with the grading fees.

Definitely follow your gut.

Good point. Right now I'm most concerned about the 3 vertical scratches that were not there. Hoping they are on the plastic. Would be really happy if they are on the plastic and the grade was lowered during QA step, but that's wishful thinking. If PSA scratched my card I hope they take responsibility. I stand by my initial assessment about grading from 30 years ago. It sucks and it will ruin the hobby, just like it did with coin collecting.


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