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Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Postwar Sportscard Forums > Postwar Baseball Cards Forum (Pre-1980)

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  #51  
Old 09-20-2023, 01:44 PM
stevepoland stevepoland is offline
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Ahh, well I'm not sure about this specific sheet image. But I wasn't thinking about a second slit. So if the wood on bottom lines up with the Gary Bell row, then 2 rows are added to the bottom ... then the second slit would be the middle 4 rows printed twice [up and down], and the top/bottom 4 rows printed once [middle]?

Is there a way to know which is slit A and which is slit B? [if they are distinguished as A/B, or 1/2]

I also count 197-283 to be 4+83=87 cards. Any idea what the 88th card would be? Or maybe these series card number ranges are incorrect from TCDb? "Distributed in seven series: #1-109, #110-196, #197-283, #284-370, #371-446, #447-522, and #523-598".

I'll await to hear what you [or Kevin] say later. Thanks
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  #52  
Old 09-20-2023, 02:06 PM
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It has two Checklists, one of them is from the previous Series. That was standard practice for Topps in the sixties.
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  #53  
Old 09-20-2023, 02:42 PM
jmoran19 jmoran19 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliff Bowman View Post
Ah, I see now, it looks like the bottom row was cut way too close and is missing the wood panel border below the cards. I would say this particular Slit is missing the bottom two rows so it wouldn’t contain another Mantle row. Since this is a 88 card Series that means the other Slit would contain two Mantle cards, one Slit has 44 cards printed twice and the other Slit has the other 44 card printed twice so that all 88 cards are printed three times over the two Slits.
Correct, this is missing the bottom two rows as Mantle is only on this slit once

John
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  #54  
Old 09-20-2023, 08:31 PM
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I just now looked, Kevin and I have reconstructed the 1962 Topps 1st, 4th, 6th, and 7th Series so apparently there are already known scans or pics of the 2nd, 3rd, and 5th Series. The rows in the 7th Series are already known we just figured out the order of both Slits. The 1962 4th Series has already been shown in this thread, so hopefully the 1st, 6th, and 7th will eventually be shown here. Full complete sheets of 1961 1st and 7th, 1963 3rd, and 1964 6th still need to be shown too.
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Last edited by Cliff Bowman; 09-20-2023 at 08:35 PM. Reason: Missed a word
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  #55  
Old 09-21-2023, 06:18 AM
stevepoland stevepoland is offline
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I haven't seen the scans/pics of 1962 3rd series (Mantle). I'd love to know the order of both Slits if anyone finds this.
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  #56  
Old 09-21-2023, 06:38 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Default 1962 Topps series sheets

Here are some of the series I have. A recap: (each row has 11 cards).

Series 1 has 110 cards, so 4 rows are printed 3x each, while the remaining 6 rows are printed 2x each.

Series 2, 3,and 4 have 88 different cards, so each row is printed 3x each across the two slits. One slit will have 4 rows 2x and four rows 1x each, while the other slit will reverse that.

Series 5, 6, & 7 have 77 different cards each. For these series, there are 3 rows printed 4x each, and four rows printed 3x each.

Cliff & I have created the layouts for both slits of series 1, 5, 6, and 7 based on miscuts, uncut material, etc. I haven't seen that info made into a visual layout, although we have it in Excel format.

1962_series 2.jpg

62series3.jpg

62series5full.jpg
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  #57  
Old 09-21-2023, 07:24 AM
stevepoland stevepoland is offline
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Nice! Question- How do you know that Series 3 1962 sheet is Slit A?

I presume Slit A is left side of a full sheet?
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  #58  
Old 09-21-2023, 08:18 AM
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Here's a photo (I don't own it) of the other Series 3 slit from 1962.
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File Type: jpeg 1962t-3rd-uncut-1a.jpeg (137.8 KB, 400 views)
File Type: jpeg 1962t-3rd-uncut-1b.jpeg (112.3 KB, 409 views)
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  #59  
Old 09-21-2023, 01:43 PM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Default Slit a vs b

Unless we find a miscut with a distinguishing mark indicating slit a or b, we just call one of them A and the other B. Perhaps I should just say one slit looks like blah blah blah while the other looks like etc.
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  #60  
Old 09-23-2023, 04:09 AM
wpeters wpeters is offline
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Default 1966 Uncut Strip

I found this at a flea market and was wondering what it was. It is blank backed. Thanks.
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File Type: jpg IMG_9099.jpg (199.9 KB, 380 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_9100.jpg (192.5 KB, 375 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_9101.jpg (200.3 KB, 381 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_9103.jpg (171.9 KB, 375 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_9102.JPG (138.3 KB, 380 views)
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  #61  
Old 09-23-2023, 05:44 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Default 1966 series 5 uncut panel

Nice find on that uncut panel. It is from the 1966 series 5 print sheet. It certainly would have save Cliff and me some work when we were reconstructing that 5th series sheet. LOL

These are five cards cut from the Julian Javier row. They come from columns 7 thru 11 of that row.

My guess is that this is a printer waste strip that was discarded but someone salvaged it from the waste bin. Other thoughts?
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  #62  
Old 09-23-2023, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevvyg1026 View Post
Nice find on that uncut panel. It is from the 1966 series 5 print sheet. It certainly would have save Cliff and me some work when we were reconstructing that 5th series sheet. LOL

These are five cards cut from the Julian Javier row. They come from columns 7 thru 11 of that row.

My guess is that this is a printer waste strip that was discarded but someone salvaged it from the waste bin. Other thoughts?
For what seemed like a year we knew it was a Met to the right of Bill Hoeft but we didn't know if it was Bill Wakefield or Jim Hickman.
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  #63  
Old 10-09-2023, 03:40 PM
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Default 1964 Topps 6th Series

Once again, owing to the dogged research of others, here is a faux slit from the 1964 6th series.
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  #64  
Old 10-09-2023, 07:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deweyinthehall View Post
Once again, owing to the dogged research of others, here is a faux slit from the 1964 6th series.
Great work as always! The Baumann row, Angels Rookie Stars row, and Cardinals Rookie Stars row are 4x, the Romano row, Colts Rookie Stars row, Virdon row, and G Thomas row are 3x.
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  #65  
Old 10-10-2023, 02:59 PM
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That looks great. Thanks for the info!
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  #66  
Old 10-12-2023, 05:58 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Default 1964 series 6

Yes, this was one of the harder ones to reconstruct. Fortunately, there were many miscuts for the 1964 6th series, which enabled us to piece together the patterns.

However, the 6th series from both 1965 and 1966, continue to be highly problematic, and may be impossible to reconstruct unless some uncut material magically appears.
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  #67  
Old 10-30-2023, 11:08 AM
stevepoland stevepoland is offline
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Default 1969 Topps virtual sheets

It seems like all of these virtual sheets exist except for Series 3.

Are all of these virtual sheets posted somewhere on a website to view? I'm interested in Series 1 of 1969 at the moment. Thanks!
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  #68  
Old 10-30-2023, 11:35 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Default 10969 virtual sheet, series 1

I am not aware of any site where all of the work is published for the reconstructed sheets. And yes, all series layouts for 1969 are now known, except for series3.

1969_series_1.JPG

1969_series_1_slits.jpg
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  #69  
Old 10-30-2023, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevepoland View Post
It seems like all of these virtual sheets exist except for Series 3.

Are all of these virtual sheets posted somewhere on a website to view? I'm interested in Series 1 of 1969 at the moment. Thanks!
There are four 1961-1969 Series sheets Kevin and I haven’t finished, 1965 6th Series is impossible, 1966 6th Series is impossible, 1966 4th Series is very frustrating but we are only about seven cards from finishing it (of course the Tommy Helms card is a huge hold up), and 1969 3rd Series is a huge project. We know the ten leading cards of each row on the 1969 3rd Series and most of the right edge cards, the order of each Slit, and we have several combos of the cards in the interior but it’s just a huge blank hole in the interior. I’m sure JMoran or Kevin have scans of the 1969 1st, 2nd, 4th, 5th, and 6th Series Slits and can post scans. ETA Kevin just did.
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Last edited by Cliff Bowman; 10-30-2023 at 02:34 PM. Reason: Addition
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  #70  
Old 10-30-2023, 12:32 PM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Default 1960 to 1969 virtual sheets

To add to Cliff's comments:

For 1960, we know all of the cards in the ten unique rows for series 1, but not the slit patterns. Series 2 and series 3 are just about impossible to reconstruct, series 4, 5, & 7 slits are known, and 4 of the six rows from series 6 are known.

I have also attempted to reconstruct the series from 1957 to 1959, and can post that progress, if interested.
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  #71  
Old 10-30-2023, 02:17 PM
G1911 G1911 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevvyg1026 View Post

I have also attempted to reconstruct the series from 1957 to 1959, and can post that progress, if interested.
Yes please!
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  #72  
Old 10-30-2023, 03:46 PM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Default 1957-59 Virtual sheets

1959 -
Series 1 is a 110 card series. I have not seen much uncut material, just a few salesman samples. Therefore, this will e an extremely difficult series to reconstruct.

Series 2 is an 88 card series amnd a full slit is known, so the full sheet can be reconstructed.

Series 3 is an 88 card series with a few miscuts available and a [panel of 44 cards. Thus, half of the pattern is known, but the limited miscuts make this series hard to reconstruct.

Series 4 is an 88 card series, and enough information is available to reconstruct the sheet.

Series 5 is a 66 card series, and one full slit is known, so the entire sheet can be reconstructed.

Series 6 is a 66 card series and only a few miscuts are available. It will be extremely difficult to reconstruct this sheet.

Series 7 is a 66 card series and enough info is abvailable to reconstruct the entire sheet.

1959 topps sheet_series_2.jpg

59maris.jpg

1959_series_4.jpg

1959_topps_series_5.jpg

1959_series_7_half.jpg
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  #73  
Old 10-31-2023, 08:00 AM
jmoran19 jmoran19 is offline
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A couple more 1959 partial sheets that i didnt see posted above. John
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File Type: jpg 59proof.jpg (201.4 KB, 284 views)
File Type: jpg 59clemente.jpg (208.4 KB, 282 views)
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  #74  
Old 10-31-2023, 08:47 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Default 1959 Sheets

Well, that makes it easy to complete series 3 and series 6. Thanks
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  #75  
Old 10-31-2023, 10:59 AM
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Awesome stuff guys, I love the research.
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  #76  
Old 11-01-2023, 06:07 PM
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So much new information that Cliff and Kevin have put together. Finally knowing the truth about some of these '60's short prints! Huge amounts of new info for the collector! Thanks to Dewey and others too for additional help.Kudos to everyone that has contributed!!!!
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  #77  
Old 11-15-2023, 04:36 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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The 1969 series 3 layout is difficult to reconstruct for the following reasons:

a. There are 10 different rows, containing 110 cards.
b. There are not very many uncut partial panels (2 to my knowledge, with 18 cards).
c. There are not a lot of significant horizontal miscuts, which makes it difficult to tie vertical strings together.
d. The design of the cards requires a very significant miscut in order to get the information required to match up.

Having said that, Cliff and I (mainly Cliff!) have been able to put together a probable layout for the two slits, and place 82 of the 110 cards. The last few cards to place will be difficult.

The ten unique rows are headed by:

A. Harrelson
B. Hunter
C. Willis
D. Jerry May
E. Ricketts
F. Cottier
G. Jarvis
H. Kekich
I. Schultz
J. Weiss

The pattern for one slit is: A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, A, B, I, J while the other looks like: H, A, B, I, J, C, D, E, F, G, E, F.

Hence the four rows headed by Harrelson, Hunter, Ricketts, & Cottier are the 3x rows, while the other six rows were 2x. FYI: the Reggie Jackson card, 260, is on one of the 3x rows.
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  #78  
Old 11-15-2023, 10:59 AM
stevepoland stevepoland is offline
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btw, this 1962 Series 3 "slit A", is for sale by this guy. It's the pic above, which is a partial. https://www.preciouspaper.com/collec...-mickey-mantle
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  #79  
Old 11-15-2023, 08:19 PM
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This is for deweyinthehall to show how Topps welded 1962 cards together with different wood grain patterns on the 132 card sheets.
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File Type: jpg 62 maris - h jones.jpg (174.2 KB, 207 views)
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  #80  
Old 11-17-2023, 03:56 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Default 1962 series 7 weld lines

As Cliff pointed out in a previous post, cards in 1962 can sometimes be located above or below a card that has a different wood grain pattern. Those cards often can be found with a "weld" line between them, as he showed in the Maris miscut.

In the 1962 series 7, a 77 card series, the 7 rows are:
A Gernert
B Schaffer
C Rigney
D Nicholson
E Rookie Stars
F Henry
G Osborne

and the pattern we proposed requires that a top line be found on cards from rows A & B, while a bottom line would be found on cards from rows A, E, & G.

A search on ebay does indeed show those lines exist on cards from the appropriate rows. Conversely, I have not founds cards from rows C, D, or F with such lines.

Here are examples of a card from row A (#528, T Lown), showing that line at both the top and the bottom of the card. It is at the top of the card where row E and row A are melded, and it is at the bottom where row A melds with row B.

Hopefully, it is obvious that the wood grain patterns do not match when this melding occurs.

Last edited by Kevvyg1026; 11-19-2023 at 02:37 AM. Reason: additional info
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  #81  
Old 11-17-2023, 04:30 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Default 1962 series 7, meld lines

1962_528_BL.jpg

1962_528_TL.jpg
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  #82  
Old 11-22-2023, 09:40 AM
deweyinthehall deweyinthehall is offline
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Default 1962 1st Series Slit

Here is a mock-up of one of the 1962 1st series slits, based upon the detective work of others.

Cards with colored borders, particularly where the colors are variated, as with these woodies, are extremely hard to match up, and the fact that any images you can find are all slightly different - off-center, tilt cuts, etc. - mean that this image is best appreciated from a distance.

If you zoom in it will likely ruin your eyes.

Happy Thanksgiving!
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  #83  
Old 11-22-2023, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deweyinthehall View Post
Here is a mock-up of one of the 1962 1st series slits, based upon the detective work of others.

Cards with colored borders, particularly where the colors are variated, as with these woodies, are extremely hard to match up, and the fact that any images you can find are all slightly different - off-center, tilt cuts, etc. - mean that this image is best appreciated from a distance.

If you zoom in it will likely ruin your eyes.

Happy Thanksgiving!
Fantastic! There is a partial sheet of six rows (66 cards) known but as far as I know the other four rows (44 cards) were not known. What is odd about this Series is that the four rows chosen to be 3x don't contain any big name star cards, the Maris, Banks, Killebrew, Spahn, Musial, Clemente, Cepeda, Mathews, Koufax, B Robinson. Hodges, and Manager's Dream cards are all 2x. The 3x rows are NL Wins Leaders, Barragon, AL Batting Leaders, and Hal Jones, the 2x rows are Spahn, L Jackson, L Green, Maris, N Fox, and Snyder.
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Last edited by Cliff Bowman; 11-24-2023 at 08:09 AM. Reason: Correction
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  #84  
Old 11-23-2023, 06:06 AM
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Saw this 1957 Series 2 sheet in the current REA auction. Not sure if it is known yet or not. Nice that includes Mick.

From the auction description - "This full sheet originates from the famous Al Rosen find of 1957 Topps sheets discovered years ago, almost all of which were very heavily damaged. Some full sheets and many partial sheets in various conditions were salvageable, including this one, which despite its condition problems, is actually one of the better examples we have seen, and displays beautifully."
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File Type: jpg 1957 Series 2.JPG (156.7 KB, 243 views)
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  #85  
Old 11-24-2023, 04:56 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Default 1957 series 2 sheet

I had not seen that almost complete sheet. However, I had seen two partials of 66 cards each, which had given me sufficient info to determine the layouts of the two slits. Still, it is nice to have confirmation. Thanks!

Now, if only something would show up for series 3 or series 5!

kevin
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  #86  
Old 12-10-2023, 09:47 PM
Merkle923 Merkle923 is offline
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Default I've got some of these...

A little late to this but just saw the thread referenced on David Hornish's Topps site.

I've got uncut sheets - proof and issued - from 1959, 1960 (the Throneberry/Hadley "error" sheet), 1962, 1967, 1968, and a couple later.

The 1959 is handy (sorry it's wobbly, had to stand it up for the photo, too big for scanning). The key items here are: the white backs are creamier and duller than the irradiated white on the issued cards. The team change on Chick King's card is missing and that on the Bob Thurman is in a different font and color! Printed by Lord Baltimore.

ko
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File Type: jpg 1959 7th Series Proof - Front - 1.jpg (144.8 KB, 209 views)
File Type: jpg 1959 7th Series Proof - Back - 1.jpg (118.5 KB, 209 views)
File Type: jpg Chick King 1959 proof - 1.jpg (50.3 KB, 202 views)
File Type: jpeg 1959 King Issued - 1.jpeg (172.1 KB, 194 views)
File Type: jpg Bob Thurman 1959 proof - 1.jpg (50.9 KB, 207 views)
File Type: jpeg 1959 Thurman Issued - 1.jpeg (124.1 KB, 209 views)
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  #87  
Old 12-11-2023, 02:37 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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Would love to see the other sheets. In particular, it would be so nice to see a 69 3rd series, or a 66 6th series, or a 65 series 6.
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  #88  
Old 12-11-2023, 07:30 AM
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Gentleman,

You all are scary good and dedicated in recreating these printer panels. It is awesome to keep up with this post and see the progress of recreation.

HUZZZAH!!!!

Butch
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  #89  
Old 12-11-2023, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merkle923 View Post
A little late to this but just saw the thread referenced on David Hornish's Topps site.
ko

There are a few other sheets that we constructed on other threads that I will post here. I am positive that this is the 1967 6th Series 33 card proof sheet that you saw at the 1989 Guernsey's Auction, minus the MY in TOMMY.
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  #90  
Old 12-12-2023, 09:19 AM
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Reconstructed 1963 6th Series Slit not yet shown on this thread, there are a couple more.
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File Type: jpg 63 6 Series Full Sheet.jpg (227.0 KB, 184 views)
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  #91  
Old 12-15-2023, 10:10 AM
parkerj33 parkerj33 is offline
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Maybe i missed it but where is the finalized dual slits of the 67 7th series posted?

Last edited by parkerj33; 12-15-2023 at 10:10 AM.
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  #92  
Old 12-15-2023, 10:28 AM
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Originally Posted by parkerj33 View Post
Maybe i missed it but where is the finalized dual slits of the 67 7th series posted?
I don’t think anyone has yet made a complete virtual sheet of the B Slit of the 1967 Topps 7th Series where someone at Topps screwed up and had three Vada Pinson rows on the Slit, there is a known A Slit that has been shown on other threads.
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Old 12-15-2023, 10:29 AM
parkerj33 parkerj33 is offline
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Ok well I read above that only a few sheets are missing and the 67hi is not listed as missing


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Old 12-15-2023, 10:49 AM
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I can post the 1967 Topps 7th Series A Slit on this thread tonight but I imagine someone else might before then. The row order of the 1967 Topps 7th Series B Slit has been figured out, hopefully a virtual sheet of it can be made here in the next couple of months.
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Last edited by Cliff Bowman; 12-15-2023 at 10:52 AM. Reason: Missed a couple of words
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Old 12-15-2023, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by parkerj33 View Post
Maybe i missed it but where is the finalized dual slits of the 67 7th series posted?
Here is the known 1967 Topps 7th Series Slit, and here is a thread on the 67 7th Series Slits https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=285574
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File Type: jpg 67 7 full slit.jpg (146.2 KB, 166 views)
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Old 12-30-2023, 12:15 PM
deweyinthehall deweyinthehall is offline
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Default 1963 3rd Series Slit

Again, thanks to the dogged research of others, here is a faux-slit from the 1963 3rd series.

As always with sets that have colored bordered, please don't look to closely - it is hard to compensate for all of the variations of coloration in the individual card images.
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File Type: jpg 1963 3.jpg (221.0 KB, 147 views)

Last edited by deweyinthehall; 12-30-2023 at 12:16 PM. Reason: .
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Old 12-30-2023, 08:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deweyinthehall View Post
Again, thanks to the dogged research of others, here is a faux-slit from the 1963 3rd series.

As always with sets that have colored bordered, please don't look to closely - it is hard to compensate for all of the variations of coloration in the individual card images.
Great work as always! I believe this is the last 1963 Series of the five previously not known Series sheets that hasn’t been made into a virtual sheet. The 1963 3rd Series is 88 cards so there are no SP’s or DP’s, each card is printed 3x over both Slits.
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Old 01-01-2024, 06:45 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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There is an uncut slit where Bill Short is the top row, so the partial slit you have would have Osteen as the top row, with the two bottom rows of Bell & Fregosi missing.
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Old 01-01-2024, 06:49 AM
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The 1962 series 3 slits will have Mantle (#200) appear once on the Osteen slit and twice on the Short slit. Mantle is in the Ripplemeyer row.
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Old 01-01-2024, 06:53 AM
Kevvyg1026 Kevvyg1026 is offline
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1962 series 3, the Bell & Fregosi rows are the ones missing from your partial slit.
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