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  #351  
Old 07-19-2022, 06:59 AM
Hatorade Hatorade is offline
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Originally Posted by bnorth View Post
I love to bash PSA as much as the next person. Saying that they should have 2 different flips. One that says corrected and one that says error version or something similar.

Even those of us that super collect these things can't agree on all the different variations. We sure can't expect PSA to get it correct.
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Originally Posted by Statfreak101 View Post
You're right - but they could sure do the hobby & the people that pay them justice by doing it right.
https://www.psacard.com/articles/art...rading-process


I would assume that PSA isn’t using their Genamint AI technology for grading these cards yet. PSA says “It will also provide unique card identification – or “card fingerprinting” – by identifying the exact card in order to track provenance, resubmissions, condition changes and other attributes over time.” Genamint software, at a minimum, should be able provide a little bit more consistency when it comes to labeling Ad on Scoreboard vs Ad Partially Insured. It should also be able to prevent any of the error cards being labeled as Ad Completely Blacked Out and conversely any of the common cards/non-errors being labeled as Ad on Scoreboard/Ad Partially Obscured. The inconsistency and mislabeling are continuing with cards graded very recently with too much frequency to be an actual result of AI technology.

There isn’t a more relevant card to show that the Genamint AI software technology works than the 1989 Fleer Marlboro errors. It makes me excited about the future proper grading of these cards. If PSA is able to fingerprint an exact card, the changes made by Fleer to the error cards should be both easily traceable and also quantifiable with their software. PSA is telling us that they have the technology to grade the cards properly, so at some point why wouldn’t we expect them to get it correct?
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  #352  
Old 07-19-2022, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Hatorade View Post
https://www.psacard.com/articles/art...rading-process


I would assume that PSA isn’t using their Genamint AI technology for grading these cards yet. PSA says “It will also provide unique card identification – or “card fingerprinting” – by identifying the exact card in order to track provenance, resubmissions, condition changes and other attributes over time.” Genamint software, at a minimum, should be able provide a little bit more consistency when it comes to labeling Ad on Scoreboard vs Ad Partially Insured. It should also be able to prevent any of the error cards being labeled as Ad Completely Blacked Out and conversely any of the common cards/non-errors being labeled as Ad on Scoreboard/Ad Partially Obscured. The inconsistency and mislabeling are continuing with cards graded very recently with too much frequency to be an actual result of AI technology.

There isn’t a more relevant card to show that the Genamint AI software technology works than the 1989 Fleer Marlboro errors. It makes me excited about the future proper grading of these cards. If PSA is able to fingerprint an exact card, the changes made by Fleer to the error cards should be both easily traceable and also quantifiable with their software. PSA is telling us that they have the technology to grade the cards properly, so at some point why wouldn’t we expect them to get it correct?
IF and that is a very big if they can "fingerprint" each card at best they might be able to pick out cards that have been resubmited.

To me this card and the slight tint differences will never be listed by each variation because of the very slight tinting differances. The Bill Ripken to me is the perfect card because there are very distinct differances in them.
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  #353  
Old 07-19-2022, 01:28 PM
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It just is maddening, infuriating, when you see cards listed on eBay that are "Marlboro Ad on Scoreboard" that are LESS VISIBLE than ones that get the "Ad Partially Obscured" label.

Of course when you reach out to PSA about it, they just throw their hands up in the air and tell you there is nothing they can do about it.

Frustrating!
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  #354  
Old 07-22-2022, 10:59 PM
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I would like to see the variations on the label one day
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  #355  
Old 09-04-2022, 10:25 AM
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Did one of you get this? It was purchased just as I opened the counter offer. Congratulations to whoever got it.
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  #356  
Old 09-14-2022, 08:16 AM
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Did one of you get this? It was purchased just as I opened the counter offer. Congratulations to whoever got it.
That would be me, good sir!
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  #357  
Old 09-14-2022, 08:39 AM
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That would be me, good sir!
you gonna open it? would love to hear how that goes
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  #358  
Old 09-14-2022, 08:45 AM
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you gonna open it? would love to hear how that goes
Will most likely be sending to BBCE first and then probably open a box or two. May sell a couple, too.
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  #359  
Old 09-14-2022, 11:20 AM
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Will most likely be sending to BBCE first and then probably open a box or two. May sell a couple, too.
nice nice. keep all of us randy marlboro nerds posted
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  #360  
Old 09-15-2022, 10:15 AM
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nice nice. keep all of us randy marlboro nerds posted
Will do - I am hoping there are 20 boxes with the Clear Marlboro showing.

Ha!
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  #361  
Old 09-16-2022, 06:54 AM
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That would be me, good sir!
Congratulations! I've never seen one with such an early code. I hope you get a bunch of clears and blues!!
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  #362  
Old 09-17-2022, 08:02 AM
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Anyone interested in a weekend project?

I posted 50 RJ rookies for sale in the summer.

No Marlboro but maybe some of these other variations?

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/top...ink_source=app

Best,
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  #363  
Old 09-17-2022, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ejstel View Post
Anyone interested in a weekend project?

I posted 50 RJ rookies for sale in the summer.

No Marlboro but maybe some of these other variations?

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/top...ink_source=app

Best,
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Do you have better pics of the sign area? The ones I can make out are all the fully blacked out version.
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  #364  
Old 09-17-2022, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ejstel View Post
Anyone interested in a weekend project?

I posted 50 RJ rookies for sale in the summer.

No Marlboro but maybe some of these other variations?

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/top...ink_source=app

Best,
Ed

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Relist the Johnson cards with way better pictures and a realistic price and they might sell.

Would need to see what version every card is. Your price would be good if they all had the box version error. The regular version like the ones that can be seen in your listing are $.50 cards on a good day IMHO.
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  #365  
Old 09-17-2022, 07:01 PM
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Thanks- I'm good

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  #366  
Old 10-12-2022, 10:09 PM
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https://www.sbnation.com/2022/10/12/...o-nfl-mariners

Maybe Randy’s passion and knowledge of photography ties into the story of the Marlboro advertisement appearing directly behind The Unit in both the 1989 Fleer and 1987 Donn Jennings cards. It seems plausible that Randy could have picked or contributed to his placement in the photos. It may be more than a coincidence the Marlboro ad and iconic Liberty Bell are located behind him. The image on the 89 Fleer has some amazing depth of field and none of the other photos taken of players that day had any similar angle/background.
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  #367  
Old 11-05-2022, 10:43 AM
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is there any direct interview with randy asking him about this?
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  #368  
Old 12-16-2022, 09:38 AM
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Just in case anyone is looking for an instant collection of Randys, I'll be parting with my collection.

https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=329078
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  #369  
Old 12-16-2022, 09:54 AM
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Just in case anyone is looking for an instant collection of Randys, I'll be parting with my collection.

https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=329078
Great cards GLWS.
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  #370  
Old 12-16-2022, 10:49 AM
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Great cards GLWS.
Thank you. Now if only I could magically show them online as they appear in hand.

That said, I can't say that I really want to sell them...
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  #371  
Old 12-16-2022, 11:25 AM
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Thank you. Now if only I could magically show them online as they appear in hand.

That said, I can't say that I really want to sell them...
I hear you. I have always had trouble getting good pics of them. What works best for me is taking a picture of them in direct sunlight.
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  #372  
Old 12-21-2022, 05:33 PM
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Just in case anyone is looking for an instant collection of Randys, I'll be parting with my collection.

https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=329078
I'm sorry to hear it but understand too. I swear it seems like PSA is trying to kill this card. I've never seen their labeling convention so out of whack. I'm currently battling to get this one relabeled as Ad on Scoreboard but they are holding firm on the Partially Obscured label. I just don't get it...
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  #373  
Old 12-21-2022, 06:51 PM
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I'm sorry to hear it but understand too. I swear it seems like PSA is trying to kill this card. I've never seen their labeling convention so out of whack. I'm currently battling to get this one relabeled as Ad on Scoreboard but they are holding firm on the Partially Obscured label. I just don't get it...
It is not just that card they don't discriminate. They will screw up any card at any time for any reason.

Did you ever get the somewhat similar card I sent you graded? Been meaning to ask for a while.
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  #374  
Old 12-22-2022, 11:07 AM
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I'm sorry to hear it but understand too. I swear it seems like PSA is trying to kill this card. I've never seen their labeling convention so out of whack. I'm currently battling to get this one relabeled as Ad on Scoreboard but they are holding firm on the Partially Obscured label. I just don't get it...
Yep - and yet, you can search eBay and other sale sites and see "Marlboro Ad on Scoreboard" cards that show corrected versions, black boxes, partial ads showing, etc.

It is so dumb.
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  #375  
Old 12-22-2022, 02:07 PM
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It is not just that card they don't discriminate. They will screw up any card at any time for any reason.

Did you ever get the somewhat similar card I sent you graded? Been meaning to ask for a while.
Ben, this is actually a different card than the one you sent me. I cropped the above pic from this one (see the uncropped card below). I bought this already graded card on eBay last month. I just sent you a PM about the similar one you sent me.
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  #376  
Old 12-22-2022, 02:24 PM
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Ben, this is actually a different card than the one you sent me. I cropped the above pic from this one (see the uncropped card below). I bought this already graded card on eBay last month. I just sent you a PM about the similar one you sent me.
That is why I said somewhat similar. The one in the post is a very nice card. Sadly as I age and my eyesight gets worse I have less and less interest in the Johnson cards. With the many versions a person needs great eyes to appreciate them fully.
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  #377  
Old 01-06-2023, 09:36 AM
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https://www.ebay.com/itm/16587205026...Bk9SR9rX-v6wYQ

Pardon my language, but is this a fucking joke?
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  #378  
Old 01-06-2023, 10:22 AM
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https://www.ebay.com/itm/16587205026...Bk9SR9rX-v6wYQ

Pardon my language, but is this a fucking joke?
Yes and no. That is just the normal quality of grading by PSA. On the other hand I love screw ups so I will be bidding on it.
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  #379  
Old 01-06-2023, 11:24 AM
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Yes and no. That is just the normal quality of grading by PSA. On the other hand I love screw ups so I will be bidding on it.
It just ticks me off when I am sitting on a mountain of clearer Marlboro ads that were labeled as "partial" and then I see this nonsense.

What a joke.
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  #380  
Old 01-09-2023, 01:28 PM
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It just ticks me off when I am sitting on a mountain of clearer Marlboro ads that were labeled as "partial" and then I see this nonsense.

What a joke.
Agreed. It doesn't make sense to me either. Obviously they just don't care. In my opinion I would rather they ditched their labeling convention on the card entirely if they can't apply it consistently (and communicate the convention to collectors). At least then people wouldn't be confused by inconsistencies in labeling the exact same variation multiple ways.
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  #381  
Old 01-15-2023, 12:06 PM
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Default Easier way to view Marlboro letters in blue stencil cards

It can be a little difficult to see the "Marlboro" letters in blue stencil (i.e., negative) version cards shown in posts #284 and #301. As my eyes get worse I need to tilt the card just so in the light for the letters to appear clearly. I just found that if you shine a black light on the sign the letters stand out immediately and quite clearly. In case anyone is interested, here are a couple pics showing the cards with my black light pen shining on the signs.

Unless the lights are on bright in a room it can be hard to differentiate versions outside of the clear one. This little trick with the blacklight should help me find the blue stencil ones quickly from now on.
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File Type: jpg 20230115_132912.jpg (174.6 KB, 193 views)
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  #382  
Old 01-15-2023, 12:38 PM
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That is a great tip. Any idea how many are known? They are a fairly new version to me.
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  #383  
Old 01-16-2023, 07:25 AM
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That is a great tip. Any idea how many are known? They are a fairly new version to me.
I'm only aware of 4 of these blue stencil cards currently (I have 2 light blue stencils and 1 dark blue (which is a more "blue box" like stencil) and Hatorade I believe has has one dark blue one). However it is a more obscure version that people may not immediately realize they have (unlike the blue/turquoise tint, and clear versions which immediately stand out). You had mentioned to me that the 2 blue stencil cards (one with darker blue and one with lighter blue) are really the same version - and the difference between them is the ink level. In that case I would expect many more of these to be out there somewhere with varying degrees of blue ink level between the dark and light ones I have.

Hopefully this blacklight "trick" will help more come out of the woodwork. If anyone finds any of these blue stencil cards it would be great if you could post pics of the signs on the cards for comparison. For this purpose the blacklight trick works really well too.
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  #384  
Old 01-16-2023, 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Statfreak101 View Post
https://www.ebay.com/itm/16587205026...Bk9SR9rX-v6wYQ

Pardon my language, but is this a fucking joke?
This card just sold and went for more than I would pay. Any guesses on what version it actually is? It is obviously not a corrected version.
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  #385  
Old 01-17-2023, 01:06 PM
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This card just sold and went for more than I would pay. Any guesses on what version it actually is? It is obviously not a corrected version.
How can you say it is not a corrected version based on the pictures in the listing?
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  #386  
Old 01-17-2023, 02:41 PM
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How can you say it is not a corrected version based on the pictures in the listing?
Look above his left ear and tell me that is a corrected version.
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  #387  
Old 01-17-2023, 03:00 PM
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Look above his left ear and tell me that is a corrected version.
Gotcha.

I don't view that card and the one without the gap between his ear as anything significant. Point of my original post was that this is no way, in any possible manner, an ad visible card.
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  #388  
Old 01-17-2023, 03:07 PM
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Gotcha.

I don't view that card and the one without the gap between his ear as anything significant. Point of my original post was that this is no way, in any possible manner, an ad visible card.
The gap just means it is anything but the corrected version. I would guess it is one of the super dark green box cards.
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  #389  
Old 01-18-2023, 06:38 AM
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The gap just means it is anything but the corrected version. I would guess it is one of the super dark green box cards.
That isn't necessarily true - there are black/corrected (not the final version) versions without the gap that show no ad or box.
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  #390  
Old 01-18-2023, 06:44 AM
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That isn't necessarily true - there are black/corrected (not the final version) versions without the gap that show no ad or box.
I have never seen one. I believe Dylan once said he had one or seen one but that is the only time I have heard of one. Do you have one?
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  #391  
Old 01-18-2023, 09:19 AM
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I have never seen one. I believe Dylan once said he had one or seen one but that is the only time I have heard of one. Do you have one?
Yes, I have multiple of those.
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  #392  
Old 01-18-2023, 09:20 AM
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I have never seen one. I believe Dylan once said he had one or seen one but that is the only time I have heard of one. Do you have one?
Absolutely have seen what appears to be this type. I say what "what appears" because all efforts have been exhausted to make out a box or any remnant of the sign in the two examples I have owned. Yet that little notch is there. Maybe someone with more advanced methods could reveal more detail?

I had previously been convinced that the only RJs without the notch are full, blacked out corrections.
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  #393  
Old 01-18-2023, 09:21 AM
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Yes, I have multiple of those.
I'd love to see a pic or pics of them if you get the chance to post them.
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  #394  
Old 01-20-2023, 01:21 AM
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1989 fleer could be its own netflix doc
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  #395  
Old 01-24-2023, 04:42 PM
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Yes, I have multiple of those.
Could you post a picture of them all together?
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  #396  
Old 01-25-2023, 09:21 AM
Statfreak101 Statfreak101 is offline
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Originally Posted by bnorth View Post
Could you post a picture of them all together?
Here is one of them.

https://ibb.co/RjhgTmL
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  #397  
Old 01-25-2023, 09:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Statfreak101 View Post
Here is one of them.

https://ibb.co/RjhgTmL
That is just the normal corrected version.

Look at the slightly higher black bar below the Bell. The version that sold has the shorter line the stops just after the bell like the many Marlboro versions.
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  #398  
Old 01-25-2023, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Statfreak101 View Post
Here is one of them.

https://ibb.co/RjhgTmL
Here are a couple close ups to show the difference in that area.
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File Type: jpg rj1.jpg (140.9 KB, 100 views)
File Type: jpg rj3.jpg (139.7 KB, 99 views)

Last edited by bnorth; 01-25-2023 at 11:30 AM.
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Old 01-25-2023, 02:03 PM
jacksoncoupage jacksoncoupage is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bnorth View Post
That is just the normal corrected version.

Look at the slightly higher black bar below the Bell. The version that sold has the shorter line the stops just after the bell like the many Marlboro versions.
Yep. 100%
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  #400  
Old 02-20-2023, 08:25 AM
steve5838 steve5838 is offline
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The card I posted a picture of on 12/22 has been reholdered by PSA.... but $39 later (including shipping) the label stayed the same. Here is the new scan from PSA. I still don't get it. I guess they are no longer putting the Ad on Scoreboard label on any version other than the clear?? After so much back and forth with them on this particular submission I will not be sending any more RJs to PSA. Be careful if having this particular label from a TPG matters to you. Steve
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