Ethics Question...OK or Crazy

[bmattioli]

When I was in High School in 1981 I remember a local here in CT burned a 1952 Topps Mantle in protest of the Baseball Strike..

[sreader3]

This reminds me, at a high level of generality, of the ivory destruction debate—except the stakes are much lower. Given the exceedingly low ethical stakes, I think destroying T205 Chases is just plain bats**t crazy. But I also respect the rights of the property owner to dispose of property as he/she pleases.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destruction_of_ivory

[familytoad]

Maybe a little tough literal topic about intentionally ruining a card.
If it wasn’t posted on cardboard lovers site , it may have gone in a different direction.

The physical aspect aside from the OP, it’s a good question about the “feelings” you get about the players depicted on the cards.
I’m pretty sure that’s why ALL of us are here.

If you read a story about a hero, you might feel compelled to buy a card of that hero.
If you read a story about a heel, you can decide to NOT collect that guy. Or if your own OCD would allow you a set missing that miscreant. (Mine doesn’t)

To each his own. I’m glad this thread was started and while I can’t condone ruining a card , I understand the intentions.

Phil made an excellent comment about history. It is what it is. (And absolutely is way more complicated than we’ve learned in truncated articles and text books)
We are collecting history! Pretty darn cool IMHO!

[Sean]

Originally Posted by JustinD

I feel as though this entire thread lends itself nicely into a soliloquy on the current thought of today’s society and reverence of the past.

And the current "cancel culture."

[Clutch-Hitter]

Tales grow tall over time, especially those of famous folks. And especially after death; have to spice it up.

IN MY OPINION

[Republicaninmass]

Presented, without commentary

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

I think they have therapy for those type of anger issues.

[jchcollins]

I'm of the school of thought that we should never get too close to baseball players or heroes in general. I am interested in baseball cards because of what the players did on the field. The backstory from there becomes much less important to me. If you don't approach collecting with this type of attitude, that's fine - but you have to remember that players are human beings just like the rest of us and in that regard, many come down way more on the sinner side than saint. Mickey Mantle boozed it up and cheated on his wife. Willie Mays is well known to be less than cordial when at card shows with adoring fans who have spent hours in line waiting to interact with him for about 15 seconds. Then you have the other big name athletes who are almost more famous for something they did off the field - included here would be the likes of O.J. Simpson and Pete Rose.

I guess you just have to determine what does and does not bother you. I don't need to agree with every waking minute of a player's conduct off the field in order to collect baseball cards. Were that the case, I'd probably need to go get rid of 2/3 of my collection. I will admit I don't like Barry Bonds, but I still have tons of his cards.

PS - one of my main boyhood heroes - Ryne Sandberg of the Cubs - is now endorsing cannabis products and marijuana derivatives. The jokes about Ryno the pothead have already made their first waves on the interwebs. Am I suddenly supposed to rip up his cards and give this newest turn of direction precedence over the fact that he's one of the greatest second basemen of all time? I mean, I could. But I'm not going to.

[clydepepper]

Originally Posted by butchie_t

Honus Wagner ate babies for lunch. It is a little known fact.......so.......Bring'em.

...and don't get me started on that Ruth guy




.

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

...Am I suddenly supposed to rip up his cards...

No.

You're supposed to take the card, cut it up, and flush it.

[jingram058]

The next time I go into an extreme over-reaction over a card, I hereby promise I won't cut it up and flush it, or otherwise destroy it, rather, I will offer it up via this forum. If it hppens, I will probably just give it away, free. Fair enough? I seriously do not think it will ever happen again, however.

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by jingram058

The next time I go into an extreme over-reaction over a card, I hereby promise I won't cut it up and flush it, or otherwise destroy it, rather, I will offer it up via this forum. If it hppens, I will probably just give it away, free. Fair enough? I seriously do not think it will ever happen again, however.

As a counterpoint to my sometimes annoying brand of humor, allow me to offer this:

Most of us have done something asinine with at least a few of our cards. Whether or not they'l admit it, at some point in their lives, Net54 board members have destroyed cards in bicycle spokes, lit them on fire (I haven't done that in a while...I swear) or thrown them away.

And yes, some people have torn or cut them up. Occasionally, it happens by accident when opening an envelope. Other times, the act is purposeful. I imagine more than a few Barry Bonds cards got destroyed on August 7, 2007. As an aside, the board would likely have cheered and given you a round of applause if you flushed cardboard depicting the "home run king."

Your post likely struck a chord with people because the card was a player many of us collect...from a set that many of us collect. In my humble opinion, it was rather like watching someone light their cigar with a hundred dollar bill.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by jingram058

The next time I go into an extreme over-reaction over a card, I hereby promise I won't cut it up and flush it, or otherwise destroy it, rather, I will offer it up via this forum. If it hppens, I will probably just give it away, free. Fair enough? I seriously do not think it will ever happen again, however.

We have all made mistakes, me more than most. Count it as a lesson learned and move on. It won't be in your top 100 mistakes you ever make. Not a big deal. Happy Collecting....just don't buy anymore Chase cards

.

[wazoo]

I like tacos

[packs]

I think it's probably best not to destroy cards. I would suggest looking into players before buying and then not buying cards you don't want as an alternative.

[BobbyStrawberry]

Definitely crazy, possibly but probably not unethical. If you do decide to destroy more cards, Marcell Ozuna wouldn't be a bad choice IMO.

[egri]

When I first joined here, there was a thread where a member asked about burning a T206. Someone said they’d be ok with it if there was something gained from it, like burning an original and a reprint to observe the differences in the flame color, which can tell you what materials were used in the inks. I can’t find it now, but I thought it was an interesting take.

[Fballguy]

Originally Posted by jingram058

Recently I bought 4 t205 and 2 t206 cards. One of the t205s was Hal Chase. In looking all these fellows up, I did not like what I read about Chase. He made Cicotte, Gandil, Weaver, et al, look like kindergarten. Not a very likeable guy at all. So I took that card and cut it up, and flushed it. I ask you, was that crazy? Have any of you gone and done something extreme like that? In putting my 53 Bowman color set together, I came across Solly Hemus and Enos Slaughter. I don't like those guys either, and the only reason I am keeping them is in order to have a complete set.

What exactly did the guy do? I haven't heard of too many OJ rookies being shredded. Was he worse than that?

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by Fballguy

What exactly did the guy do? I haven't heard of too many OJ rookies being shredded. Was he worse than that?

He was frequently accused of working with gamblers and deliberately tanking plays for personal profit.

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by Fballguy

What exactly did the guy do? I haven't heard of too many OJ rookies being shredded. Was he worse than that?

Here's a SABR article on Chase. It's bound to be intersting when the opening sentence is, "Hal Chase, whose big league career lasted from 1905 to 1919, was the most notoriously corrupt player in baseball history."

https://sabr.org/bioproj/person/hal-chase/

[Casey2296]

Originally Posted by Leon

We have all made mistakes, me more than most. Count it as a lesson learned and move on. It won't be in your top 100 mistakes you ever make. Not a big deal. Happy Collecting....just don't buy anymore Chase cards

Let's not be too harsh now Leon...
-

[slidekellyslide]

C. Stupid

[Mountaineer1999]

Hal Chase was a damn fine ballplayer, led the league in hitting once, damn fine ballplayer !

[FrankWakefield]

Redlegs manager Christy Mathewson wasn't happy with Chase as a player for the Redlegs... yet Mathewson didn't cut him into little pieces or cut him from the team.

On the other hand, at least cutting up that card took some passion. Card collectors with a bit of energy about these old cards can be a good thing!

An odd aspect of The Monster that surprised me was that I'd be hunting for a certain card, looking and looking (and lots of that looking pre-eBay), and there was an excitement in the hunt. And a bit more of excitement opening the mail. But then the card would go in a binder, box, envelope or stack, and that card was forgotten; all because some new yet attained card would become the target of the next search. The Monster's size exacerbates that.

[ASF123]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

PS - one of my main boyhood heroes - Ryne Sandberg of the Cubs - is now endorsing cannabis products and marijuana derivatives. The jokes about Ryno the pothead have already made their first waves on the interwebs. Am I suddenly supposed to rip up his cards and give this newest turn of direction precedence over the fact that he's one of the greatest second basemen of all time? I mean, I could. But I'm not going to.

Light up a Sandberg rookie, inhale deeply, and see what happens!

[Mark17]

Life is simpler for those of us who don't feel compelled to scrutinize other peoples' lives for the purpose of passing judgement. Especially people who are dead.

I wouldn't want Hal Chase as a business partner or drinking buddy but I have some cards with him on them. He's part of history.

[G1911]

A property may do what they want with their property.

I do not think it reasonable to destroy a card for this reason.

I do not see how one can collect cards of this era, know who Chase is to buy a card, and not know he was corrupt. It's one of the most commonly written about things of c. 1910 baseball, that Hal Chase pretty openly and continuously rigged his play and games.

But, I also don't get why baseball collectors specifically go after generally bad people and pay a premium for that fact. Chick Gandil had a 103 OPS+, about a league average bat at first base. He sells for more than some hall of famers, purely because he did a very bad thing. Eddie Cicotte and Vic Willis are very, very similar pitchers statistically. One cheated and was banned, one made the Hall. Vic sells for quite a bit less than the bad boy. Immorality seems to generally make people more interested in that players cards, not less. I'd subscribe it to "any name recognition influences value", except that the bad boys often outsell clean hall of famers with similar name recognition. I do not get this, but I don't get a lot of things.

[rholmes]

What you have to ask yourself is, what would Jesus do?

[packs]

Turn the Chase into a Cobb and sell it on eBay.

[dbrown]

I'm going to vote "not crazy."

I work mostly with books and photos, not cards, and I have definitely avoided owning some kinds of objectionable or offensive things and, occasionally, destroyed or thrown them away when they showed up in lots or collections. Even when there was money to be made.

We don't talk a lot about the karma that objects have, but that's kind of why we are all here, right? (Right!) And if you think some object has bad karma, you should do something about it.

I had not thought about that in relation to cards until now, but you learn something new every day.

[bmattioli86]

Originally Posted by bmattioli

When I was in High School in 1981 I remember a local here in CT burned a 1952 Topps Mantle in protest of the Baseball Strike..

gonna have to prove that one

[Lobo Aullando]

Make of it what you will.

https://www.sportscollectorsdaily.co...ll-cards-1981/

Originally Posted by bmattioli86

gonna have to prove that one

[sreader3]

Originally Posted by dbrown

We don't talk a lot about the karma that objects have, but that's kind of why we are all here, right? (Right!) And if you think some object has bad karma, you should do something about it.

I’m not sure that I am here because of karma, but to each his own.

[bmattioli86]

Originally Posted by Lobo Aullando

Make of it what you will.

https://www.sportscollectorsdaily.co...ll-cards-1981/

Wow!!! Appreciate the link!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[darkhorse9]

Coming in the board to post something like this sounds like a massive effort if "virtue signaling"

Seriously, why would you want to come here with a question like that unless you wanted people to think how wonderful your morals were?

[Fballguy]

Originally Posted by Lobo Aullando

Make of it what you will.

https://www.sportscollectorsdaily.co...ll-cards-1981/

I wonder if he lived long enough to learn the magnitude of his decision?

And if you think that's bad....I distinctly remember shredding all my Roger Staubach cards as a kid because he led the Cowboys to at least 3 Super Bowls my Rams should've been in.

Well maybe not quite the same...

[drcy]

Evil walks amongst us at Net54.