Goldin Auctions - Card INDUSTRY thread...don't open if not interested -

[68Hawk]

and then complain about 'another' thread on the site not devoted to T206 minutiae.

From Goldin today comes the below email, and what's interesting to me is the bolded section of new investors into their company.
What stands out to me is the heavy Sports athlete and personality representation, and the ability of those public figures to further the hobby appeal to broader markets.
The other night I was watching an NBA game where they were talking cards casually, and in yet another game where I think Grant Hill was speaking about busting packs live on the broadcast.

What many posters on this site think of as a bubble because it extends outside traditional collectors, is in my opinion the leading edge of a a significant wave of new interest.
I would guess less than 1% of the population currently ACTIVELY collects cards. Imagine if through public promotion by Kevin Durant and others that number went to 3% or 5%, or more.

You'd be looking at a many fold interest in purchasing what is in fact limited past stock, and what that would do to prices.
And I don't see a reason for it to go away.

The 90's bubble was about COLLECTORS fancying themselves as investors, and then crapping their pants and getting out fast as they could when spooked that returns weren't immediately there.
None of those losses would have been realized if they had held, in fact those cards would have been excellent investments long term.
As are most things. You never sell anything into a down market or slowed interest, if you can't afford to hold you probably shouldn't buy.

What's to prevent that 90's bubble happening again?
If card collecting becomes part of our common parlance, if big time athletes spruik their love of the hobby and show off their collections, we are looking at an uptake of collecting sportscards like has never been seen before.
And if that happens, and a certain percentage of the populace are invested, the long term viability is ensured because it's in everyone's interest for it to be ensured.

Here's Goldin's latest missive:

"The Chernin Group (“TCG”) Invests ~$40 Million in Growth Capital in
Goldin Auctions, the Leading Collectibles & Trading Cards Marketplace

Founder Ken Goldin, Recognized Pioneer in the Hobby Over Four Decades,
Remains in Key Leadership Position as Executive Chairman & Founder

Google, Twitter & Headspace Alum Ross Hoffman Joins as CEO to Oversee Product & Technology Upgrades, Enhance User Experience for Hobbyists in $10 Billion Collectibles Market

RUNNEMEDE, NJ, FEBRUARY 16, 2020 — Goldin Auctions, the leading marketplace for collectibles and trading cards, announces it has raised ~$40 million in growth financing from The Chernin Group (“TCG”), a multi-stage investment firm known for building and investing in leading, emerging consumer businesses in the media, commerce and technology industries.

Goldin Auctions will use the funding to invest in technology, operations and audience development to further build upon the trust the company has established with buyers and sellers on its platform. The investment is being made amidst record growth for both Goldin Auctions and the industry overall as collectors increasingly view collectibles and trading cards as both a fun hobby and a valuable alternative investment. The collectibles market is now valued at more than $10 billion in annual transactions.

Ross Hoffman, who has held senior positions at Twitter, Google and Headspace, is also joining Goldin Auctions as its new CEO. He will oversee the development of innovative new products and experiences that will redefine the collectibles industry and further cement the company’s reputation as the trusted leader in trading cards and memorabilia. Hoffman will run the day-to-day operations of the business alongside founder Ken Goldin, one of the most widely recognized leaders in the collectibles industry, who is moving into the new position of Chairman and Founder. In this new role, Goldin will leverage his extensive knowledge, history and relationships in the collectibles industry to help lead the company’s continued growth.

“The collectibles industry has come a long way over the last 40 years and its popularity today is the result of enthusiastic, passionate and knowledgeable collectors,” said Goldin. “With the help and expertise of our new partners, we plan to always prioritize our consignors and buyers by providing them the safest and easiest way to trade these amazing and valuable assets. As a result, we’re confident that we’ll help oversee the continued growth and expansion of the industry as a whole.”

“Ken and his team have built an incredible business and he is an icon in the hobby,” said Hoffman. “At the core, what they have built is trust: sellers trust us that they will get the right price and buyers trust us that they will get authentic merchandise. We authenticate everything we sell and we verify every bidder’s ability to purchase. The collectibles industry has one of the world’s most engaged and rapidly growing audiences. By building upon the trusted marketplace Goldin is known for with new technology, operations and content, we aim to make things easier, safer and faster for everyone in the hobby, old and new.”

“At TCG, we focus on identifying high-growth sectors and then investing in the best businesses that we believe will define the category. We noticed the explosive interest in the collectibles industry and we went very deep looking for the best companies and executives — Goldin Auctions very quickly stood out as the leader in the space,” said TCG Co-founder and Partner Jesse Jacobs. “We are investing in Ken’s vision, credibility and experience as well as Ross’s leadership. We are thrilled to be on team Goldin as it continues to give back to the community and provide more great resources, content, cards and memorabilia for its collectors.”

TCG has developed a reputation for partnering with companies that have a strong track record of fostering authentic relationships with highly-engaged audiences. The firm invests in emerging and notable businesses, including popular companies Barstool Sports, The Action Network, Hodinkee, Exploding Kittens, Food52, Scopely, Headspace, Surfline and Cameo.

In addition to TCG, several notable individuals and firms have joined the funding round including Adam Bain and Dick Costolo from 01 Advisors; Mark Cuban; Kevin Durant and Rich Kleiman from Thirty Five Ventures; Rich Greenfieldfrom LightShed Ventures; YouTube Co-founder Chad Hurley; Craft Ventures Co-Founder Bill Lee; musician and record producer Timothy “Timbaland” Mosley; Christian Oestlien, VP Product at YouTube; entrepreneur and creator Logan Paul; Anthony Pompliano of Pomp Investments; Shiva Rajaraman, former CTO of WeWork and product management head at YouTube and Spotify; Zillow and Hotwire Co-Founder Spencer Rascoff; Bill Simmons, Founder and CEO of The Ringer; Dwyane Wade of Wade Ventures; Mark Wahlberg; and NFL quarterback Deshaun Watson from Bleecker Trading.

Ken founded Goldin Auctions in 2012 and built the company from a start-up grossing $800,000 in its first year to over $100 million in 2020. To date, Goldin Auctions has overseen more than $300 million in sales. Last month, the company shattered the industry record for the largest sports collectibles auction ever, completing $33 million in sales for over 1,000 items, including incredibly rare Michael Jordan, Patrick Mahomes and Mickey Mantle trading cards. Goldin has been in the collectibles industry his entire life and has forged relationships with legendary figures including Shaquille O’Neal, Muhammad Ali, Joe Montana, Hank Aaron, Mickey Mantle, Barry Bonds, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Wayne Gretzky and many others.

Prior to joining Goldin Auctions, Hoffman served for seven years as Vice President of Partnerships at Twitter, where he led the company’s Global Content Partnerships & Brand Strategy team and helped drive $750 million of revenue annually. Before that, he held the title of Business Development & Strategic Partnership Manager at Google, overseeing YouTube's first live streaming team. He most recently served as Chief Business Officer at popular meditation app Headspace, where he helped diversify and grow the business to more than $100 million in revenue.

About Goldin Auctions
Goldin Auctions is the leading marketplace for trading cards, sports memorabilia and other collectibles. Founder Ken Goldin has sold more than $1 Billion in memorabilia from many of the biggest names in sports, history, and pop culture. The company routinely sets records for the most expensive trading cards and other memorabilia ever sold. Lifelong collectors and new hobbyists alike trust Goldin Auctions because the company professionally authenticates everything it sells. Goldin Auctions is the official auction partner of the Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame, The Major League Baseball Players Alumni Association, The Jackie Robinson Foundation and the Babe Ruth Birthplace and Museum. For more information, visit GoldinAuctions.com. Learn more at www.goldinauctions.com, on Twitter and Instagram.

About TCG
Founded by Peter Chernin, Jesse Jacobs, and Mike Kerns, TCG, an affiliate of The Chernin Group, LLC, is an investment firm dedicated to building consumer businesses. The TCG team has a track record of working with world-class consumer brands in content, commerce, and consumer-tech, including Crunchyroll, Headspace, MeatEater, Exploding Kittens, Food52, The Action Network, and Barstool Sports.
"

[Exhibitman]

Poor Marky Mark; didn't even merit a bold typeface.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Poor Marky Mark; didn't even merit a bold typeface.

LOL, that was exactly what I thought when I read it.

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Poor Marky Mark; didn't even merit a bold typeface.

He isn't in it to win it, and got the hell out

[esehombre]

Good post--and you are right, although there are similarities this is significantly different from the 90's bubble. I worked in a baseball card shop after school in the 90's. You had a bunch of local fly by nights buying up Phil Plantier and Dante Bichette cards thinking they were going to live on the interest in retirement! It was pretty funny. The day trading culture, Sneaker Heads, the marketing, the connectivity--and of course, like him or not the Gary Vee's of the world bring a whole new theatrical element to sports card collecting. It will be interesting to see how things shake out in the next 3 years or so. I expect LeBrons and Jordans to continue to set records along with Messi, Pele, Gretzky, etc to continue to rise to absurd levels. Man i miss the days of walking into a card shop and buying a quality or high grade rookie for $20!

[68Hawk]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Poor Marky Mark; didn't even merit a bold typeface.

And there was a reason I didn't bold Mr Wahlberg....

There have been plenty of pure celebrity collectors over the years from the entertainment world that collectors enjoy looking to, but they have rarely truly moved the needle in their respective hobby.

Wahlberg is a huge watch guy, has a magnificent wristwatch collection that's been the subject of a few watch enthusiast specials, but while his image on cardboard in a watchshop adds cache to the brand he wears it doesn't greatly change the number of collectors or purchasers of fine watches.
And by that I mean greatly, because watch collecting has undoubtedly been enjoying a renaissance in recent times.

But world known athletes talking cards, talking collections etc would reach an audience in the billions across the world, and who already have some knowledge of what a sportscard looks like and might have an appreciation of - even if they've never collected.

If you're talking mainstream collecting, as opposed to niche hobby, this is A moment we might be seeing where that takes place.
And it would have enormous consequences on prices and how we talk about it.

Course I could be jumping the shark here.....but it has that look and feel of an industry about to come out of the basement.

[todeen]

Originally Posted by 68Hawk

What many posters on this site think of as a bubble because it extends outside traditional collectors, is in my opinion the leading edge of a a significant wave of new interest.
I would guess less than 1% of the population currently ACTIVELY collects cards. Imagine if through public promotion by Kevin Durant and others that number went to 3% or 5%, or more..
"

I have no problem with new collectors. The fear for me is new collectors realizing they collected poorly, lost staggering amounts of money, and then leaving the hobby. Modern cards have high risk. RCs of Griffey, Thomas, Pujols, Ichiro, etc etc all tanked as they continued to age. Jeter and Trout are anomalies, and I don't think new collectors know that. It's a supply and demand thing. Acuna, Harper, Springer, etc etc will all fall in price eventually. If new investors enter the market for the wrong reasons, to make a quick dollar, than we are sitting on a bubble. I want every new collector to stay, but that is highly doubtful.

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[68Hawk]

Originally Posted by todeen

I have no problem with new collectors. The fear for me is new collectors realizing they collected poorly, lost staggering amounts of money, and then leaving the hobby. Modern cards have high risk. RCs of Griffey, Thomas, Pujols, Ichiro, etc etc all tanked as they continued to age. Jeter and Trout are anomalies, and I don't think new collectors know that. It's a supply and demand thing. Acuna, Harper, Springer, etc etc will all fall in price eventually. If new investors enter the market for the wrong reasons, to make a quick dollar, than we are sitting on a bubble. I want every new collector to stay, but that is highly doubtful.

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It's inevitable that some collectors will miss on their speculation over who will be truly successful superstars of the sport. Everyone who buys a rookie card of a player in the first 5 years of their career know that, and are just hoping to get it right. If they spend $1500 on a Zion card and he turns out to be just terrific, not all world, those collectors KNOW they risk losing that money.
And it's not like they HAVE to spend $1500, there are plenty of $100 - $200 rc cards of his that can be had for the pure enjoyment of ownership.
The ride they get through the purchase, through following that athlete's career etc is the road they happily get on.
If they lose money most won't slit wrists over it, they'll just move to a fresh prospect.
In fact, if you follow modern stuff on blowout etc you'll see that most modern collectors understand this very well and continuously talk about diversification, eg being in a number of top athletes cards, and the successful cards carry the loss of the ones that don't pan out.
Because of the money involved, I think many are alot more savvy about it than those who went wax crazy in the 90's.

I see one thing that vintage collectors DON'T get about the appeal of modern collecting.
You get to see live, ride the bumps and highs, pull like crazy, for the guys you've bought cards of.
That's a tonne of fun, a tonne of discussion worthy time on similar hobby forums or social media, and a tonne of enjoyment of the cards in hand while that player is still making their career.

While vintage is safe in that no-one can lose a stat from their achievements or change history already written, it's more a third person and historical/intellectual pursuit.

See the difference when Ted or others post about a 52' Topps they collected concurrent to the players careers, versus an old judge of a beautifully posed player.

There's no reason to dump by the potential new collecting community if it's simply a part of their sporting captivation, and like all collectors - they'll win some and lose some with their purchases.
It's no different to how it's ever been. There's just more noughts involved.
And don't forget, many will eventually find their way to vintage, so your carefully assembled pieces of vintage card will only have greater appeal going forward.

[todeen]

Originally Posted by 68Hawk

It's inevitable that some collectors will miss on their speculation over who will be truly successful superstars of the sport. Everyone who buys a rookie card of a player in the first 5 years of their career know that, and are just hoping to get it right.

I hope that is how it goes! I would love it if new collectors invest smartly. And I get pulling for the people you invest in. I saw Aaron Boone as a Level A Rookie League player, and I pulled for him and collected him. But I guess I'm just not overly optimistic for new collectors who feel this is a can't miss investment. MLB puts out their Top 100 list, and some of those Top 10 seem like can't miss prospects. But some years are entirely a bust when you reflect on the MLB 10 year anniversary prospect review lists. I guess from my personal view, I'm risk adverse. I don't like losing money, and I got burned out on modern.

I switched to vintage because I didn't have the room to store modern. I got married, moved into a small apartment, and I had no clue where to put my tens of thousands of cards. Most were worthless - 90 / 91 / 92 / 93. So I dumped them. That was 12+ years ago. And it's the same with modern cards today. You buy a box of cards, blasters, etc., and you gotta store them somehwere. If you buy boxes as a future investment, that takes up more space. 95% of them will be worthless after 1 year. What do you do with them at that point? I just see some most new collectors feeling overwhelmed after jumping into the deep end.

As a realist, pessimist, etc., I see card collecting like the religious "Parable of the Sower." One is planted on good ground, and two are planted on adverse ground.

[ejharrington]

Originally Posted by todeen

I have no problem with new collectors. The fear for me is new collectors realizing they collected poorly, lost staggering amounts of money, and then leaving the hobby. Modern cards have high risk. RCs of Griffey, Thomas, Pujols, Ichiro, etc etc all tanked as they continued to age. Jeter and Trout are anomalies, and I don't think new collectors know that. It's a supply and demand thing. Acuna, Harper, Springer, etc etc will all fall in price eventually. If new investors enter the market for the wrong reasons, to make a quick dollar, than we are sitting on a bubble. I want every new collector to stay, but that is highly doubtful.

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I don’t know about the others but Ichiro rookie prices are going through the roof. It’s amazing.

[conor912]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

He isn't in it to win it, and got the hell out

Awesome 😎

[Orioles1954]

Originally Posted by ejharrington

I don’t know about the others but Ichiro rookie prices are going through the roof. It’s amazing.

The others are rebounding as well. Griffey Jr. insert cards are on fire.

[todeen]

Originally Posted by Orioles1954

The others are rebounding as well. Griffey Jr. insert cards are on fire.

My concern isn't about rebounding, it's about the time spent at the bottom of the U-curve. Many of the investments today are about quick turnover. People are looking at the current card market to day trade. It's a very different atmosphere than 2002 - 2018 when Griffey's RC was at the bottom of the U-curve (after he continued to get hurt in Cincinnati....sigh...such high hopes in those first two years). I've never stopped collecting since I bought my first pack in 1991, but I also don't collect to make money. I collect for my personal enjoyment.

[Directly]

After one year and 2019-20 Prizm basketball retail sealed boxes fall to $50--please let me know--1989 upper deck foil packs boxes selling at $450 plus. Who would have thought we would see such a resurgence in sport card boxes.

[chalupacollects]

So now with all this attention and money flowing in, can we expect the card companies to start cranking up the presses to the junk days or even higher with more new hit or miss products or do they stay static with lower print runs, higher prices and more manufactured rarity?

[vintagewhitesox]

Originally Posted by chalupacollects

So now with all this attention and money flowing in, can we expect the card companies to start cranking up the presses to the junk days or even higher with more new hit or miss products or do they stay static with lower print runs, higher prices and more manufactured rarity?

they should churn out a ton of the modern basketball and baseball. just make so much of it that you cant justify a $1200 box of donruss basketball.

The modern market however, is catching up to the vintage. people who were teenagers in the 90s, and chased the popular inserts of the day (legacy, PMG, die cuts, of MJ, Griffey, ) now have disposable income to finally buy those cards. Whether the rarity is "manufactured" or not, the cards themselves are rare and command a premium.
obviously this is not the message board for this discussion ,as we all here have a significant interest in vintage. But 90s cards, at least those of Griffey, jordan, kobe, are here to stay.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by vintagewhitesox

The modern market however, is catching up to the vintage. people who were teenagers in the 90s, and chased the popular inserts of the day (legacy, PMG, die cuts, of MJ, Griffey, ) now have disposable income to finally buy those cards. Whether the rarity is "manufactured" or not, the cards themselves are rare and command a premium.
obviously this is not the message board for this discussion ,as we all here have a significant interest in vintage. But 90s cards, at least those of Griffey, jordan, kobe, are here to stay.

I agree. I've been collecting cards of the mid to late 1990s for years now, not because I have warm fuzzies of them as a kid but because I like the designs and the players. There were quite a few really spectacular insert sets and quite a few numbered SSP parallel sets. Take the 1996 Topps Gallery Players Private Issue as an example. Per Baseballcardpedia:

"All 180 base cards are available in a Player's Private Issue parallel, which is serial-numbered to 999 copies. Although these cards are numbered to 999, only 599 exist. The first 100 serial-numbered cards were set aside and given to each player as a gift from Topps. The next 499 cards (cards 101-599) were randomly inserted in packs. At the end of the 1996 season, Topps issued a press release where they said, that due to disappointing sales, they destroyed the final 400 sets."

Now, I don't believe that last part is true because I've seen cards numbered into the 900s--undoubtedly back-doored at the factory instead of being destroyed--but even so, the print run was under 1,000 and people have started to chase the biggest names and run up the price.

Maybe not to the taste of the majority here but no less a real thing than any other form of collecting. It is ignorant to simply write off the era as 'shiny crap' or 'junk wax', but if you do and you happen to come across accumulations of these cards, please mail them to me.

[Pjere]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Poor Marky Mark; didn't even merit a bold typeface.

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[pawpawdiv9]

MORE NEWS!!!

Reality TV star Rob Kardashian has decided to put his 1-of-1 Honus Wagner cut signature and game-used memorabilia card up for auction.

TMZ Sports reported Saturday that Kardashian, who pulled the card from a 2020 Topps Dynasty pack in November, reached a deal to sell it through Goldin Auctions, which expects it to fetch around $50,000.

https://currently.att.yahoo.com/att/...140651479.html

Here is the link to card in auction: https://goldinauctions.com/2020_Topp...-LOT77694.aspx

As much as i hate to see these cards..expect 50K is