Need Some Expert Advice - Results of Soaking

[Buythatcard]

I am hoping to get get some advice on this.

A family friend recently lost her Father-In-Law. She discovered that her Father-In-Law had some baseball cards stashed away. Since she knew that I was in the business, she asked me to help her out.

He had a stash of T205's & T206's. There were some Cobbs, Speaker, W. Johnson, etc. One problem. They were all glued to some sort of backing.
She sent me pictures of what she has. They look legit from what I can see but I am not 100% sure.

Here is where I need help. First of all, do these cards all look legit to you. Secondly, what would be the safest way to remove the backing.
I have soaked cards before several years ago and it all worked out well. But they were all commons. I am a little bit nervous about these, so I don't want to mess it up.

One of the photos show all the cards. The bottom row appear to have some printer copies of cards.

[G1911]

Legit and authentic cards. I’ll leave the removal to others who’ve done it more than I have, but these all appear to be authentic cards.

[Baseball Bob]

I would consult Dick Towle if he is still in the business. He did a great job separating my cards from an album and not damaging any of them.

Eric Schmidtke

[Buythatcard]

Originally Posted by Baseball Bob

I would consult Dick Towle if he is still in the business. He did a great job separating my cards from an album and not damaging any of them.

Eric Schmidtke

Who is Dick Towle? Is he member of the board?

[G1911]

Dick Towle ran a card alteration and modification service doing all kinds of accepted and not accepted practices both. He passed away last year.

[Buythatcard]

Originally Posted by G1911

Dick Towle ran a card alteration and modification service doing all kinds of accepted and not accepted practices both. He passed away last year.

Sorry to hear that.

[Jobu]

Most look good, but most of those bottom two rows of t206 look like reprints. Perhaps someone who wanted to display the sheets and didn't like the empty rows so filled them in?

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

Sorry to hear that.

Towle's family is continuing the business he started - "Gone with the Stain"

https://www.gonewiththestain.com/

[sb1]

All are real. The only question is will they come off with or without damage, which depends on the glue used. In some cases you can sell the intact cards for more money, than the risk/reward of removal, which in some cases actually devalues the cards if all does not go well. Nearly all of these are low grade cards to begin with, even without removing them and risking further damage. If you can cut one or two off a corner or edge card and soak to see whether they will easily come off or not, might make the decision easier.

Also, this will often tell you the preponderance of the backs, if you hit a run or Piedmont or Sweet Cap, the odds of rare backs goes down, as many smokers were devoted to their brands. There are a few American Beauties on there so, maybe a mixed batch.

[Buythatcard]

Originally Posted by sb1

All are real. The only question is will they come off with or without damage, which depends on the glue used. In some cases you can sell the intact cards for more money, than the risk/reward of removal, which in some cases actually devalues the cards if all does not go well. Nearly all of these are low grade cards to begin with, even without removing them and risking further damage. If you can cut one or two off a corner or edge card and soak to see whether they will easily come off or not, might make the decision easier.

Also, this will often tell you the preponderance of the backs, if you hit a run or Piedmont or Sweet Cap, the odds of rare backs goes down, as many smokers were devoted to their brands. There are a few American Beauties on there so, maybe a mixed batch.

I don't know who originally collected these cards. So, I don't know if they were all collected at the same time period. There is a chance of random backs.

[benge610]

Just throwing another opinion/perspective in here; even though the original cards come from the era of flour paste; looking at the natural wear of handling with age; these cards may have all been affixed with the dreaded, more modern era glues.
Scott (sb1) may have a view to get more comfortable with; should separation become problematic. Just my two cents. I focus on the beauty of "used" cards by the kid collectors over time; so I took that view from the first post here.

Ben

"I love baseball history backstory; especially when it involves cards."

[FrankWakefield]

Notwithstanding the foregoing...

I would cut the backing to separate one from the rest, and then soak it. I think it'll come off. If it doesn't, you can still declare chemical warfare on it if you want...

Soak. Not briefly dampen then tug on it XXXX SOAK. With water.

[swarmee]

So many people recommending Gone with the Stain. Wow.

If you use them, I hope all your cards disintegrate. ;-)

Maybe that would get the global card altering karma a little closer to balanced.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by swarmee

So many people recommending Gone with the Stain. Wow.

If you use them, I hope all your cards disintegrate. ;-)

Maybe that would get the global card altering karma a little closer to balanced.

Soaking cards to remove them from a scrapbook is allowed by every single grading company. You're free to dislike the practice, but that's a bit harsh to wish bad on others for doing something that is a widely accepted practice in this hobby.

[G1911]

Originally Posted by Snowman

Soaking cards to remove them from a scrapbook is allowed by every single grading company. You're free to dislike the practice, but that's a bit harsh to wish bad on others for doing something that is a widely accepted practice in this hobby.

"If you use them, I hope all your cards disintegrate. ;-)"

The criticism is of those who partner and endorse this operation, not soaking. We all know that Gone with the Stain was not running a simple soaking company, but are card doctors who did tons of unaccepted alterations with fraudsters.

[Leon]

Soaking in water isn't what he was talking about. They are/were most likely using some kind of solvent. And I have a problem with that too.

Originally Posted by Snowman

Soaking cards to remove them from a scrapbook is allowed by every single grading company. You're free to dislike the practice, but that's a bit harsh to wish bad on others for doing something that is a widely accepted practice in this hobby.

[EvilKing00]

2 bottom rows are not original. Someone here will be better to help u with soaking. Id love to see the backs once your done

[Buythatcard]

Update.

The owners decided to allow me to soak the cards.

All the cards were glued to a cardboard backing. Some parts of the backing had 2 and 3 layers of backing. In addition, it appears that most of the card had glue on it.

Soaking for 30 minutes definitely was not enough. After experimenting on the beaters, it turns out that most cards needed to be soaked 12-36 hours. The backing became very soft and was easily lifted off most cards but not all.
Even after the backing was either easily lifted off, many of the cards had some paper loss.
I suspect that in many cases, the paper loss was there prior to gluing it to the backing. It could also be in the areas where most of the glue was adhered to.
Almost all cards had some glue residue after removal of the backing.
I did not want to mess with it after the backing came off.
I soaked the first Cobb card. It was the T205. Surprisingly, it was the easiest. The back actually slid off by itself. Yet, there still was some paper loss on the back. See the attached photo.
Will the grading companies grade this card? If so, who should I send it to SGC or PSA?

This ongoing project has been tons of fun but stressful. I must have shaved 10 years off my life.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

Will the grading companies grade this card? If so, who should I send it to SGC or PSA?

They will grade it. Probably at either authentic or 1.

If you want it quickly, SGC will turn it around a lot faster, like 2 weeks. PSA might take 4-5 months.

My sense is that the sales price probably won't vary much between PSA and SGC for this item. While PSA historically brings higher prices in general, for prewar at this grade, I'm guessing the difference will be small, if any.

[Leon]

I don't think the holder is going to matter, for value, on that Cobb. I would send it to CSG....probably cheaper than the others and just as good or better. But that's just me. PSA would be my 2nd choice. Good luck and thanks for telling, and showing the, results.

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

Update.

The owners decided to allow me to soak the cards.

All the cards were glued to a cardboard backing. Some parts of the backing had 2 and 3 layers of backing. In addition, it appears that most of the card had glue on it.

Soaking for 30 minutes definitely was not enough. After experimenting on the beaters, it turns out that most cards needed to be soaked 12-36 hours. The backing became very soft and was easily lifted off most cards but not all.
Even after the backing was either easily lifted off, many of the cards had some paper loss.
I suspect that in many cases, the paper loss was there prior to gluing it to the backing. It could also be in the areas where most of the glue was adhered to.
Almost all cards had some glue residue after removal of the backing.
I did not want to mess with it after the backing came off.
I soaked the first Cobb card. It was the T205. Surprisingly, it was the easiest. The back actually slid off by itself. Yet, there still was some paper loss on the back. See the attached photo.
Will the grading companies grade this card? If so, who should I send it to SGC or PSA?

This ongoing project has been tons of fun but stressful. I must have shaved 10 years off my life.

[swarmee]

Nice soak. Good results.

[Buythatcard]

Update.

Finally made it to the T206 Cobb. It had a Sweet Caporal Overprint 350-460/42 back. Not sure how common this back is for this particular card.
Took awhile because had to wait till all the other cards around it were removed from the sheet first. They were so close together which didn't leave much room to work with.

Like all the other cards, there was a fair amount of glue on the back. A good portion of it came off during the soaking and the damage was not too bad. Still better than having a thick piece of cardboard for a backing.

Will be sending it off to get graded. Still trying to figure out which grading company will be the best for this card.

[Dead-Ball-Hitter]

Originally Posted by Buythatcard

Update.

Will the grading companies grade this card? If so, who should I send it to SGC or PSA?

This ongoing project has been tons of fun but stressful. I must have shaved 10 years off my life.

Definitely send them to SGC. You will likely get SGC 1's for the paper loss but they will look fantastic... maybe an Auth here and there. But they handle tobacco cards better than PSA. IMO.

Here's my only example of such a card handled as you describe:

[brob28]

You never can tell exactly how they will turn out; I'd say they turned out pretty nice Howard. As for grading I'd probably send those to SGC. As others have said, I don't think grading company is going to have major impact on selling price.

[Buythatcard]

Originally Posted by Dead-Ball-Hitter

Definitely send them to SGC. You will likely get SGC 1's for the paper loss but they will look fantastic... maybe an Auth here and there. But they handle tobacco cards better than PSA. IMO.

Here's my only example of such a card handled as you describe:

Thanks. I was hoping that someone would recommend SGC. All that I am hoping for are Auth's or 1's.

[Prof]

When you get to it, can you post a good pic of the Cobb T206 that looks orange instead of red? I'd like to see a close up.


I'd just send things to SGC for grading.


Congrats on the successful removals. Hopefully my first soaking project goes as well as this.