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  #51  
Old 01-14-2021, 12:04 PM
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Thanks Gary and Brent...

Brent, that green one was tailored to match the uniform (which I have as well). The lime green piping and pinstripes match the Uni to a tee. It's a Draper & Maynard specimen from the 20s. So much pride in workmanship back then!
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  #52  
Old 01-14-2021, 02:07 PM
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Mark- When do you date these caps to individually? This is a little out of my area and I need all the education I can get as I am looking for a 19th century example for my collection.
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  #53  
Old 01-14-2021, 03:10 PM
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Default what Gary said

except wayyy out of my area - I need a cap and glove to accompany my bat & balls :-)

personally I think that jockey cap is just great!
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  #54  
Old 01-14-2021, 04:46 PM
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Default A couple examples...

The red cap was worn by a pitcher on the 1899 Cornell baseball team. Eight panels, silk interior lining, no leather sweat band, no ventilation grommets, no visor stitching - which are all some indicators of any earlier cap. (There is nothing completely definitive, and earlier features can be seen on more recent caps). The stitched visor was first introduced in 1903.

The boater style cap is University of Chicago, c.1910.
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  #55  
Old 01-14-2021, 06:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryPassamonte View Post
Mark- When do you date these caps to individually? This is a little out of my area and I need all the education I can get as I am looking for a 19th century example for my collection.
Gary:

Here's a link to an 1893 Ad for Baseball Caps. Some very nice illustrations, but the Jockey Style (similar to my Orange/White one) got cut off in the picture...

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...rts-1923974706

The slouchy Boston Style and an earlier version of the Pillbox are pictured as well. More to follow...

Last edited by perezfan; 01-14-2021 at 06:36 PM.
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  #56  
Old 01-14-2021, 06:38 PM
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Originally Posted by vintagesportscollector View Post
The red cap was worn by a pitcher on the 1899 Cornell baseball team. Eight panels, silk interior lining, no leather sweat band, no ventilation grommets, no visor stitching - which are all some indicators of any earlier cap. (There is nothing completely definitive, and earlier features can be seen on more recent caps). The stitched visor was first introduced in 1903.

The boater style cap is University of Chicago, c.1910.
Nice Joe!

Painful to see that gorgeous Boater Style, as I think I contacted the seller about 5 minutes after you got to him. Glad it went to a great home!
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  #57  
Old 01-14-2021, 07:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryPassamonte View Post
Mark- When do you date these caps to individually? This is a little out of my area and I need all the education I can get as I am looking for a 19th century example for my collection.
Here are a few more catalogue pages and ads. The color one is from 1887; The two B&W are from the mid-late 1890s. I would love to get my hands on the pillbox with vertical striping (simply labeled No. 1), but I have never seen one come up for sale.
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Last edited by perezfan; 01-14-2021 at 07:33 PM.
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  #58  
Old 01-15-2021, 07:10 AM
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Thanks for the great information, Mark. Not to hijack this thread, but I have one more question. How do you identify a vintage 19th century cap from a modern one made for use by vintage baseball teams? It seems like a modern one could be easily doctored to fool many a collector.
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  #59  
Old 01-15-2021, 07:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryPassamonte View Post
Thanks for the great information, Mark. Not to hijack this thread, but I have one more question. How do you identify a vintage 19th century cap from a modern one made for use by vintage baseball teams? It seems like a modern one could be easily doctored to fool many a collector.
I can add a little here...there are certain features that are common in more recent caps, that you don't usually see in 19th century caps. Of course there are always variations and exceptions, but there are 'indicators' to help give confidence if it is a 19th century cap, or lead you to look closer.

- leather sweat bands: common in more recent caps, but not 19th century. The use of silk interior lining, covering the entire interior, is often seen in 19th century caps. From my honestly limited experience I have not come across a 19th cap with a leather band, but they very well may exist.

- ventilation holes, especially metal grommets. Vent holes are rarely seen in 19th century - where I have seen in 19thc they are stitched holes, and not metal grommets.

- visor stitching - The stitched visor was first introduced by Spalding in 1903 in their 'Philadelphia Style' cap.

- eight panels: indicative of earlier caps, but there is a lot of variation here.

At the end of the day you just kind of know from experience after feeling and comparing the stitching, materials and construction compared to a 19th century cap. A modern cap would stand out, but I am sure with enough effort and expertise you can give a modern cap that older feel and look.
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  #60  
Old 01-15-2021, 11:24 AM
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Thanks, Joe. It seems like a certain degree of expertise is required in the area of early baseball caps before making a purchase.
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  #61  
Old 01-16-2021, 02:26 PM
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Here are my caps. The first one is an Oakland Larks Negro league hat.
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  #62  
Old 01-17-2021, 02:08 PM
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Ron, who's the maker of the Braves cap? Nearly every one I've seen is made by Wilson, but I haven't seen an "M" on a Wilson that looked quite like yours. I have seen a game used McAuliffe cap with a similar "M" as yours. Here's my Wilson version ...
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  #63  
Old 01-17-2021, 08:59 PM
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To keep the Braves theme going on this amazing thread, here’s a 1959-1962 Louisville Colonels cap made by Wilson that I acquired just a few months ago on a local sell app.

The Colonels were the Braves’ top farm club during that span, and they changed the cap font to match the parent club. They were highly successful in those 4 Braves affiliated seasons, winning 3 league titles and a Junior World Series, but the American Association folded after 1962.

The seller listed it as a nondescript vintage cap but I was able to pinpoint it thanks to this newspaper spread I found on Worthpoint. No identifying player or number, but definitely from the era.

I love vintage caps, wish I could find more out in the wild, but then again it’s kind of amazing to find one like this 60 years later..:






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  #64  
Old 01-17-2021, 10:18 PM
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Default I’ll add one

PCL 1960’s Vancouver Mounties game used cap. Attributed to (and signed by) Ossie Chavarria
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  #65  
Old 01-18-2021, 09:37 AM
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I love those minor league caps! Both the Louisville and Vancouver caps are real beauties. Minor league caps seem way tougher to find than the major league caps. Here's another Louisville cap ...
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  #66  
Old 01-18-2021, 10:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eastonfalcon19 View Post
Here are my caps. The first one is an Oakland Larks Negro league hat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Counts View Post
Ron, who's the maker of the Braves cap? Nearly every one I've seen is made by Wilson, but I haven't seen an "M" on a Wilson that looked quite like yours. I have seen a game used McAuliffe cap with a similar "M" as yours. Here's my Wilson version ...
Here is the inside of the Braves cap.
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  #67  
Old 01-18-2021, 01:02 PM
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It's a Coane cap. I've never seen an example of a Braves Coane cap, but I have seen examples of Coane Dodgers and Cardinals caps, so they were definitely in the mix of supplying MLB teams. It seems like the competition among hat manufacturers was at its fiercest in the late 40s and early 50s, with Spalding, Rawlings, McAuliffe, Wilson, Coane and MacGregor-Goldsmith all making MLB caps, and with Roman, New Era, Mitchell & Ness and Leslie involved behind the scenes. I'm probably leaving somebody out.
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  #68  
Old 01-18-2021, 09:43 PM
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Quote:
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It's a Coane cap. I've never seen an example of a Braves Coane cap, but I have seen examples of Coane Dodgers and Cardinals caps, so they were definitely in the mix of supplying MLB teams. It seems like the competition among hat manufacturers was at its fiercest in the late 40s and early 50s, with Spalding, Rawlings, McAuliffe, Wilson, Coane and MacGregor-Goldsmith all making MLB caps, and with Roman, New Era, Mitchell & Ness and Leslie involved behind the scenes. I'm probably leaving somebody out.
Great insight! I believe Harry "The Hat" Walker had a line of professional caps that the Cardinals and a few MLB teams wore as well... The Harry Walker Pro Model, circa 1950s-60s.

One is pictured in this link...

https://robertedwardauctions.com/auc...ap-collection/
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  #69  
Old 01-19-2021, 11:50 AM
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Default Minors?

Is this a minors cap? Not mine, but is for sale. Thanks for the feedback!
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  #70  
Old 01-19-2021, 08:19 PM
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I have a number of what I call "letter caps." In each case, I can't figure out what team it is based on a letter or two — and maybe never will. Here's one that resembles yours, which was sold to me as an Erie Sailors cap from the early 50s. But I won't confirm it until I find a photo match.

I've never seen a Leslie label on MLB caps, but I have one on a Cape Cod League cap from the 1960s. The company definitely had a hand in making MLB caps, and the company name shows up on McAuliffe and KM Pro cap labels.

With a generic "E," it's going to be tough to ever know for sure what team it is.
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  #71  
Old 01-19-2021, 08:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Counts View Post
I have a number of what I call "letter caps." In each case, I can't figure out what team it is based on a letter or two — and maybe never will. Here's one that resembles yours, which was sold to me as an Erie Sailors cap from the early 50s. But I won't confirm it until I find a photo match.

I've never seen a Leslie label on MLB caps, but I have one on a Cape Cod League cap from the 1960s. The company definitely had a hand in making MLB caps, and the company name shows up on McAuliffe and KM Pro cap labels.

With a generic "E," it's going to be tough to ever know for sure what team it is.
Thanks Chris! Really appreciate the feedback. Great cap that you have shown.
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  #72  
Old 01-20-2021, 08:07 AM
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Thanks Chris! Really appreciate the feedback. Great cap that you have shown.
Also, I don't think you can discount the possibility that more than one team used the same design. For some caps, it's sometimes not realistically possible to determine team attribution with total confidence. But they're still cool, vintage caps.
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  #73  
Old 03-17-2021, 03:58 AM
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I feel fortunate to have added this to my collection. My poor flip phone pictures don't do it justice.
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  #74  
Old 03-17-2021, 09:19 AM
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Nice pick up Gary. I'd like to see a close up of the label — they often have a story to tell. I get my best photos of caps outside in the shade.

Here's a few caps I just picked up from the recent sale of KM Pro's archives. Included are two 1-year caps: a 1970 A's cap and 1971 Angels cap., along with some kind of A's prototype from 1968-69. Also, here's a link to a blog that features an interview with Paul Kaufman, whose father partnered with Tim McAuliffe to create KM Pro. https://tip-of-the-cap.com/
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File Type: jpg Small %22a%22 Angels cap copy.jpg (78.8 KB, 340 views)
File Type: jpg 1970 A's cap copy.jpg (78.4 KB, 345 views)
File Type: jpg Yellow A's cap copy.jpg (79.4 KB, 339 views)

Last edited by Chris Counts; 03-17-2021 at 07:37 PM.
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  #75  
Old 03-17-2021, 10:12 AM
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[quote=Chris Counts;2082207]Nice pick up Gary. I'd like to see a close up of the label — they often have a story to tell. I get my best photos of caps outside in the shade.

Chris- The maker is "Lancior". Also "Special Manufacture". I couldn't find any information doing a quick search.

Last edited by GaryPassamonte; 03-17-2021 at 10:13 AM.
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  #76  
Old 03-17-2021, 11:33 AM
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Spectacular, Gary! How did you ever find one, let alone in that condition?

Chris... Beautiful rare ones as well. That Angels with the small case "a" has always been one of my favorites. And they are way tougher to find than one would think!
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  #77  
Old 03-17-2021, 12:17 PM
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[quote=perezfan;2082249]Spectacular, Gary! How did you ever find one, let alone in that condition

Mark- I've known about this one for many years. The first time I saw it, I walked right past it. It was not the type of thing I collected at the time. Recently I pursued the cap and paid the price with no regrets.

Last edited by GaryPassamonte; 03-17-2021 at 12:18 PM.
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  #78  
Old 03-17-2021, 12:43 PM
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[quote=GaryPassamonte;2082261]
Quote:
Originally Posted by perezfan View Post
Spectacular, Gary! How did you ever find one, let alone in that condition

Mark- I've known about this one for many years. The first time I saw it, I walked right past it. It was not the type of thing I collected at the time. Recently I pursued the cap and paid the price with no regrets.
Makes sense...

Yup, as our taste evolves, we notice things that we once dismissed (or were not aware of previously). Wish I had another crack at some of the early memorabilia available 25 years ago. But was too busy collecting cards, autographs and bobbleheads to even notice most of it.
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  #79  
Old 03-17-2021, 07:44 PM
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I wish I had a time machine to go back and get all the things I wasn't interested in at the time, when I was only interested in cards. I recall going to a show in Michigan in about 1976. I came across a table full of 50s and 60s flannels — there were stacks of them. But I had just spent all my money on 1953 Bowmans.


[quote=perezfan;2082270]
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Originally Posted by GaryPassamonte View Post

Makes sense...

Yup, as our taste evolves, we notice things that we once dismissed (or were not aware of previously). Wish I had another crack at some of the early memorabilia available 25 years ago. But was too busy collecting cards, autographs and bobbleheads to even notice most of it.

Last edited by Chris Counts; 03-17-2021 at 07:44 PM.
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  #80  
Old 03-20-2021, 04:25 PM
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Default 1940s/50s St Louis Browns

Original and wearable if you so choose! Size Medium
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  #81  
Old 03-23-2021, 01:11 PM
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Here's my latest pickup, a satin cap. It seems like most satin jerseys and caps were worn in the 1940s, but I'm guessing this one was made in the early 50s because it has a stiff bill. The Rawlings tag was used around 1950. I have no idea what team wore it, but I'm guessing it was from Wichita, KS.
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  #82  
Old 03-23-2021, 01:29 PM
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Gorgeous early Rawlings example Chris! Such an underrated segment of the collecting world. Can’t help but think of Ohio State when I see those colors.

Regardless, that’s a beauty!
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  #83  
Old 03-24-2021, 06:04 PM
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This was the First Cap I purchased about 20 years ago from Grey Flannel. When MLB started certifying caps I became much more comfortable buying them. In the middle of a Kitchen Reno so have most stored away. But my focus is on modern 500 HR club. ( With a Trout just because) Displaying them takes up some room but I really like the way they spark up my memorabilia room. And much less expensive than Bats or Jerseys. I will post more in a few weeks if I dont catch too much flak for post war caps..
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  #84  
Old 03-25-2021, 06:05 PM
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Assuming, and hoping someone here picked up what I think was a pretty early baseball cap that just ended on ebay
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  #85  
Old 03-25-2021, 11:01 PM
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Quote:
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Assuming, and hoping someone here picked up what I think was a pretty early baseball cap that just ended on ebay
I know a very disappointed high-underbidder. Will be interesting to see if the winner is someone from this forum. It was a great score for somebody!
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  #86  
Old 03-26-2021, 07:42 AM
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Is this the one you're referring to? What is it?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/ANTIQUE-BAS...p2047675.l2557
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  #87  
Old 03-26-2021, 07:45 AM
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That's it! I was curious what era it was from? 1890s or earlier?


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Is this the one you're referring to? What is it?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/ANTIQUE-BAS...p2047675.l2557
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  #88  
Old 03-26-2021, 08:20 AM
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Is this the one you're referring to? What is it?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/ANTIQUE-BAS...p2047675.l2557
Got a ton of respect for the seller for not taking what turned out to be low ball offers to pull the auction. I know nothing about the cap.
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  #89  
Old 03-28-2021, 04:49 PM
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My caps. The Yankees and Dodgers are vintage New Era. The Reds cap has no identification, but is fairly recent, and I was told was a giveaway at the Great American Ball Park as a promotion. You would not believe how hard it was to find a 1939-40 blue/red Cincinnati Reds cap. No one reproduces it currently. If anyone has a line on how to get one made of wool, please let me know. I have tried all the cap makers with no luck.
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  #90  
Old 03-28-2021, 06:41 PM
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Ebbets Field Flannels has made a cap before that looks pretty much like it, and they call it a 1953 "Chorizeros." You might call them up and see if they have one, or could make one for you.





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My caps. The Yankees and Dodgers are vintage New Era. The Reds cap has no identification, but is fairly recent, and I was told was a giveaway at the Great American Ball Park as a promotion. You would not believe how hard it was to find a 1939-40 blue/red Cincinnati Reds cap. No one reproduces it currently. If anyone has a line on how to get one made of wool, please let me know. I have tried all the cap makers with no luck.
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Old 03-29-2021, 10:52 AM
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Ebbets Field Flannels has made a cap before that looks pretty much like it, and they call it a 1953 "Chorizeros." You might call them up and see if they have one, or could make one for you.
Thanks Chris. Yes the "Chorizos" cap is pretty close, but has red vent holes or grommets. I contacted Ebbets Field Flannels, they said they can't custom make one due to MLB copyright. Another cap maker said the same thing. I really don't get it. 1939 and 40 Reds were pennant winners, and won the WS in 1940. You would think they would be proud of that. I guess I should just be happy with my stadium throwback promotion cap, I am pretty sure that is what it is.
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  #92  
Old 03-29-2021, 10:22 PM
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Another option would be to buy a cap without the logo, and put "C" on it later. The original caps were not embroidered, but had a red "C" that was sewn on. This link shows some originals, which have royal blue crowns, and not navy blue crowns like the 1948 Indians.

http://mlbcollectors.com/CINcaps.php

Since I'm a big Reds fan, I might try it myself. I'm no fan of the polyester throwbacks, which seem to have the licensing market cornered.

I can't understand why MLB won't offer a high quality alternative — or let someone else do it. Both Mitchell Ness and Ebbets Field Flannels have made wool prototypes of old MLB caps, but presumably were turned down for licensing.



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Originally Posted by jingram058 View Post
Thanks Chris. Yes the "Chorizos" cap is pretty close, but has red vent holes or grommets. I contacted Ebbets Field Flannels, they said they can't custom make one due to MLB copyright. Another cap maker said the same thing. I really don't get it. 1939 and 40 Reds were pennant winners, and won the WS in 1940. You would think they would be proud of that. I guess I should just be happy with my stadium throwback promotion cap, I am pretty sure that is what it is.
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  #93  
Old 03-30-2021, 11:42 AM
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I have a few game worn hats. This one was worn during the 1971 season by coach Frank Oceak. It’s 50 years old now so I assume that qualifies for vintage?
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1971 Pirates Ticket Quest:
84 of 153 regular season stubs (55%), 14 of 14 1971 ALCS, NLCS , and World Series stubs (100%)

If you have any 1971 Pirate regular season game stubs (home or away games) please let me know what have!
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  #94  
Old 03-30-2021, 01:56 PM
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That's a beauty, Mike...

It's amazing how few of that mustard yellow style turn up. It's a beautiful and unique style. Hard to believe that was 50 years ago!
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  #95  
Old 04-05-2021, 01:53 PM
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Does anybody have any idea why someone paid so much for this cap? It went for more than $7,000 in the last Leland's auction. It says it's a 1943 Braves cap, but the logo was only used on the 1942 Braves jersey, and the Rawlings tag appears to come from the late 40s.
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  #96  
Old 04-05-2021, 02:53 PM
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Because the sheeple believe everything they see and fail to research these things for themselves. And it wasn't just one person... it took others to run up the price to that absurd level.

Lelands' misrepresentation of things like this is nothing new. It's a shame that some unknowing dupe was taken to the cleaners... but is not the first time (and certainly won't be the last).
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  #97  
Old 04-06-2021, 09:34 AM
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I guess it was inevitable that crazy prices would come to the realm of caps. I saw a 1990s Tigers snapback go for $600 a couple days ago, which is more than I paid for any of my 1950s MLB gamers.

I never cease to be amazed by how little research the auction houses do. Just last month, I talked Leland's into pulling a Bob Lemon Indians cap from its auction that was far more likely to be a Jim Lemon minor league cap.

Here's one of the most perplexing caps I've seen lately. Jonstats sold it. When I asked for more details about it, all I got was that it came from a reputable collection. It's a Frankenstein — the bill appears to have come from another cap. The crown looks like it's from the 1969 A's. I have 1969 McAuliffe and KM Pro caps for comparison. Plus, the stitching looks sloppier than any cap I have.


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Originally Posted by perezfan View Post
Because the sheeple believe everything they see and fail to research these things for themselves. And it wasn't just one person... it took others to run up the price to that absurd level.

Lelands' misrepresentation of things like this is nothing new. It's a shame that some unknowing dupe was taken to the cleaners... but is not the first time (and certainly won't be the last).
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  #98  
Old 04-08-2021, 10:13 PM
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St John's Baseball Team c.1902





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Old 04-13-2021, 07:53 PM
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Default St. John's Cap and Pin

Killer class cap and pin Dan!


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St John's Baseball Team c.1902





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  #100  
Old 04-14-2021, 08:24 AM
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Default Here are a few caps. Maybe I've shown some of them before?

1860's-1870's Peck & Snyder cap....



1890's Harvard Pill Box and Boston Style.....



1890's Yale Pill Box.....



San Francisco Police Department 1890's....



Harvard Crew.....



1920's Princeton Short Bill....



1919 Cincinnati Reds Sherry Magee....



1931 Eddie Roush Reds Road.....Note the holes in the bill for sun glasses..



1934 Reds Road....



1940 Bucky Walters Reds WS Home....

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