Thoughts on Crossing '50 Robinson from BVG to SGC

[p1ayba11]

Hi Fellow Collectors,

This is my first post on Net54 -- looking for some insights and hoping you'll be kind to this newbie!

I've just never been a fan of the BVG holder and would like to see this 1950 Bowman Robinson in a SGC holder to match up with other '50 and older cards I already have in SGC holders. Would appreciate any opinions on whether to submit in the BVG holder with a 5 minimum or if you think the better bet is to crack out and submit? If to crack and submit, any speculation of the final grade?

The centering is great, I don't see any creasing/wrinkles, and the card has good eye appeal. The top left corner is a bit of a question mark but otherwise looks every bit like the SGC 5's I already have.

Any thoughts?

Thanks!

P1ayba11

[maniac_73]

Can you post a picture of the back?

[vthobby]

I've sent MANY cards to SGC. I would leave it in the BVG holder.

It will not crossover via SGC if you put 5 as a min.

My hunch is SGC would give this card a 4 or a 4.5.

Just my opinion.

Very cool card and it looks fine where it is. Centering is beautiful btw!

Thanks for sharing!

Mike

PS I enjoy offering advice on cards like this and I'll make you an offer. If you send it to SGC and it crosses to a SGC 5 or higher, I'll pay you the $30 crossover fee. If it does not get slabbed, you pay. You'll also have to pay the shipping either way. Just trying to back up my opinion. Thanks! Mike

[Casey2296]

If it's part of you PC and you like the black apron I would give it a try, I have several BVGs that I'm doing the same thing with. Great card, hard to find centered. Good luck!

[hcv123]

Originally Posted by vtgmsc

I've sent MANY cards to SGC. I would leave it in the BVG holder.

It will not crossover via SGC if you put 5 as a min.

My hunch is SGC would give this card a 4 or a 4.5.

Just my opinion.

Very cool card and it looks fine where it is. Centering is beautiful btw!

Thanks for sharing!

Mike

PS I enjoy offering advice on cards like this and I'll make you an offer. If you send it to SGC and it crosses to a SGC 5 or higher, I'll pay you the $30 crossover fee. If it does not get slabbed, you pay. You'll also have to pay the shipping either way. Just trying to back up my opinion. Thanks! Mike

PSA and SGC have gotten harsh/impossible with their current grading. Based on my current experiences, I think you would be lucky to get a 4-4.5 out of them!

[jchcollins]

To me it would depend on what you want to do with the card. If you are looking to sell, SGC slabs go for more than BVG, but SGC is not going to give that card the same grade. As has been said, I would guess in the 4 range. If you are keeping it, I would probably just leave in the BVG slab. It's not going to get hurt that way and still presents nicely.

[pclpads]

The back toning and touched corners keep it from grading higher. How it got that grade is astounding. You can try the X-over route and ask for a 5, but I doubt you'd get it. Whatever you do . . . do not crack it out and submit raw. SGC could really screw you over. If it was for my PC, I wouldn't mess with it. The moral is, if you want one in a PSA /SGC coffin, buy it that way.

[Kutcher55]

Agree it won’t get an SGC 5 and if there are surface imperfections they could saddle you with a 2.5. Have you considered selling it and shopping for a new one? There are of course risks associated with all these options but maybe you could get a big price due to the centering. Although you would have gotten more 90 days ago it is still a very nice and valuable card and many collectors are ok with BVG.

[p1ayba11]

Thanks for some great feedback. It certainly helped confirm a few thoughts -- mostly that trying to cross anything over is a gamble and the odds are against you; and secondly, great advice that if you want a card in a PSA, BVG, SGC or other holder, buy it that way. I think I'll just put this one away for a while and keep my eye open for either a 49 or 50 in an SGC holder -- somewhere around the 5 grade. Just my preference on the SGC for '50 and older but have '51 and newer in PSA. Again, thanks for all the sage counsel.

[IgnatiusJReilly]

Lots of great advice in here but I I just wanted to add that I love the 1950B Jackie and this example shows really well. With a PSA pop comparable to the 1952T card that’s been on a rocket ship to get moon, I’m very surprised this beautifully designed card hasn’t seen more movement. Even if you dislike the holder, this is a great card.


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[p1ayba11]

Thanks again for all the great insights. So here's what I ended up doing. I decided to take the risk of cracking out of the BVG and submitted it to SGC with no minimum grade. As you can see from the before and after pics attached, SGC graded it a 4. Of course, wish higher but the 4 is pretty much where many of you had pegged it as the consensus was that the BVG 5.5 was overly generous. I would have been ecstatic had it come back a 5. To me, it just shows better in the SGC holder. I'd also rather have someone say "nice 4" than as with the BVG, look at it and wonder "how did it ever get a 5.5?" Not worried about resale here as it will be part of my collection and I'll be happier showing it now than I was before. I guess a good ending and just wanted to share the outcome with all of you. Any thoughts?

[toledo_mudhen]

There's a reason why Beckett comes in 3rd on most everyone's grader of choice.

Does look great in the SGC slab.

What was your turnaround time with SGC?

[jchcollins]

I would be very happy w/ that crossover; congrats!

There is nothing inherently wrong w/ BVG, they just grade raw vintage about like I did in 1989. Especially with midgrade and lower, they aren't on the same script that PSA and SGC follow today. That being said, there are still potential deals to be found with Beckett if you realize that.

But that Robinson is more accurately graded and looks better in the tux. Sweet card again - enjoy.

[ALBB]

Id cross it, why not

[p1ayba11]

I shipped priority mail to SGC on 8/16 and received it back 8/24 so had super turnaround!

[maniac_73]

Looks great in the SGC holder and I agree that an SGC 4 holds more weight than a BVG 5.5

[Republicaninmass]

Originally Posted by maniac_73

Looks great in the SGC holder and I agree that an SGC 4 holds more weight than a BVG 5.5

Agreed, lucky it wasnt trimmed

[Harliduck]

You made the right move...I don't keep many graded cards anymore except some of my 50's stars and all in SGC. It comes down to only one thing for me...they looks nice in the tux. Couldn't care less about any other point, and your card certainly looks MUCH better. Just an awesome card btw...one I hope to obtain some day...

[3-2-count]

Much nicer presentation now. I'd be tickled with the outcome.

[53toppscollector]

It looks 20x better in an SGC slab, and that is a very nice 4, one you should rightly be proud to add to the collection. Beckett still has a use in the overall scheme of things (thicker cards, rookie autos/RPAs), but I'd never ever send any vintage stuff to them. For a while I was looking at BVG slabs on ebay with the intention of cracking them out and sending to SGC/PSA, but I saw so many that were graded unrealistically and the seller was still expecting to get the equivalent grade in a PSA holder, just doesn't work for me.

Anyway, beauty of a card.

[IgnatiusJReilly]

Wow, looks awesome in the SGC holder! What a great example and now it has the tux to match. Well done!


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[phil22]

It looks a lot better in the SGC holder. I really like their holders.

I am about to send in several BVG slabs to SGC myself.

[ALBB]

Looks good that way too..but you could always criss- cross it back if you wanted to

[hcv123]

1) I agree about the appearance of the SGC slab. Imo it is the nicest looking of the 3 for most vintage cards.
2) The fact that SGC gave it a "4" is more a reflection of what is a changed/higher standard (albeit never communicated by SGC or PSA) rather than "Beckett getting it wrong". If you are looking at cards graded 10 years ago by the 3 grading companies, I would say they were likely graded with similar standards (the incredible subjectivity of grading notwithstanding). Stricter is not more accurate. It is just stricter. This would apply to cards graded by PSA or SGC years ago as well - (with plenty of exceptions) - on average, cards graded more recently, have been graded more strictly. Leaving a freaking mess today. Buy the card-not the holder! In all cases, a great looking Jackie and I'll finish where I started - it looks better (grade aside) in the SGC holder.

[ASF123]

Originally Posted by ALBB

Looks good that way too..but you could always criss- cross it back if you wanted to

Or wait a couple years and cross it over to get a PSA 1.5!

[Gr8Beldini]

Originally Posted by p1ayba11

Thanks again for all the great insights. So here's what I ended up doing. I decided to take the risk of cracking out of the BVG and submitted it to SGC with no minimum grade. As you can see from the before and after pics attached, SGC graded it a 4.

Wondering out loud... if put up for auction, which of the two would fetch the higher bid? It's gotta be the Beckett 5.5... right?

[IgnatiusJReilly]

Originally Posted by Gr8Beldini

Wondering out loud... if put up for auction, which of the two would fetch the higher bid? It's gotta be the Beckett 5.5... right?

I actually think the SGC would go a bit higher. I mentally deduct 2 full points from BVG to compare to PSA or SGC (maybe 1.5 for SGC). Also, I very rarely bid on BVG. You’ll get a lot more interested buyers with SGC or PSA. Just my opinion.


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[Kutcher55]

Cool thread. Congrats on the cross over. It looks nice in the SGC holder. I have always used the +1 rule on BVG as opposed to PSA or SGC in terms of relative grading toughness. If I had to take the over or under on that assumption in terms of toughness as well as resale value, I would take the over and call it 1.25. Which suggests that I don’t think there would be any resale value for the SGC 4 as opposed to the BVG 5.5. It’s debatable but if you’re asking if you increased the value of this card with the crossover I would opine respectfully that no you didn’t.

That all said, as a collector it seems to fit what you are after. I happen to own 4 BVG slabs. Everything else is PSA or SGC or raw. My BVGs are: Bob Gibson RC 5.5 that I think could cross to a 5 due to the centering and sub grades. Al Kaline RC in a 5 that wouldn’t cross to better than a 4 IMO. The other two slabs are McCovey RC 4.5 and Palmer RC 4. Neither is worth the bother to cross. In fact I doubt I wold ever cross any of them. BVG slabs are like fort knox to crack open aren’t they?