CSG Card Grading Comp - 1st card on Ebay???

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Makes sense that it's a comic book store from Florida first to market. They're local and already have a relationship with CGC/CSG

[68Hawk]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Looks like this seller from Florida has a bunch of CSG graded cards up for auction now.

Looks like all super-modern stuff, so no idea how it would compare price-wise to the other TPG's.


https://www.ebay.com/itm/2020-Panini...EAAOSwDVBgP88I

Gotta say, their plastic slabs are very optically clear and nice looking.

[Oscar_Stanage]

Originally Posted by 68Hawk

Gotta say, their plastic slabs are very optically clear and nice looking.

what time do you have to go into work at CSG tomorrow?

[68Hawk]

Originally Posted by Wid_Conroy

what time do you have to go into work at CSG tomorrow?

Don't work there, won't be sending them any of my cards, but I sure am partial to optically clear plastic.

I've bought all kinds of plastic polishes for my slabs because hazy ones really do detract from the experience of looking at the cardboard.
Haven't really fallen for any of them, and nervous to use the ones meant for car lens cleaning.
The slab is like a window to the soul for the neat freak, and a super clean one is just yummy.

[Oscar_Stanage]

Originally Posted by 68Hawk

Don't work there, won't be sending them any of my cards, but I sure am partial to optically clear plastic.

I've bought all kinds of plastic polishes for my slabs because hazy ones really do detract from the experience of looking at the cardboard.
Haven't really fallen for any of them, and nervous to use the ones meant for car lens cleaning.
The slab is like a window to the soul for the neat freak, and a super clean one is just yummy.

I had seen these slabs before and thus made my comment before clicking your link. I have to admit the Herbert card doesn't look bad. The label itself is actually really clean... it just needs to be much, much smaller.

I think the overwhelming consensus from the other thread is that they did a bad job on these slabs

[bobbvc]

For those who want to follow along, I bought this exact card in PSA 9 on January 27 for 21.50. It's already at 32.00 with 16+ hours to go. I only have a couple soccer cards and the PSA 9 is my only graded soccer card. It's a near identical comp although of course there are a few differences, timing, seller, etc.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2020-Topps-...53.m1431.l2649

Edited to say it's not "literally" the same card but a recent "same" card.

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by 68Hawk

I've bought all kinds of plastic polishes for my slabs because hazy ones really do detract from the experience of looking at the cardboard.
Haven't really fallen for any of them, and nervous to use the ones meant for car lens cleaning.
The slab is like a window to the soul for the neat freak, and a super clean one is just yummy.

I like this stuff - does a nice job on slabs

https://www.novuspolish.com/

[68Hawk]

Originally Posted by toledo_mudhen

I like this stuff - does a nice job on slabs

https://www.novuspolish.com/

Thanks for the recommedation!

Is this a wipe on, let it dry, wipe off product, or do you buff with padded wheel?

[toledo_mudhen]

Kit comes with cleaning cloths....

Can be a 1 or 2 or 3 step process depending on the condition of the slab...

[steve B]

Originally Posted by bobbvc

For those who want to follow along, I bought this exact card in PSA 9 on January 27 for 21.50. It's already at 32.00 with 16+ hours to go. I only have a couple soccer cards and the PSA 9 is my only graded soccer card. It's a near identical comp although of course there are a few differences, timing, seller, etc.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2020-Topps-...53.m1431.l2649

Edited to say it's not "literally" the same card but a recent "same" card.

The centering there seems pretty iffy for a 9.5

[bobbyw8469]

$510. Is that good?

[toledo_mudhen]

and then CSG says that this is "1st Card Graded" - Lebron Refractor Rookie

I think it's only natural that PWCC would own it (at the moment)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2003-Topps-...5/224370194054

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by toledo_mudhen

and then CSG says that this is "1st Card Graded" - Lebron Refractor Rookie

I think it's only natural that PWCC would own it (at the moment)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2003-Topps-...5/224370194054

Hmmm...it might be....I was just listing the first one I saw posted on Ebay. Makes you wonder about things. I want to see them succeed.

[bobbyw8469]

Noticed the Herbert also ended in serial number 00001.....Trying to figure out their serial numbering system.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

Noticed the Herbert also ended in serial number 00001.....Trying to figure out their serial numbering system.

"Don't try."--Charles Bukowski

"You don't try. That's very important: not to try, either for Cadillacs, creation or immortality. You wait, and if nothing happens, you wait some more."

[DanP]

Originally Posted by Wid_Conroy

Dan, now that is clear that you have a personal issue with SGC, can you share what exactly that is? Do you believe HGA and CSG will have the same resale value of PSA?

Hi Wid,

No, I don't have a personal issue with SGC. I stated in a recent post that SGC is the place to go for pre-war. I believe their prices are comparable and sometimes even better than PSA for pre-war cards.

Below are my observations and opinions about SGC.
1. Their slab is unacceptable. It is incredibly easy to open and if careful, I believe someone could open it without any scratches. This means that someone could easily insert a fake or lower graded card and resell it. See my attached picture of a card I recently broke out.
2. I would not even consider using them for post-war and absolutely not for modern. I am using PSA and Beckett for modern and will be trying CSG and HGA (didn't win the lottery last week).

No one knows how HGA and CSG will hold up vs. PSA. So far I see that they are doing quite well but only time will tell if that will continue.

Take care!

[Oscar_Stanage]

Originally Posted by DanP

Hi Wid,

No, I don't have a personal issue with SGC. I stated in a recent post that SGC is the place to go for pre-war. I believe their prices are comparable and sometimes even better than PSA for pre-war cards.

Below are my observations and opinions about SGC.
1. Their slab is unacceptable. It is incredibly easy to open and if careful, I believe someone could open it without any scratches. This means that someone could easily insert a fake or lower graded card and resell it. See my attached picture of a card I recently broke out.
2. I would not even consider using them for post-war and absolutely not for modern. I am using PSA and Beckett for modern and will be trying CSG and HGA (didn't win the lottery last week).

No one knows how HGA and CSG will hold up vs. PSA. So far I see that they are doing quite well but only time will tell if that will continue.

Take care!

Thanks, I actually was not aware of this. I will definitely make sure to carefully examine the card when buying graded. And stick to reputable sellers.

[D. Bergin]

Well, after sending in my very 1st PSA Card grading submission (8 cards Express) the day before they doubled their prices (my first card submission ever), I decided to give CSG a try.

Just sent out 19 cards ($15 level). Mostly oddball and odd-sized multi-sport foreign issue stuff from the 70's-90's.

Not a standard sized card in the bunch. Should be real annoying for them.

We'll see how it goes.

[hockeyhockey]

do you have to be a "member" of csg to submit cards to them? i see there's a free member option and other paid options - does the free membership allow for you to submit?

[hockeyhockey]

anyone used CSG yet? curious about how it went

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by hockeyhockey

do you have to be a "member" of csg to submit cards to them? i see there's a free member option and other paid options - does the free membership allow for you to submit?

Yeah, I believe you need to be at least the $25 member plan to submit. That's what I used. If you get the $149 plan, I believe you get a $150 credit...........which in hindsight, I should have used instead.

[Jcosta19]

Saw this new to ebay today. Will be interested to see sale price but I think the holder looks terrible for this card personally.

J ustin C osta

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by Jcosta19

Saw this new to ebay today. Will be interested to see sale price but I think the holder looks terrible for this card personally.

J ustin C osta

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

agreed, it looks weird. seems fine for the "ultra modern" cards though.

[hockeyhockey]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Yeah, I believe you need to be at least the $25 member plan to submit. That's what I used. If you get the $149 plan, I believe you get a $150 credit...........which in hindsight, I should have used instead.

thanks...guy from CSG got back to me today to confirm what you said. basically you pay the $149 for membership and you get what amounts to 10 cards graded for that fee.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by DanP

Hi Wid,

No, I don't have a personal issue with SGC. I stated in a recent post that SGC is the place to go for pre-war. I believe their prices are comparable and sometimes even better than PSA for pre-war cards.

Below are my observations and opinions about SGC.
1. Their slab is unacceptable. It is incredibly easy to open and if careful, I believe someone could open it without any scratches. This means that someone could easily insert a fake or lower graded card and resell it. See my attached picture of a card I recently broke out.
2. I would not even consider using them for post-war and absolutely not for modern. I am using PSA and Beckett for modern and will be trying CSG and HGA (didn't win the lottery last week).

No one knows how HGA and CSG will hold up vs. PSA. So far I see that they are doing quite well but only time will tell if that will continue.

Take care!

I have never seen a SGC slab that was busted open that could be put back together and not be extremely noticeable that it has been cracked open.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by hockeyhockey

agreed, it looks weird. seems fine for the "ultra modern" cards though.

Yeah, the slab/flip is probably ok looking for cards circa 1970 and beyond.

I don't like it at all for that Mays, or for any card of that era. The color simply clashes and the flip is just too big. Can you even imagine a T206 getting lost inside of that monstrosity?

I really want to try them out, but unless they de-emphasize that flip (or offer up some more subtle options for T206, Caramel Cards and Goudey) I just don't think I can pull the trigger. Still, I wish them luck.

[DanP]

Originally Posted by bnorth

I have never seen a SGC slab that was busted open that could be put back together and not be extremely noticeable that it has been cracked open.

Here you go, incredibly easy. One little slip with a very small screwdriver and the case came apart. I showed it to two people in person and both could not tell where I opened it. If you really looked closely you can tell, but how many people examine every slab (I do)?

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

How the hell did that Mays grade a 2.5?

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by DanP

Here you go, incredibly easy. One little slip with a very small screwdriver and the case came apart. I showed it to two people in person and both could not tell where I opened it. If you really looked closely you can tell, but how many people examine every slab (I do)?

If the person knows nothing about SGC slabs you might be able to get one past them, just like the old PSA slabs.

Try putting a junk card in one and glue the slab back together and then look at how easy it is to see it has been cracked open. There is a big difference between just setting a cracked slab back together and actually putting a card in one and trying to reseal it in my personal experience. I do agree it is very hard to tell from a pic at a angle.

[jb67]

Originally Posted by Jcosta19

Saw this new to ebay today. Will be interested to see sale price but I think the holder looks terrible for this card personally.

J ustin C osta

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

That Mays is over-graded big time. Wow!!!

[jb67]

Originally Posted by bnorth

I have never seen a SGC slab that was busted open that could be put back together and not be extremely noticeable that it has been cracked open.

I can assure you that they can be put back together without obvious signs. I received a rare Johnny Bench card I bought and when it arrived in the SGC holder it all but came apart without me even trying to open it. It was a hard to find card so I did not return and subbed it to SGC again (PSA no longer grades this card). I was shocked at how clean the slab had come apart. I could put it back together and you could not tell.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by jb67

I can assure you that they can be put back together without obvious signs. I received a rare Johnny Bench card I bought and when it arrived in the SGC holder it all but came apart without me even trying to open it. It was a hard to find card so I did not return and subbed it to SGC again (PSA no longer grades this card). I was shocked at how clean the slab had come apart. I could put it back together and you could not tell.

I would like to see that.

[Jcosta19]

Originally Posted by jb67

That Mays is over-graded big time. Wow!!!

Excellent point! I was so focused on the slab astetics that I missed that completely.

Maybe thats the point of the slab. Ha

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[jb67]

Originally Posted by bnorth

I would like to see that.

I might still have the slab. I will have to dig around in my basement and see if I still have it. If I can locate it I will post a picture of it.

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

How the hell did that Mays grade a 2.5?

I thought I was the only one who thought that. That is a horrible overgrade for that card.

[68Hawk]

Originally Posted by DanP

Here you go, incredibly easy. One little slip with a very small screwdriver and the case came apart. I showed it to two people in person and both could not tell where I opened it. If you really looked closely you can tell, but how many people examine every slab (I do)?

I've never found any of the slabs easy to open myself, Beckett being the hardest.
From any of the TPG's I have to use pliers to break off a corner of the slab, then run a flat head screwdriver through the space opened. Even then it's often pretty hair raising as I work down one side of the slab and pray I don't run into the card.
Slabs are always mangled afterwards, no chance of passing as othewise.

Never noticed any possible point in a closed slab to simply ease a small screw driver in and pry it open in c'est la vie fashion.

[68Hawk]

The Mays is ugly as sin in that holder.
Needs the flat black SGC background to create a prettier home.
Nice condition cards look fine in BGS and PSA clear tombs, but rough condition cards really benefit from an SGC holder.

Would be super interesting to see CSG's breakdown of grades for each area and which was lowest?
Surface shouldn't get a 2, corners maaaaybe a 2-3, centering I guess a 2, edges best at a 3.5/4.
Overall dragged up by the edges sub grade would be pretty lame.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

How the hell did that Mays grade a 2.5?

I immediately thought the same thing. But then realized I was comparing it to the traditional standard, as dictated to us by PSA.

I have always believed that the current grading scale foist upon us has way too much room for variance at the low end, yet has miniscule (almost microscopic) variance at the top end. There really is not much visual difference between a 7-8-9-10. But the jump from a 1 to a 4 is practically life changing.

Perhaps CSG's grading scale will feature more even increments in condition from number to number. If that's the case, I could easily see the 2.5 grade for the Mays. If their intent is to emulate the PSA/SGC scale, then of course it is over-graded.

I personally would prefer a revamped and more evenly spaced grading scale that punishes poor focus or a crease more than a tiny pin hole or speck of paper loss.

[68Hawk]

Originally Posted by Jcosta19

Saw this new to ebay today. Will be interested to see sale price but I think the holder looks terrible for this card personally.

J ustin C osta

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

Really can't agree that grading standards should be looser, or that's it's smart for CSG to head off on it's own interpretation.
Grading done consistently to the generally agreed upon standards adopted by the big 3 is what the majority of collectors want. It's the consistency that's maddening, leading to the suspicion of purposeful misdoing and froth you seen on this chat board.
No one needs a 1.5 to be a 2.5 because there's a feel good factor over not damning a card with over harsh judgement.
It's fine as a 1.5, the card is still whatever the card is upon visual inspection regardless of the number on the flip.

You want that Mays to be where it is? So where does this Mantle need to be bumped to? (Zero creases/wrinkles).



It's gotta be a 4 right, even though the back has wax stains and spots of paper loss?



So without paper loss and wax stains, what does the card now deserve to be?


You're just opening more cans and finding more worms no-one will be able to navigate or agree upon.

My card's a 2, 2.5 on a great day.

That Mays is a 1.5, at best IMO.

CSG are setting themselves up for lack of credibility, as well as the very worrying possibility some buyers who think the flip number must be an honorable one from a TPG and pay a price they'll never re-sell it for.
CSG should stick to modern and overgrade if anything, much more likely to find a niche that is accepted that way.

Just added this to my collection the other day....may the reign of critical grading and high standards live long.
This 2.5 for the miscut at top and a tiny surface dent.

[perezfan]

I disagree with the current scale and would prefer a grade of about 4 for that Russell. Great card, despite the OC.

I know that people are acclimated to the current system and no new grading company is likely to change it anytime soon. I just wish that someone would.

As for the Mantle... Does the staining go through to the front? Or is that dark center area just a shadow of some kind?

[bobbyw8469]

That Bill Russel is laughable at a 2.5 It looks fantastic. The only problem I see is the centering, which AFFECTS PRACTICALLY EVERY 1961 FLEER you look at!!!

[hcv123]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

That Bill Russel is laughable at a 2.5 It looks fantastic. The only problem I see is the centering, which AFFECTS PRACTICALLY EVERY 1961 FLEER you look at!!!

I agree the Mays is over graded. Also that the flip is a HUGE detractor. Agree with an earlier comment that the biggest problem lies between gross inconsistency and gross incompetency! Anyone care to guess the grades on these?

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by perezfan

I immediately thought the same thing. But then realized I was comparing it to the traditional standard, as dictated to us by PSA.

I have always believed that the current grading scale foist upon us has way too much room for variance at the low end, yet has miniscule (almost microscopic) variance at the top end. There really is not much visual difference between a 7-8-9-10. But the jump from a 1 to a 4 is practically life changing.

Perhaps CSG's grading scale will feature more even increments in condition from number to number. If that's the case, I could easily see the 2.5 grade for the Mays. If their intent is to emulate the PSA/SGC scale, then of course it is over-graded.

I personally would prefer a revamped and more evenly spaced grading scale that punishes poor focus or a crease more than a tiny pin hole or speck of paper loss.

I agree with all this. This is what the bottom end of the number scale should be for. To lump every card that has a fair amount of handling wear under a "2" grade, seems pretty silly to me.

For those of us who were around before grading company influences and the magical influx of pristine looking 50+ year old cards, this is what most of the cards looked like.

That said, yeah, that card doesn't look great in the holder. If you have a card of that value, at least spring an extra 10 bucks for the sub-grades so you fill up more of the dead space on the flip.

[bobbyw8469]

The Chamberlain looks like a '6', and the Russell looks like a '7'.

[68Hawk]

Originally Posted by hcv123

I agree the Mays is over graded. Also that the flip is a HUGE detractor. Agree with an earlier comment that the biggest problem lies between gross inconsistency and gross incompetency! Anyone care to guess the grades on these?

I'd go with grades of 'astonishing' and 'stunning'.

[68Hawk]

Originally Posted by perezfan

..............

As for the Mantle... Does the staining go through to the front? Or is that dark center area just a shadow of some kind?

That's just my hulking self leaning over to snap the pic.
One day I'm going to pony up and get a real photographer to take high quality 'merch' pics of all my stuff and upload on a cloud somewhere.

[slidekellyslide]

I participated in a group submission to CSG and sent 15 cards. All modern era cards within the last 10 years or so. I just don't think the flip would look good with a vintage card in it and that Mays proves it.

[GoldenAge50s]

At the end of Feb I sent in cards to CSG @ 3 different levels--Bulk, Economy & Standard--all w/ different completion dates. Just got word that Standard & Economy are ready to ship & Bulk will be a bit longer (as expected).

Anxious to see the results as they are ALL cards I plan on Selling as I continue to liquidate my life-long collection.

[hcv123]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

The Chamberlain looks like a '6', and the Russell looks like a '7'.

I had the Chamberlain pegged at a 6-6.5 (great centering) and the Russell at a 7-8 stunning card - even under 10X magnification.

PSA graded the Chamberlain a 6 and ROBBED me on the Russell with a 6 as well!! Freakin' ridiculous.

[DanP]

Originally Posted by slidekellyslide

I participated in a group submission to CSG and sent 15 cards. All modern era cards within the last 10 years or so. I just don't think the flip would look good with a vintage card in it and that Mays proves it.

Dan, I’m hoping we can see your CSG graded cards when you get them back.

I think the consensus here is that CSG is not really going after the vintage market. Think about it. If you were starting this business would you go after the business that PSA and SGC have a monopoly on? And to make that decision easier, the market where they aren’t making any new cards?

It’s obvious that HGA and CSG are going after the modern market and I don’t blame them. Millions of new cards made every year and the younger generation are more open to change.

Just my 2 cents.....