Anyone regrade? or Swap companies? Break open and resubmit?

[JohnnyKilroy]

I’ve been buying a bunch of cards over the last few months and I’m starting to feel somewhat comfortable buying the card not the grade. Some of the cards I bought, I feel like they could have been a better grade, whether PSA or SGC.

Does anyone resubmit? Some of my examples are even with PSA’s new cases. Do you crack it open and send raw? I always wonder if PSA ego gets involved, and they deny higher grade on principle. Or if I send a SGC into PSA, thinking it should be higher what happens. I’ve definitely heard stories of multiple resubmissions on the same card, just wondering some of your experiences.

I’ve also included this Clemente in the discussion... What grade do you think it’s worthy of? My scanner is not the best, and I did not include a pic of the back. But it is centered, no creases, no paper loss, no marks / holes etc. There is a wrinkle on the left that you can see, but other than that... nothing hidden that I can tell... Grade guess?

[JohnnyKilroy]

I’m also realizing I have no clue how to get good pics uploaded!

[bnorth]

I have only done it once. I wanted to upgrade a card in a SGC complete graded set. I bought a PSA card and when I got it I was worried it was slightly over graded. I cracked it out and sent it to SGC and luckily they gave it the same grade.

[bobbyw8469]

Clemente looks like a 2 or 2.5 at best. I see really weak corners on it, and you say it has a surface wrinkle, so that is where I am placing my wager.

[JohnnyKilroy]

Originally Posted by bnorth

I have only done it once. I wanted to upgrade a card in a SGC complete graded set. I bought a PSA card and when I got it I was worried it was slightly over graded. I cracked it out and sent it to SGC and luckily they gave it the same grade.

I think the majority of people I’ve talked to that resubmit for a better grade, crack and submit raw. Makes more sense to me.

[JohnnyKilroy]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

Clemente looks like a 2 or 2.5 at best. I see really weak corners on it, and you say it has a surface wrinkle, so that is where I am placing my wager.

Corners are definitely worn. They are better than the pic though. Wrinkle is about 1/2 inch long. I like your guess, it was about what I’ would’ve guessed... although I’ve seen 3s in much worse condition.

[Harford20]

Like Ben, played that "game" once.

Had a 1959 Fleer Ted Williams #68. Thought PSA7 on my evaluation. Came back a PSA6. Just couldn't understand (or agree with the grade). Cracked it out, sent it in again, and what-do-you-know, came back a PSA5. Now pissed, I cracked it and sent it in again. Third grade was a PSA 5.5. I quit. Cost over $40 for grading plus the shipping and time.

David

[Frank A]

I never ever send in a card in someone elses holder. Break em out or don't bother. Graders seem to hate giving the same grade to a card in another holder.

[JohnnyKilroy]

Originally Posted by Frank A

I never ever send in a card in someone elses holder. Break em out or don't bother. Graders seem to hate giving the same grade to a card in another holder.

My thoughts exactly.

[mechanicalman]

My experience would echo the sentiment of others: it's best to crack and submit. Though I would question the utility of doing so with lower grades. If you're thinking about doing it for resale, my bet is that a 2.5 that looks like a 3.5 will probably hammer at a 3.5 price in a decent auction. If you're talking about trying to get a 9 into a 10 holder, that's a different story. (And that's where I think you hear about most dudes submitting multiple times.)

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Harford20

Like Ben, played that "game" once.

Had a 1959 Fleer Ted Williams #68. Thought PSA7 on my evaluation. Came back a PSA6. Just couldn't understand (or agree with the grade). Cracked it out, sent it in again, and what-do-you-know, came back a PSA5. Now pissed, I cracked it and sent it in again. Third grade was a PSA 5.5. I quit. Cost over $40 for grading plus the shipping and time.

David

I had a Joe Morgan RC that I sent in, it came back a PSA 5. I though it was undergraded, but when I couldn't sell it for a decent price, I cracked it and resubmitted it. It came back a PSA 7 and I sold it for more than I had been asking.

[JollyElm]

I gotta say, just sort of as a business/marketing theory. You're SGC and considered by collectors to be second banana behind PSA (for general resale value, that is). If you want business to grow, it would be very advantageous to regrade cards currently in PSA holders up to (slightly?) higher grades, to keep the happy customer coming back to you and NOT PSA. It's a very cynical view of things, of course, but it may support leaving a card in the holder for a regrade.

[riggs336]

I sent two dozen SGCs to PSA for crossover. Half came back the same grade, half came back lower. One SGC 4 came back PSA 2.5. Lesson learned, now I crack 'em out.

[JohnnyKilroy]

Originally Posted by JollyElm

I gotta say, just sort of as a business/marketing theory. You're SGC and considered by collectors to be second banana behind PSA (for general resale value, that is). If you want business to grow, it would be very advantageous to regrade cards currently in PSA holders up to (slightly?) higher grades, to keep the happy customer coming back to you and NOT PSA. It's a very cynical view of things, of course, but it may support leaving a card in the holder for a regrade.

Great theory.. I could see it!

[JohnnyKilroy]

Originally Posted by riggs336

I sent two dozen SGCs to PSA for crossover. Half came back the same grade, half came back lower. One SGC 4 came back PSA 2.5. Lesson learned, now I crack 'em out.

Definitely cracking. That Clemente I posted was a 1.5. I think it should be a 2.5 easy. I’ll throw it in my next (first!) big submission. But I’ve got a bunch of 3-5 grades that could easily be higher as well. Should be an interesting experience!

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by JohnnyKilroy

Definitely cracking. That Clemente I posted was a 1.5. I think it should be a 2.5 easy. I’ll throw it in my next (first!) big submission. But I’ve got a bunch of 3-5 grades that could easily be higher as well. Should be an interesting experience!

BTW - PSA turnaround times appear to be currently around 6 months - or more

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by toledo_mudhen

BTW - PSA turnaround times appear to be currently around 6 months - or more

Last group sub was close to 9 months. Like a pregnancy.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

Last group sub was close to 9 months. Like a pregnancy.

That is hilarious. Some of the same symptoms also. Many questions early on, irritability/moody, and happiness when over.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Harford20

Like Ben, played that "game" once.

Had a 1959 Fleer Ted Williams #68. Thought PSA7 on my evaluation. Came back a PSA6. Just couldn't understand (or agree with the grade). Cracked it out, sent it in again, and what-do-you-know, came back a PSA5. Now pissed, I cracked it and sent it in again. Third grade was a PSA 5.5. I quit. Cost over $40 for grading plus the shipping and time.

David

Now that's funny... reason # 498 to just leave the card inside the stupid plastic slabs and don't try to game the system. It is what it is. Enjoy it!!!!!!

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

Last group sub was close to 9 months. Like a pregnancy.

that's funny too and a good analogy. You kids are regular riots this morning. Thanks for the giggles. Been so busy, I almost forgot how.

[toledo_mudhen]

Originally Posted by bobbyw8469

Last group sub was close to 9 months. Like a pregnancy.

Yea well - you can only eat so much Ice Cream and Dill Pickles

[CW]

Nice Clemente rookie! I'd guess a 3.5, 4 at best, but finding one centered and with good print is pretty tough so you have a winner regardless of numerical grade.

[AGuinness]

Just curious if there's a reason why you want to regrade. If you buy the card and not the holder and it's for your PC, that's an ideal situation: enjoy a very nice card at a discount price. There's no need to regrade.
The only time I've ever crossed a card over, it came back as .5 lower from SGC than it was originally in a PSA holder - but I did it because I prefer the SGC holder and wanted it in one.
Nice Clemente! Good luck with the submission if you go that route.

[Leon]

Since I am not happy with any of the big 3 TPGs there is no reason for me to cross any over. That said, when the new company comes online I might let them grade all of them and let the chips fall where they may. At least I will respect their head vintage grader...one who will tell you why something is the way it is, not just say....."oh we don't like the way it looks" with no facts to back it up. Just done with the current ones........to each their own....

[Rhotchkiss]

These were SGC to PSA crossovers. The Doyle is now in a psa 3.5 flip and the Cobb was crossed to a 4.5. The Cobb is an F-ing joke, not even a 5??!! But I was willing to take the downgrade in order to get my set on the registry as the only 100% complete T206, 524 set. Now of course, I am looking to upgrade the Cobb (among others).

These are obviously seriously big boy cards, yet I have no doubt I was dinged bc they were in SGC flips (and there was no way I was cracking the Doyle and submitting it raw).

PSA can be wicked inconsistent and they are penal on crossovers, even if it’s the rarest card in the T206 set or a Cobb that looks better than many 7s.

[toledo_mudhen]

If that Cobb can't hit a 5 then wtf!

[rats60]

I think that is a fair grade on the Doyle, it is still the highest graded. That Cobb should be a 5.5.

[Rhotchkiss]

Originally Posted by rats60

I think that is a fair grade on the Doyle, it is still the highest graded. That Cobb should be a 5.5.

Sure. I am fine with Doyle at a 3.5- who really cares, it’s so rare. But my beef is with the Cobb, I definitely got screwed there

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Sure. I am fine with Doyle at a 3.5- who really cares, it’s so rare. But my beef is with the Cobb, I definitely got screwed there

You definitely did.

[jefferyadams]

Can you resubmit to PSA in a PSA holder asking only to bump the grade but not lower?

[Rhotchkiss]

Originally Posted by jefferyadams

Can you resubmit to PSA in a PSA holder asking only to bump the grade but not lower?

Maybe. But I won’t. Getting screwed once is enough. I don’t need to pay another $500+ and wait 4 months for them to reaffirm their shitty decision.

[rats60]

When I decided to finish my t205 set, I decided to only buy graded and PSA/SGC 5 or 6. I sent off all my cards that I bought in the 80s so everything would be uniform. Some were borderline cards but I got about 10 4s that were as nice as Ryan's Cobb. For a couple years I tried to upgrade, but everytime I found a 5 it was in worse condition than my 4 so I have pretty much given up and will just settle for a set of average grade 5+.

[marzoumanian]

Greetings. I just posted my monthly blog on this subject this morning. You can check it out at www.markearzoumanian.com if you want. It's detailed but will shine light on recent, real world experience.
Peace.

[Jersey City Giants]

As has been previously stated ...crack it out first. That said in my experience SCG to PSA is a min half grade lower or worse. Old BVG averages a grade higher (I have had two grades higher.....they were way too tough back then). The only problem is you need a safecracking degree to get those BVG's out of the case lol.

[JackR]

A few years ago, I tried to cross over ten SGC 96 cards to PSA 9. All were high end HOF, many were one of one. I left them in the SGC holder since I was concerned some would be rejected and come back raw. Only two crossed-over. The other eight were returned as insufficient to satisfy the grade. I sold the ones that did not cross over on PWCC (boo!) and got less than half of what I estimated as the PSA price. The lesson I took away is the same as some of the previous posts: if you want to mess with crossovers, crack them out first.

[JackR]

A few years ago, I tried to cross over ten SGC 96 cards to PSA 9. All were high end HOF, many were one of one. I left them in the SGC holder since I was concerned some would be rejected and come back raw. Only two crossed-over. The other eight were returned as insufficient to satisfy the grade. I sold the ones that did not cross over on PWCC (boo!) and got less than half of what I estimated as the PSA price. The lesson I took away is the same as some of the previous posts: if you want to mess with crossovers, crack them out first.

[bks14sr]

I just purchased a 48-49 Leaf J Robinson in a BVG 3 holder and I’m considering crossing it over to PSA. If I do so, I will be submitting it raw. In my case, I’d likely be getting a lower grade, so I’m not sure it’s worth it beyond ditching my BVG slab. If you do so, good luck

[36GoudeyMan]

I sent (in June) 5 1934 Goudeys in PSA 6 holders to SGC to cross, minimum grade requested was SGC 60 (5). I stupidly submitted them in the PSA holders. Results: one crossed to a SGC 5.5, but 4 did not reach the minimum grade requested. It took over 4 months. Now, if I crack and resubmit, its another 6 months.

And, BTW, if you get SGC grades now, their Registry is not up and running, and you cannot put the new serial numbers in the "Legacy" registry, which has been true for months and months and months and months, and sucks.

Anyone wanna trade PSA 6 1934 Goudeys for SGC 60/70 1934 Goudeys?

[bobbyw8469]

Originally Posted by 36GoudeyMan

I sent (in June) 5 1934 Goudeys in PSA 6 holders to SGC to cross, minimum grade requested was SGC 60 (5). I stupidly submitted them in the PSA holders. Results: one crossed to a SGC 5.5, but 4 did not reach the minimum grade requested. It took over 4 months. Now, if I crack and resubmit, its another 6 months.

And, BTW, if you get SGC grades now, their Registry is not up and running, and you cannot put the new serial numbers in the "Legacy" registry, which has been true for months and months and months and months, and sucks.

Anyone wanna trade PSA 6 1934 Goudeys for SGC 60/70 1934 Goudeys?

This is crazy talk. Neither company wants to give cards higher grades. They always say that their competitor got it wrong, and the cards aren't nearly as nice as THEY say they are. Complete BS.