I will give you the brother-in-law price but.....

[Leon]

I will give you the brother in law price but....everyone else pays what they are worth. You know, one hand washes the other........

[barrysloate]

"Mint condition" had a more informal meaning back then. Cards just had to look fresh; if they had a small imperfection it was probably overlooked.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

"Mint condition" had a more informal meaning back then. Cards just had to look fresh; if they had a small imperfection it was probably overlooked.

I agree Barry, but that being said, we have all seen quite a bit of Lionel's collection come out and everyone would have to admit they are pack fresh looking, for the most part.....but most weren't technically "mint" of course.

[E93]

That is a great window into the hobby 50 years ago. Thanks for posting. And yeah, Lionel Carter may have been the first collector for whom condition was really important. Mint then was not necessarily mint by today's standards, but it was sometimes. I remember when his collection was sold off a few years ago, there were a lot of 8s and 9s in the '40's and '50's stuff.
JimB

[Leon]

Originally Posted by E93

That is a great window into the hobby 50 years ago. Thanks for posting. And yeah, Lionel Carter may have been the first collector for whom condition was really important. Mint then was not necessarily mint by today's standards, but it was sometimes. I remember when his collection was sold off a few years ago, there were a lot of 8s and 9s in the '40's and '50's stuff.
JimB

Agreed Jim. A friend and I were speaking yesterday and these documents from the 1970's and back are a window to the past that probably won't be there going forward. Nowadays, no one writes letters except for emails and they are not kept, for the most part.

[calvindog]

Amazing that he wasn't trying to rip anyone off. Perhaps this can be posted on the BST so some of the more obvious degenerates can take a peek?

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by Leon

Nowadays, no one writes letters except for emails and they are not kept, for the most part.

Which is why my letters from Lionel Carter are a keepsake that I will long cherish. He even included a Lionel Carter postage stamp in one of his mailings to me. I had called him and written him about the when he first acquired the T206 Plank that I had purchased in the 2007 Mastro Auction. He spent a lot of time looking through his old files trying to track down the source. I have always appreciated that.

Copies of the letters below can also be viewed on my website, which includes an audio recording of my first call with Lionel.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by calvindog

Amazing that he wasn't trying to rip anyone off. Perhaps this can be posted on the BST so some of the more obvious degenerates can take a peek?

LOL....I hear ya Jeff.....I don't mind making a buck on something as God knows I lose on a lot of stuff too....but I can't tell you how many times I see something sold in a very public venue, for market price, and then next day I see it jacked up 200%-300% or more. I mean really......

[barrysloate]

Agreed Leon. Lionel Carter's cards were gorgeous, I especially remember those incredible 1938 Goudeys. But like I said, it was a different hobby back then. Always fun to look back.

[Bambino]

Originally Posted by barrysloate

Agreed Leon. Lionel Carter's cards were gorgeous, I especially remember those incredible 1938 Goudeys. But like I said, it was a different hobby back then. Always fun to look back.

Are there photos of his collection collected anywhere online?

[tbob]

I have several Carter collection caramel cards in my own collection and I can definitely state that "mint" to Lionel unfortunately wasn't "mint" to SGC. I think Lionel ignored back damage and sometimes corner damage as long as the image was clear, the colors bright and there weren't noticeable creases. His cards from the 30's, 40's and 50's were spectacular but his pre-war (pre-WW1) cards were not in the same category.
That said, I do treasure these cards and have sold similar cards in higher grade and kept the Carter collection cards because of the provenance.
Thanks so much leon and paul, for sharing the great letters with us.

[barrysloate]

Originally Posted by Bambino

Are there photos of his collection collected anywhere online?

You should be able to find many photos of Carter's cards by going to the Legendary Auctions archives and finding the sale of the collection. I think it took place around 2008.

[ethicsprof]

great window into the best of times for collecting methinks.
thanks for sharing the correspondence.
with Bob M., I have a few Lionel Carter's and love them no matter the grade.
Some are higher but i must say that the Ramly I got from you,Leon, a good while ago, is a favorite even though ole sgc gave it a fair.
best,
barry

[E93]

Since we are on the Lionel Carter topic, I thought I would post a few from his first baseball card set, the '33 Delong that he assembled from packs. I believe he said this set is what started his baseball card obsession. He was a kid when he put this set together so the condition is not as pristine as some of his later sets, but it is still pretty nice. I am very psyched to have a hobby relic like this.
JimB
P.S. Paul, those letters are great.

[Jaybird]

Cool cards, Jim

[shaunsteig]

Phenomenal letters, thanks so much for sharing. Imagine the going prices of cards those days -- 15 cents, or lots for $5 or $10 dollars. Brings a tear to read his line about how he felt that the money guys ruined the hobby.

Here's my one card from his collection, thanks for showing yours,
--S