Old Judge Trivia Question Thread

[Joe_G.]

Originally Posted by kkkkandp

Here's one...what member of the Old Judge set is the all-time leader in hit batsmen?

~12 1/2 years unanswered, Kevin and I gave everyone a fair chance . . .

Gus Weyhing, 277 hit batsmen over 14 years (4337 innings pitched)

Walter Johnson hit 205 over 21 years (5914.1 innings pitched) (4th all time)

I had to look this up.


Who is the oldest player depicted on Old Judge card (oldest during his N172 card issuance)?

[BobbyStrawberry]

Originally Posted by Joe_G.

~12 1/2 years unanswered, Kevin and I gave everyone a fair chance . . .

Gus Weyhing, 277 hit batsmen over 14 years (4337 innings pitched)

Walter Johnson hit 205 over 21 years (5914.1 innings pitched) (4th all time)

I had to look this up.


Who is the oldest player depicted on Old Judge card (oldest during his N172 card issuance)?

Harry Wright would be my guess.

[molenick]

I vote for Harry Wright as the oldest person. If it was someone who was still a player at the time, I vote for either Jim O'Rourke or Deacon White, just because I know both would have been playing for awhile at that point.

[oldjudge]

My guess would be Deacon White, especially since he is Joe’s favorite player

[Joe_G.]

All good guesses, Deacon White was oldest player (39 years old at time of April photo shoot, turning 40 in late 1888) and was the answer I was looking for.

Harry Wright would be oldest person (manager) during card issue with cards issued in 1887, 1888, 1889, & 1890 age 52-55yrs although the photo portraits used to make those cards seem to date to 1887 & 1888 (52 & 53 yrs old).

[Joe_G.]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

my guess would be deacon white, especially since he is joe’s favorite player

[Joe_G.]

OK, something more difficult.

29 subjects from the Old Judge set have been inducted into the BB HOF. Most of the players died before the HOF began inducting players (1936), still more would perish before being honored, however, four held on long enough to see their enshrinement, name them.

[BobbyStrawberry]

Originally Posted by Joe_G.

OK, something more difficult.

29 subjects from the Old Judge set have been inducted into the BB HOF. Most of the players died before the HOF began inducting players (1936), still more would perish before being honored, however, four held on long enough to see their enshrinement, name them.

That's a hard one, Joe. I went 1 for 4. (I won't embarrass myself by listing all of them) 🤓

[Misunderestimated]

I think its Connie Mack, Hugh Duffy
Clark Griffith and Kid Nichols. Haven't double checked.

[Joe_G.]

Great job Brian, you nailed it.

Connie Mack, class of 1937, died in 1956 at 93
Hugh Duffy, class of 1945, died in 1954 at 87
Clark Griffith, class of 1946, died in 1955 at 85
Kid Nichols, class of 1949, died in 1953 at 83

[z28jd]

My answer way back when about the youngest player was correct as far as we knew at the time, but research added five years onto the age of Bill Bishop since then. He's not the youngest player in the set, as a large number of players in the set were younger than 22 when they appeared. Nat Hudson appears to be the correct answer now, though some birth dates for minor league players are unknown

[Fred]

I just started reading the thread. Holy crap, I had Nichols, Mack, Griffith and Duffy. My goodness, that thread had been buried for a long time.

[Fred]

Of the 29 HOFers depicted in the OJ set, how many (and who) never lived to see the 20th century?

[BobbyStrawberry]

Originally Posted by Fred

Of the 29 HOFers depicted in the OJ set, how many (and who) never lived to see the 20th century?

King Kelly is one.

[Misunderestimated]

High and hard living King Kelly is right, also "Old Hoss" Radbourn and Harry Wright for certain.
Ed Delahanty barely made it before he mysteriously died over Niagara Falls in 1903...He was still near the top of his game.

No one else comes to mind.

[Fred]

Those would be the answers. Big Ed, missed the cut-off by just a few years.

[BobbyStrawberry]

I'll try one: Which five players depicted on Old Judge cards have been most recently inducted into the HOF?

(And Jay and Joe, if you're reading this, your awesome book is one of the reasons for my fascination with this era of the game, so thanks for that!)

[oldjudge]

Thanks Bobby! I remember four semi recent additions in White, O’Day, McPhee and Hanlon. The fifth escapes me but I’d guess Rusie.

[BobbyStrawberry]

You got it, Jay. Rusie was inducted in 1977, one year after Roger Connor.

[oldjudge]

Great! My turn—What player in the Old Judge set had the longest (start to end) major league baseball playing career? For these purposes please only consider the National Association, the National League and the American League as major leagues.

[John1941]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

Great! My turn—What player in the Old Judge set had the longest (start to end) major league baseball playing career? For these purposes please only consider the National Association, the National League and the American League as major leagues.

Deacon McGuire?

[Misunderestimated]

Orator Jim O'Rourke ? I'm guessing the way the questions is asked implies that it has to be someone who started in the Nat Ass'n. I think the Orator had a cameo in the AL or the AL in 20th Century too. He had drifted down to the "minor leagues" but kept playing.

[BobbyStrawberry]

Cap Anson is my guess, but I'm probably wrong.

[insidethewrapper]

Sam Thompson

[oldjudge]

Brian is right. Jim O'Rourke started in 1872 and played one game for the Giants in, I believe, 1904. He actually caught the full game and went 1/4. Quite a feat.

[BobbyStrawberry]

OK, another one...

Which three players with Old Judge cards have the highest career on-base percentage?

ETA: Consider only "major league" stats as currently defined by MLB. Minimum 5000 PAs.

[Fred]

I only got one of the three (he was the top one though) - I had to cheat to find that the other two weren't in the top three, however, I did have #4.

[darwinbulldog]

Originally Posted by Joe_G.

Great job Brian, you nailed it.

Connie Mack, class of 1937, died in 1956 at 93
Hugh Duffy, class of 1945, died in 1954 at 87
Clark Griffith, class of 1946, died in 1955 at 85
Kid Nichols, class of 1949, died in 1953 at 83

For anyone who complains about the current Hall voters, there are few mistakes more egregious than taking 14 years to induct Kid Nichols. I don't expect many people will agree with me, but Nichols was the single best player of the 19th century.

[molenick]

And it's not like they weren't putting in 19th century players...in 1946 the veteran's committee selected Tommy McCarthy who is right up there among the worst inductees. If you subscribe to WAR he is not only 65 places behind Harold Baines as a right fielder, but he is behind two people selected as managers (Southworth and Stengel). Granted I am using modern analytics, but even his traditional statistics are unremarkable. Just looking at 19th and early 20th century right fielders who were better: it took Sam Crawford until 1957 to get in and Sam Thompson until 1974.

[oldjudge]

Originally Posted by darwinbulldog

For anyone who complains about the current Hall voters, there are few mistakes more egregious than taking 14 years to induct Kid Nichols. I don't expect many people will agree with me, but Nichols was the single best player of the 19th century.

I think he may have been the best pitcher who played solely in the 19th century. However, I think Delahanty and George Wright were the two greatest 19th century players.

[oldjudge]

Bobby—My guesses would be Brouthers, Tip O’Neal, and Billy Hamilton

[BobbyStrawberry]

Jay, you have two out of the three, including the #1 player that Fred also had.

Hamilton is #1 (.455) and Brouthers is #2 (.423). Other guesses before I give a hint?

-Matthew

[BobbyStrawberry]

Alright, here's a hint: this player is best known for playing with the Cleveland Spiders during the 1890s.

[molenick]

I cheated and looked it up. I would never have guessed this person, but I do know who he is because I keep voting for him whenever there is a poll about overlooked HOF candidates. My guesses were more obvious (Hamilton, Delahanty, Brouthers).

[Misunderestimated]

The Cleveland Spiders hint gave it away ---- Cupid Childs ? Shortish career for a HOFer and one of the 19th Century guys who benefits from analytics. I doubt that people thought he was the greatest 2nd basemen of his time when he was playing. I think Bill James listed him as the best 2B of the 1890's Bid McPhee won the 1880's, played a lot longer, and was a legendary fielder.

My vote for the 19th Century who was overlooked too long would be Hamilton -- they got to him in 1961. If the object of the game is to score more runs than the other team (which it is) he was one of the best ever. Hamilton scored more than one run per game that he played for his career.

[BobbyStrawberry]

Brian, you are correct! Childs put up a career .416 OBP. Not too bad!

[Misunderestimated]

I mentioned that Billy Hamilton averaged greater than one run per game played over his career, One other Old Judge subject (barely) accomplished this remarkable feat over his career also, who was he?

(an aside no one since Hamilton has accomplished this -- only five players have scored in over 80% of the games they played)

[BobbyStrawberry]

George Gore would be my guess (I believe he was the leadoff hitter for many of those great Giants teams)

[Misunderestimated]

Bobby --> You got it ! ... There was another one too (I messed up) Harry Stovey also barely made it.

This is the all-time runs per game list -- with a 500 game minimum and including the National Ass'n. The three guys with the asterisks played 1000+ games and are in the Old Judge set (although Hamilton was a "minor leaguer" as i recall)

__
George Wright - 1.13 (per game)
*Billy Hamilton - 1.06
Cal McVey - 1.05
*George Gore - 1.01
*Harry Stovey - 1.00
--
among the Old Judgers who almost made it are Brouthers, King Kelly, and Hub Collins (shorter career).
==
The "modern" post-1901 leaders at over 80% are Ruth, Gehrig, DiMaggio, Earl Combs and Red Rolfe --YANKEES, ALL

[BobbyStrawberry]

Cool! Here's another one, probably not easy–

Among players with OJ cards, six of the top ten career leaders in innings pitched are HOFers (Galvin, Nichols, Keefe, Welch, Clarkson, Radbourn). Who are the other four?

Consider "major leagues" only as currently defined by MLB.

[Misunderestimated]

One is Mullane (pretty sure).... another should be McCormick and.Another might be Bobby Matthews (I'm not sure if he ran up enough innings in the leagues that count)... That's just three. After that Im totally guessing...

[BobbyStrawberry]

You have three of the four, Brian, well done! Only one to go

[spec]

How about Gus Weyhing?

[oldjudge]

The best pitcher I can think of not on the list is Charlie Buffington, but I don’t know if he pitched long enough. In his day he was the equal on any pitcher.

[BobbyStrawberry]

spec, you got it! Weyhing is correct. Here is the list:

1. Pud Galvin 6003.1 (!)
2. Kid Nichols 5067.1
3. Tim Keefe 5049.2
4. Bobby Mathews 4956
5. Mickey Welch 4802
6. John Clarkson 4536.1
7. Count Mullane 4531.1
8. Old Hoss Radbourn 4527.1
9. Gus Weyhing 4337
10. Jim McCormick 4275.2

Charlie Buffinton is a few spots further down with 3404....not bad either!

[Misunderestimated]

Every 19th Century buff knows that Old Hoss won 59 (or 60) in 1884
some other Old Judge subjects hold less known single season.... records name the following:
WAR overall in a season:
Runs in a season:
RBI/Per game in a season
Pitcher Strikeouts in a season
Pitcher WAR in a season
Pitcher ERA in a season
Wild Pitches in a season
Put outs as 2nd Basemen
Stolen Bases in a season
--
Most of these are HOF greats but a few aren't famous at all...

[RUKen]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

I think he (Kid Nichols) may have been the best pitcher who played solely in the 19th century. However, I think Delahanty and George Wright were the two greatest 19th century players.

I just wanted to point out that Kid Nichols pitched in the major leagues 1890-1901 and 1904-1906; his career was not confined to the 19th Century.

[darwinbulldog]

Originally Posted by Misunderestimated

Every 19th Century buff knows that Old Hoss won 59 (or 60) in 1884
some other Old Judge subjects hold less known single season.... records name the following:
WAR overall in a season:
Runs in a season:
RBI/Per game in a season
Pitcher Strikeouts in a season
Pitcher WAR in a season
Pitcher ERA in a season
Wild Pitches in a season
Put outs as 2nd Basemen
Stolen Bases in a season
--
Most of these are HOF greats but a few aren't famous at all...

I think WAR is Keefe. Probably pitcher WAR too.

[BobbyStrawberry]

I know two for certain-

WAR overall in a season: Tim Keefe
Pitcher Strikeouts in a season: Matt Kilroy

My guesses on the others-

Runs in a season: Billy Hamilton
RBI/Per game in a season: Dan Brouthers
Pitcher WAR in a season: Radbourn
Pitcher ERA in a season: Radbourn
Wild Pitches in a season: Tim Keefe (somebody who pitched a lot...)
Put outs as 2nd Basemen: Bid McPhee
Stolen Bases in a season: Billy Hamilton

-Matthew

[Misunderestimated]

Matthew-
WAR overall is Keefe
Pitcher K's is Matt "Matches" Kilroy
Keefe is (somehow) NOT Pitcher WAR - I guess he was better hitter than the winner... (and Old Hoss is not the answer, either)
Bid McPhee is the 2nd Basemen with the most put-outs (even without a glove most of the time)
Hamilton is the Runs leader (no surprise)
The others are still "open"
--
I'll drop a few hints. The RBI leader was 1/3 of a HOF outfield....The pitcher WAR winner was (supposedly) the earliest PED user.....The wild pitch leader and the SB leaders are not HOF, or even HOF candidates..One of them was a "little" guy the other is not to be confused with someone named a "Lady" ..