Outed cards, now including a 130K gain on an Aaron rookie

[jwilly]

Just a general question about card trimming. I can understand how it can happen to the older cards. But how in the hell can trimming on a modern card not be detected, especially by professional TPG's ? Isn't the quality control on modern cards such that they are all exactly the same size ?

[ALBB]

Yes, Id love to see the info on the Doctor !!!

[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by ALBB

Yes, Id love to see the info on the Doctor !!!

Besides the sports card radio and blowout is there a list of known card doctors from over the years ? If anyone could pm that I’d appreciate it.

[bbeck]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

Ok, my bad that I did not give you time to respond, and thus prematurely jumped to conclusions. I apologize. But I, and I assume many on this board, would appreciate if you at least disclosed the card that was purchased by the doctor and the name of the card doctor (per my initial post), so that the community is aware that card could pop up later altered. I see no reason not to do this, especially if you know it was purchased by doctor. Regardless of whether you hate me.

You have been PM'd and the ebayer has been blocked.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by jwilly

Just a general question about card trimming. I can understand how it can happen to the older cards. But how in the hell can trimming on a modern card not be detected, especially by professional TPG's ? Isn't the quality control on modern cards such that they are all exactly the same size ?

They're a lot more accurate than they were. Many are actually die cut, so the card could be small or large, but all examples of the same card should be the same size.

BUT, and this is a big point.
Not all cards are die cut. And not all cards are even cut the same way on every side. Some Gypsy queen cards are a combination of die cut and knife cut.
I doubt any TPG even knows that, and have even less belief that they would check even if they knew.

[WhenItWasAHobby]

Here's Johnny (Bench) on a $11K+ windfall......

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showpo...postcount=6147

[perezfan]

What a disgraceful waste of money. Not even a rare card.

[JeremyW]

Just wondering, is it possible to get the Bench card into another PSA holder with a different serial number without cracking the card?

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Sure, ask for a review and if it gets a new grade it would get a new number.

[ejharrington]

Originally Posted by WhenItWasAHobby

Here's Johnny (Bench) on a $11K+ windfall......

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showpo...postcount=6147

I can’t blame PSA on this one. I can’t even tell knowing that’s it’s trimmed.

[JeremyW]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Sure, ask for a review and if it gets a new grade it would get a new number.

Thanks for the answer. Since that card is a PSA 10, it won't have a new serial number? Right?

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Well no real reason to review a 10.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by ejharrington

I can’t blame PSA on this one. I can’t even tell knowing that’s it’s trimmed.

other than it's an inch short and rattling around the cage. very nice conservation right there. "Reviews" is my favorite new word to go along with Pops, flips, and my favorite....the lambsheer. another day another 10 K. People are re -TAr DED

Will the billion dollar fraud actually be tallied up by Boda or not? I'm betting they can do it because if I think it's a billion dollar fraud by my math, it is probably a 2 billion fraud when you take into consideration how long this grift has been going on.

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Sure, ask for a review and if it gets a new grade it would get a new number.

Incorrect. It would retain it's current Cert number with PSA. It would likely get one of the new untraceable ones from SGC, though.

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by ejharrington

Does anyone know if the individuals who discover these frauds or anyone else for that matter lets the owner ie set registry owner know they purchased altered cards? I would think that short of legal action the only way PSA will step up their game is if people start demanding refunds for monies spent on these cards.

I have messaged about 50 card owners during this scandal. Received responses back from about 5.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

other than it's an inch short and rattling around the cage. very nice conservation right there. "Reviews" is my favorite new word to go along with Pops, flips, and my favorite....the lambsheer. another day another 10 K. People are re -TAr DED

Will the billion dollar fraud actually be tallied up by Boda or not? I'm betting they can do it because if I think it's a billion dollar fraud by my math, it is probably a 2 billion fraud when you take into consideration how long this grift has been going on.

The entire "review process" and creating unnecessary "half grades" are just new ways for them to generate more money and profits. They sit around in board rooms, discussing how they can potentially stick it to the public even deeper, and subsequently come up with these ideas (to the delight of their shareholders).

They create these wonderful new "services" under the charade/semblance of possessing enhanced capabilities. But it's really just about increasing unnecessary submissions and bilking the public. And the hypnotized masses buy into it hook line and sinker, because they seemingly need an overburdened minimum wage earning stranger to validate their cards.

[ejharrington]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

other than it's an inch short and rattling around the cage. very nice conservation right there. "Reviews" is my favorite new word to go along with Pops, flips, and my favorite....the lambsheer. another day another 10 K. People are re -TAr DED

Will the billion dollar fraud actually be tallied up by Boda or not? I'm betting they can do it because if I think it's a billion dollar fraud by my math, it is probably a 2 billion fraud when you take into consideration how long this grift has been going on.

Actually, looking at the before picture on my computer (vs. my phone) the edge looks off. It looks like it was trimmed before it was "conserved".

[Bigdaddy]

And the fools that would pay $11k for that card are the crackheads that enable/motivate these drug dealers/card doctors.

[Johnny630]

The industry has been completely overblown smoke and mirrors in terms of sales/pricing since 2015........I believe little to non of the sold numbers......it’s going to come back down .....it always has to some extent. The correction will only get deeper, and much deserved.

[swarmee]

NFL player Evan Mathis and Sean Bassik are currently being outed on Blowout.

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1340211

Edit: Clarify that Sean is listed as a seller of Evan's presumed altered cards and those from another trimmer.

[bnorth]

[Bigdaddy]

Originally Posted by swarmee

NFL player Evan Mathis and Sean Bassik are currently being outed on Blowout.

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1340211

Say it aint so, Joe. Did he trim the Mick?

[JackW]

What next? Santa Claus isn't real?

[japhi]

Originally Posted by ejharrington

I can’t blame PSA on this one. I can’t even tell knowing that’s it’s trimmed.

Fair, but of the cards look the same how is one a 10 and the other an 8? They either suck at what they do or they are giving favours to submitters like PWCC

[Aquarian Sports Cards]

Hey he only earned 25 million during his career. He has to put food on the table...

[irv]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Hey he only earned 25 million during his career. He has to put food on the table...

I was just going to say, it's amazing what money does to some people.

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Hey he only earned 25 million during his career. He has to put food on the table...

He bought 10 packs (cost 20 k) from a big '86 Fleer basketball box break a couple years ago. Didn't even get a Jordan, but that's beside the point. If the guy was regularly risking that kind of money with such a low EV, the money would go pretty quick

[swarmee]

Originally Posted by Bigdaddy

Say it aint so, Joe. Did he trim the Mick?

I believe the Mick was graded many years ago, and he bought it that way.

Hoping that Sean is just fencing bad cards he didn't realize were altered.

[111gecko]

Agree on both comments above about Sean. No way he would be involved with this. Stand up guy who just flips collections.

[Leon]

I know Sean pretty well and do not believe he will be found to be engaged in fraud. Any one of us could accidentally sell a bad TPG graded card which we didn't know was messed up.

[ullmandds]

aaaaaaaand...the cycle continues.

[Johnny630]

The collateral damage in terms of price value to graded cards is going to Significant.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Johnny630

The collateral damage in terms of price value to graded cards is going to Significant.

One can hope...

[Rhotchkiss]

This should be its own thread.

I have dealt with Sean and he was a stand up guy. I fear he may be guilt by association. Regarding Mathis, I did one deal with him - I traded him a Manning and Brady rookie for a PSA 8, Allen and Ginters, Cap Anson, which I consigned to PSA (and got killed on). I hope that 8 wasn’t jacked - I don’t think it was - but based on the thread, I am afraid the Manning and Brady may have since been worked on and recirculated (zero clue or indication that they have). I will try to find pics of the Manning and Brady when I owned them to post.

Full disclosure, I am a broncos fan

Edited - here is a link to a pic of the Manning I used to own. I cannot find the Brady:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/156271...7689561527103/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/156271...7689561527103/

[Johnny630]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

One can hope...

It will....

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Bigdaddy

Say it aint so, Joe. Did he trim the Mick?

you mean the 2.8 million dollar one LOLLOL...nah, just popped reviewed and flipped with conservation when he was 12.

It's just a $3 million dollar beat between friends.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Rhotchkiss

This should be its own thread.

I have dealt with Sean and he was a stand up guy. I fear he may be guilt by association. Regarding Mathis, I did one deal with him - I traded him a Manning and Brady rookie for a PSA 8, Allen and Ginters, Cap Anson, which I consigned to PSA (and got killed on). I hope that 8 wasn’t jacked - I don’t think it was - but based on the thread, I am afraid the Manning and Brady may have since been worked on and recirculated (zero clue or indication that they have). I will try to find pics of the Manning and Brady when I owned them to post.

Full disclosure, I am a broncos fan

Edited - here is a link to a pic of the Manning I used to own. I cannot find the Brady:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/156271...7689561527103/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/156271...7689561527103/

He sold a fake 400K Brady too. That's what scammers do... They scam.

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Leon

I know Sean pretty well and do not believe he will be found to be engaged in fraud. Any one of us could accidentally sell a bad TPG graded card which we didn't know was messed up.

we'll that's true, considering at least half are fake, IMHO

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Fuddjcal

we'll that's true, considering at least half are fake, IMHO

Settle down, Chuck .
I prefer to use the half glass full terminology and say most of TPG graded cards are good.
This whole debacle has just made it so much more relevant to not buy the holder and KNOW your cards, yourself.

.

[phikappapsi]

There should be a grading company that simply assesses authenticity. No "grades". Just tell me if it's real so I can be 100% sure I'm not buying a reprint online. Beyond that. Every buyer can make their own determination on condition. At least then all the fraud would be above board.

[Sean1125]

I woke up this morning to a text from a gentlemen I've dealt with in the past bringing this thread to my attention. It is not too pleasant to spend a couple hours in the morning reading false accusations and needing to study hundreds of replies via multiple sites to issue a statement.

I am quite irate because an anonymous individual has made an erroneous assumption that libels my and my companies name, assumes guilt by association, and is counterfactual.

Evan posted on the reddit thread, "There is so much misinformation in that thread that it’s entertaining." I would not call it entertaining, the words that come to mind are bothersome and alarming. The post involves me without facts, making stretch assumptions, and objectively false statements.

Invest In Baseball was hired by Cardology for the 2018 national to assess collections and market for inventory via our customer base and other means. IIB did not set up a booth and I worked the floor and out of the Cardology booth to help assess collections, ensure he was making fair deals, bring deals to the table, and help some lesser educated staff because of limited bandwidth. This buying ad is identical to the buying ads that were placed throughout the industry, sent to our email list, and was not conducted any differently than usual business other than I was hired, at a very handsome rate, to help Cardology.

I was actually extremely excited to be working with an NFL player, a Super Bowl champion at that. I am 100% sure every single person who has a business would be willing to work with someone who offers a huge advancement for your company via name association alone. Evan has always been cordial, stand-up, and follows through with his word. If it weren't for him I would not have been able to grow IIB as quickly as it did and I am eternally grateful. I make no comment on any of the accusations or assumptions made about him in the Blowout thread and only provide comment on the unfounded accusations relating to myself and IIB.

Via the anonymous posters definition, PWCC, Probstein, and COMC are all associates of Cardology-- they sold inventory. It is unwarranted to list IIB as an associate because the company was hired to work for Evan and unknowingly sold cards on consignment. I am sure there are hundreds of other vendors, auctions, and collectors who have unwittingly sold altered cards, by this posters definition he needs to research them and list them as associates.

Respectfully, I request that I be left out of this. I've mostly moved on from this industry for two years as a business and buy on the side as a hobby to populate my house and enjoy the past that brought me to where I am today.

Kind Regards,

Sean

[Paul S]

Originally Posted by japhi

Fair, but of the cards look the same how is one a 10 and the other an 8? They either suck at what they do or they are giving favours to submitters like PWCC

Likely both, IMO.

It looks good for PSA's public perception that everyone sends them their "high end" cards. What a sham.

[Paul S]

Originally Posted by Aquarian Sports Cards

Hey he only earned 25 million during his career. He has to put food on the table...

Shades of Latrell Spewell.

[Johnny630]

90% of these sold prices at auction with certain Ebay Consigners and or Auction Houses since 2014 have been FAKE TOTAL BS......MARKET MANIPULATION ON TOP OF DOCTORED CARDS......WORSE IS MY BIGGEST FEAR THAT THE TPG'S ARE ALL IN ON THIS....THE CAN OF WORMS HAS BEEN OPENED UP.........IT"S UGLY.....A LOT OF PEOPLE HAD A TON OF MONEY in 2010-2012 Then Why All the sudden late 2013/2014 the stuff went crazy....BULL S**T WHY because of so called INVESTORS ??? WERE THEY FAKE?? HELL YES... THAT'S WHEN THIS ALL STARTED.......
WHAT A TOTAL DISGRACE

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Leon

Settle down, Chuck .
I prefer to use the half glass full terminology and say most of TPG graded cards are good.
This whole debacle has just made it so much more relevant to not buy the holder and KNOW your cards, yourself.

.

That's more like it, you're right. Half are probably real!!

I'm usually not that negative, believe it or not

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by johnny630

90% of these sold prices at auction with certain ebay consigners and or auction houses since 2014 have been fake total bs......market manipulation on top of doctored cards......worse is my biggest fear that the tpg's are all in on this....the can of worms has been opened up.........it"s ugly.....a lot of people had a ton of money in 2010-2012 then all the sudden late 2013/2014 the stuff went crazy....why because of so called investors ??? Were they fake?? Hell yes... That's when the s all started.......
What a total disgrace

plus one

[Fuddjcal]

Originally Posted by Paul S

Shades of Latrell Sprewell.

https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/cri...rts/e/58063788

These guys do a great podcast. GO Latrell!!!!!!!!!

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by phikappapsi

There should be a grading company that simply assesses authenticity. No "grades". Just tell me if it's real so I can be 100% sure I'm not buying a reprint online. Beyond that. Every buyer can make their own determination on condition. At least then all the fraud would be above board.

AMEN!

I've been saying this exact thing for years. But nobody cares or agrees...

They're all too caught up in their Pops, 9s and 10s. I guess that somehow a third party randomly assigning a number grade (right or wrong) gives them a high of sorts.

Would love to see it all come crumbling down, but am not holding my breath.

[Republicaninmass]

Is there a prize for the most people posting a row on one's ignore list?

[perezfan]

I'd consider it a badge of honor to be on that list.