Robot Umps in AAA this year

[doug.goodman]

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/35434317

I for one like the "human" element, even though that sometimes leads to mistakes, but of course I'm old enough to remember readable autographs and players with day jobs, so what do I know?

Doug

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by doug.goodman

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/35434317

I for one like the "human" element, even though that sometimes leads to mistakes, but of course I'm old enough to remember readable autographs and players with day jobs, so what do I know?

Doug

Bring 'em on. I have no warm fuzzies for incorrect calls.

[BobC]

Maybe some silly questions, but do these ABS systems monitor just a supposed 2D strike zone at the front of the plate or the back of the plate? Or do they have the technology to now make these ABS strike zone monitoring systems cover a 3D cube-like strike zone that includes the strike zone for the plate from the front to the back? Many pitchers have balls that can be moving quite a bit and can start out in the strike zone at the front of the plate, but then fall out at the back end. Or are maybe outside the strike zone at the front of the plate, but then hit it at the back end. To me, the strike zone should be a 3D zone covering the entire plate, front to back.

Also, the strike zone of each batter can, and pretty much always does, vary based on the batter's height and batting stance, no? So how does an ABS monitoring system take this into account for each and every different batter? Would seem to me that every single player that was going to be subject to having balls and strikes called using such an ABS system should have to take some kind of preliminary batting practice session or something, using one of these systems to then monitor and measure their normal stance to determine what their possibly unique strike zone, from top to bottom, is, and somehow have that then programmed into an ABS monitoring system so when they come up to bat the system somehow knows to use the correct strike zone for them. Think Eddie Gaedel. The side-to-side strike zone will never vary as it is determined by the width of the plate, which is fixed for all batters.

[michael3322]

Baseball needs roboumps.

Just check out the actual accuracy of umpires (sure some are quite good, but even the best are nowhere near perfect):
https://umpscorecards.com

Single bad strike calls can change the entire game. And it happens way too often.

Human eyes are not perfect. Better to use this technology and provide consistency to both teams.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by BobC

Maybe some silly questions, but do these ABS systems monitor just a supposed 2D strike zone at the front of the plate or the back of the plate? Or do they have the technology to now make these ABS strike zone monitoring systems cover a 3D cube-like strike zone that includes the strike zone for the plate from the front to the back? Many pitchers have balls that can be moving quite a bit and can start out in the strike zone at the front of the plate, but then fall out at the back end. Or are maybe outside the strike zone at the front of the plate, but then hit it at the back end. To me, the strike zone should be a 3D zone covering the entire plate, front to back.

Also, the strike zone of each batter can, and pretty much always does, vary based on the batter's height and batting stance, no? So how does an ABS monitoring system take this into account for each and every different batter? Would seem to me that every single player that was going to be subject to having balls and strikes called using such an ABS system should have to take some kind of preliminary batting practice session or something, using one of these systems to then monitor and measure their normal stance to determine what their possibly unique strike zone, from top to bottom, is, and somehow have that then programmed into an ABS monitoring system so when they come up to bat the system somehow knows to use the correct strike zone for them. Think Eddie Gaedel. The side-to-side strike zone will never vary as it is determined by the width of the plate, which is fixed for all batters.

Those are a couple of fantastic questions/observations, for which I would love to know the answers as well. A big breaking curve ball can clip the front corner of the plate, but also be outside of the strike zone when it hits the catcher's mitt. So they would need to have 3 dimensional technology to be accurate.

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by BobC

Maybe some silly questions, but do these ABS systems monitor just a supposed 2D strike zone at the front of the plate or the back of the plate? Or do they have the technology to now make these ABS strike zone monitoring systems cover a 3D cube-like strike zone that includes the strike zone for the plate from the front to the back? Many pitchers have balls that can be moving quite a bit and can start out in the strike zone at the front of the plate, but then fall out at the back end. Or are maybe outside the strike zone at the front of the plate, but then hit it at the back end. To me, the strike zone should be a 3D zone covering the entire plate, front to back.

Also, the strike zone of each batter can, and pretty much always does, vary based on the batter's height and batting stance, no? So how does an ABS monitoring system take this into account for each and every different batter? Would seem to me that every single player that was going to be subject to having balls and strikes called using such an ABS system should have to take some kind of preliminary batting practice session or something, using one of these systems to then monitor and measure their normal stance to determine what their possibly unique strike zone, from top to bottom, is, and somehow have that then programmed into an ABS monitoring system so when they come up to bat the system somehow knows to use the correct strike zone for them. Think Eddie Gaedel. The side-to-side strike zone will never vary as it is determined by the width of the plate, which is fixed for all batters.

Yes, it's 3D.

Yes, it adjusts for batter height & stance.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by perezfan

Those are a couple of fantastic questions/observations, for which I would love to know the answers as well. A big breaking curve ball can clip the front corner of the plate, but also be outside of the strike zone when it hits the catcher's mitt. So they would need to have 3 dlimensional technology to be accurate.

That is exactly what I'm thinking Mark, if you want to be truly as impartial as possible. We can all see on TV when the stations do a replay and have their imposed strike zone on the screen so you can possibly see how close a pitch was to being a strike, but I believe those are only 2D measures they are using. Couple that with needing some way to then differentiate between different batters high and low strike zone limits, and my thinking is if you can't properly roll out true 3D ABS Monitoring Systems, with proper measurement and reflection of differing batter's strike zones, don't mess with it at all and just leave the human umpires behind the plate for now. In other words, if you're only going to do it half-ass, don't bother doing it at all.

And you're still going to have a human ump behind the plate anyway, to call out fall tips, check swings, stepping out of the batter's box, plays at the plate, and so on.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by Tabe

Yes, it's 3D.

Yes, it adjusts for batter height & stance.

Good to hear then. Anything less doesn't make any sense to me otherwise. Just never read up on exactly what and how these ABS Monitoring Systems operate. Thanks for the heads-up.

[EddieP]

Robo umps worked in the Atlantic League.

[Lucas00]

I like the ump behind the plate still to kind of "keep the peace" imagine two teams on edge. It's kind of a lawless thought. Ganging up on the batter or the batter intentionally backing up to hit the catcher etc. Imo definitely still needs to be somebody behind the plate at the very least with an earpiece keeping track of the count and keeping everything in check.

I know the ump is still there now, but who knows the changes that could happen if this is hugely successful. They may try to get rid of umps all together. And display everything on a screen.

[KCRfan1]

I would love to watch Earl Weaver argue ball and strikes with one of these things.

It would be classic.

I'm for keeping thing things simple. While there is a place for tech in our lives, I love the human element of baseball.

If anyone is expecting " perfection " from robo ump, they're mistaken.

There will be glitch, some sensor will be " off " and so on and so forth.

Maybe I'm becoming an old man, but can't we just keep things simple?

You kids stay off my lawn! Next time I'm keeping your ball!

[jingram058]

I live in the past, just check my location in my net54 signature. No robotic umps, no 4 finger intentional walks, no instant replays, no designated hitters, no multitudes of pitching changes, no gym pants in lieu of real baseball pants and socks. None of that garbage. I have enough classic complete games, both radio and TV broadcasts, saved on various hard drives, to last the rest of whatever life I have left. You can have this modern day crap. Enjoy.

[BobbyStrawberry]

I welcome the robo umps, especially when Angel Hernandez is behind the plate!

[GasHouseGang]

I don't know, it could be fun.

[HobokenJon]

We should've known the umps were doomed when the FTX logo started appearing on their shirts.

[butchie_t]

Originally Posted by jingram058

I live in the past, just check my location in my net54 signature. No robotic umps, no 4 finger intentional walks, no instant replays, no designated hitters, no multitudes of pitching changes, no gym pants in lieu of real baseball pants and socks. None of that garbage. I have enough classic complete games, both radio and TV broadcasts, saved on various hard drives, to last the rest of whatever life I have left. You can have this modern day crap. Enjoy.

You get an AMEN! from me on this. I'll just set up a robot to watch the game and be done with it.

ugh

Butch

[doug.goodman]

Originally Posted by KCRfan1

I would love to watch Earl Weaver argue ball and strikes with one of these things.

It would be classic.

I'm for keeping thing things simple. While there is a place for tech in our lives, I love the human element of baseball.

If anyone is expecting " perfection " from robo ump, they're mistaken.

There will be glitch, some sensor will be " off " and so on and so forth.

Maybe I'm becoming an old man, but can't we just keep things simple?

You kids stay off my lawn! Next time I'm keeping your ball!

My lawn doesn't get called when the internet goes down...

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by kcrfan1

i would love to watch earl weaver argue ball and strikes with one of these things.

It would be classic...

l m f a o

[z28jd]

They had roboumps in the Florida State League this year. Watched about 25-30 games with it. You honestly don't even know it's going on unless they tell you. The ump still signals the calls like he's the one actually making them. He has an earpiece that immediately gives him the call and he signals it. I guarantee that at least 90% of the people watching the game had no clue roboumps were being used.

[Mike D.]

I'm old enough now that I reserve my nostalgia for things that were actually good.

[Mike D.]

Originally Posted by Lucas00

I like the ump behind the plate still to kind of "keep the peace" imagine two teams on edge. It's kind of a lawless thought. Ganging up on the batter or the batter intentionally backing up to hit the catcher etc. Imo definitely still needs to be somebody behind the plate at the very least with an earpiece keeping track of the count and keeping everything in check.

I think Robo Umps will be fine at this. I'm basing this on what I've seen in movies like Terminator and RoboCop.

[Fred]

Maybe they'll start sewing sensors to the uniforms to make things even tighter for strike/ball calling accuracy.

Just think, they can cut up the used sensors and apply them to cards to create really nifty chase cards

This is going to take some getting used to but when you think about it, there will be one strike zone. It'll be interesting to see how accurate it will be with some of those nasty breaking balls that run in/out/up/down as the ball crosses the plate. No more nasty looks a the ump on called pitches. It'll be funny when the players get called on something they thought was a ball and then look at the ump really funny. What will be really interesting is to have the umps have maintain a device they use to call the balls strikes and then have MLB see just how far off the umps are. What will about 5%-6% more accuracy on ball calling do for the game?

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by Fred

Maybe they'll start sewing sensors to the uniforms to make things even tighter for strike/ball calling accuracy.

Just think, they can cut up the used sensors and apply them to cards to create really nifty chase cards…

With GPS tracking, tied to an NFT. Monitored by MLB.

OMG

[D. Bergin]

Get the right call. I can't wait.

...and if the Roboump makes 1 bad call for every 100 bad calls an ump makes, I'll gladly accept the ramifications of whatever that means for the "sanctity of the game".

If this gets bumped up to MLB anytime soon, the Yankees might very well get their money's worth out of Aaron Judge if he stays healthy for at least a few more years.

Biggest downside out of all of this, is I think this will benefit the hitters long-term, much more then the pitchers. Once hitters get a sense of where their zone is being set up by the computer, they will settle in without having to worry about where today's strike zone is going to be...depending on who's standing behind the catcher.

The better hitters will learn to become much more selective about what they chase or bail out on, and what they don't.

I think we will see a lot more walks.

[Mike D.]

Interesting thought Dave on this benefiting hitters. It's quite possible...although I could see the high strike actually getting called benefiting pitchers.

Of course, the consistency benefits everyone...hitter, pitchers, managers, fans...and that's a good thing.

[BobC]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

Get the right call. I can't wait.

...and if the Roboump makes 1 bad call for every 100 bad calls an ump makes, I'll gladly accept the ramifications of whatever that means for the "sanctity of the game".

If this gets bumped up to MLB anytime soon, the Yankees might very well get their money's worth out of Aaron Judge if he stays healthy for at least a few more years.

Biggest downside out of all of this, is I think this will benefit the hitters long-term, much more then the pitchers. Once hitters get a sense of where their zone is being set up by the computer, they will settle in without having to worry about where today's strike zone is going to be...depending on who's standing behind the catcher.

The better hitters will learn to become much more selective about what they chase or bail out on, and what they don't.

I think we will see a lot more walks.

Great point about a possible long-term benefit to hitters. Makes excellent sense that better hitters can take advantage of a truly fixed and more consistent strike zone.

And as a potential added collateral result, it may also lead to more emphasis down the road on grabbing pitchers that throw balls that move more than others, rather than just those that throw 100+ MPH fastballs. Extreme backend movement could become the new 101 MPH fastball seemingly desired in every pitcher's repertoire today.

[Tabe]

Originally Posted by KCRfan1

If anyone is expecting " perfection " from robo ump, they're mistaken.

There will be glitch, some sensor will be " off " and so on and so forth.

Perfection isn't the goal. Better is. Robot umps will be better.

And we already have "glitches" you mention, as anybody who saw Livan Hernandez Game 7 can attest.

[perezfan]

Originally Posted by Mike D.

I'm old enough now that I reserve my nostalgia for things that were actually good.

Good one!

I tend to romanticize everything in the past. But this is one exception. Will not miss bad calls from umps that influence the game's outcome.

I just hope they can get it right. Somehow I have to believe Manfred will find a way to f*ck it up.

[D. Bergin]

Originally Posted by BobC

And as a potential added collateral result, it may also lead to more emphasis down the road on grabbing pitchers that throw balls that move more than others, rather than just those that throw 100+ MPH fastballs. Extreme backend movement could become the new 101 MPH fastball seemingly desired in every pitcher's repertoire today.

Yeah, I think that's already standard practice. Fans bag on modern hitters approaches, but one thing they can do, is hit a 100mph fastball very far, pretty routinely.

Clay Holmes throws a 100+ mph sinkerball, but when it's not sinking, he gets tattooed. Aroldis Chapman isn't worth the mound he's standing on when his ball isn't moving for him...even when he's hitting 104 or so. His occasional wildness actually works to his advantage. He might be out of a job permanently, if hitters just wait for him to put it inside of their batters box for them.

[jayshum]

This also means that catchers trying to frame pitches will no longer be needed. I don't think they're going to fool a roboump.

[etsmith]

I don't see how a robo umpire could possibly be worse than some of the umpires we have now. And some of the problems people mentioned that might happen with robo umpires already happen with human umpires. I've already seen some of the umpires not adjust the strikes zone enough for a shorter player to get a fair shake.

[mq711]

I think the robo umps are necessary for two main reasons. First the movement that these guys can put on a 100+ pitch is almost impossible to follow with the naked eye. MLB umpires seem to have Supreme Court Justices status as it pertains to a job for life. But there is a skill set involved in umpiring that is somewhat based on physical limitations that deteriorate overtime (real world example would be night driving at age 42 and 62). Umpires should have tryouts or be skill tested just like players with MLB getting the best and the others sent down so they can improve themselves.

[FrankWakefield]

+1 James, post 12

+1 Butch, post 16


I still use an ink on paper pocket calendar to keep track of court dates and appointments. It's great. If I drop it, it still works, the screen doesn't crack. If it get's wet, the permanent in doesn't run. The battery never goes down to 0% on my paper calendar. I usually can recall what I've written just by having written it, I don't have that recall when I try to type on that little iPhone keyboard. I can be on the phone and look at my calendar simultaneously.

At the AAA level there aren't huge bucks on the line in one plate appearance. In the majors, with incentive contracts, it just might matter a bit.