Why does Post/Jello matter when other similar issues don't

[darkhorse9]

There is a big difference in scarcity pricing for Post and Jello cards from (particularly) 1963. I know there's a slight difference in the red stat line. Other than that you can't tell the difference between Post issues or Jello issues.

If there wasn't a red line difference would there be any price difference? Would we even consider them as separate issues?

I think about issues like Hostess panels from the 1970's. They were issued on different products and the prices reflect scarcity for the overall product, but we don't differentiate between the products, even when panels are issued on multiple product lines.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by darkhorse9

If there wasn't a red line difference would there be any price difference? Would we even consider them as separate issues?

Would it be possible to tell the difference if there wasn't the red line on some and not on others? Maybe the thickness of the stock would be the only way to tell them apart?

It doesn't trouble me that they are viewed as separate issues, even with their similarities. In some ways, it's not that different than having OPC and Topps, or US Topps and Venezuelan Topps. While they are all very similar, there are usually some differences that make them recognizable, and for the obsessive amongst us, drives us to collect them all.

When it comes to Post and Jell-o, more exciting for me is collecting the whole boxes or complete panels. Those definitely seem like they should be treated as different issues, IMO.

And looking closely at the images below, at least for my man Mays, it sure seems like there are some subtle differences between the two photos, just in the way that they're cropped.

[whiteymet]

The Jello cards are smaller than the Post Cereal cards.

Also the bottom right corner of the photo on Post ends over the E in League, while the same corner ends close to the next letter In Mays's case the B in Batting.

I also believe the stars on either side of the card number on the Jello cards are closer together than on the Post

[swarmee]

I think he's asking "big picture", who cares?

I'll say that there's a big difference between cereals and jell-os than there is different types of snack cakes, so maybe mentally they're just catalogued differently in people's minds. The short prints also differ between the two sets, plus there were only three years of them, so they're easier to keep straight. And they've got the 1950s/60s superstars, rather than the less interesting 1970s stars.

And even being 10 years earlier, the supply is less making them a more satisfying chase.

[Balticfox]

Another reason is that the Post/Jell-O issues are iconic and have a rabid core of collectors. The multiple available variants are therefore very important to these collectors.

[darkhorse9]

So, is it safe to say that a complete set that includes both Post and Jello would be an abomination to the hobby?

[Balticfox]

Hmmmm, an "abomination"? Well close perhaps....

[Rich Klein]

1) When I was collecting way back in the day, I did combine the 63 Post/Jello because the 63 Post Mantle was very tough and out of my price range.

And the 62's are an obvious difference between Post and Jello and the 63's are different enough to split into two sets.

It's always been accepted that way in the hobby but that's the real reason is the 63 Post had some super tough cards which just don't show up very often.

Rich

[Zach Wheat]

Originally Posted by darkhorse9

....I think about issues like Hostess panels from the 1970's. They were issued on different products and the prices reflect scarcity for the overall product, but we don't differentiate between the products, even when panels are issued on multiple product lines.

Good points, on the regular Hostess issue of cards. However, most collectors view the black bar variation of Hostess Twinkies as more desirable. This is probably because they view this as a separate set.

The 1975 "Twinkies" set contains some of the most scarce rookie cards of certain players. jhmo, this issue is underappreciated by collectors when viewed solely on price due to condition sensitivity issues

[gonefishin]

Originally Posted by Rich Klein

1) When I was collecting way back in the day, I did combine the 63 Post/Jello because the 63 Post Mantle was very tough and out of my price range.

And the 62's are an obvious difference between Post and Jello and the 63's are different enough to split into two sets.

It's always been accepted that way in the hobby but that's the real reason is the 63 Post had some super tough cards which just don't show up very often.

Rich

Rich, Jim here. I've been collecting a long time. Attached is my 63 Aspromonte. I cut this card from the box myself back in the day and it lay stored in a cigar box for about 30-40 years. I had no idea that it was even valuable until I looked it up one day. I know, it's in rough shape. Back then we actually tore them from the panel most of the time as we saw no need to cut them with scissors. Noone considered them worth anything back then, but when you couldn't afford a nickel for a pack this is how you got them.

The 63 Post Aspromonte is probably the only post cereal card more valuable than Mantle, Mays, etc.

[Zach Wheat]

Neat story Jim...exactly the reason I don't mind collecting beat up items

[skil55voy]

The sets themselves are relatively small at 200 cards each.

For 1961 that number jumps to 300+ because of the sheets issued by the company. If you wanted a "complete set" you would need to add the perforated company cards. This is where "some" of the tougher cards come into play: IE Chuck Stobbs company only, Ed Mathews company etc..

1962 is 200 cards. No company send ins. A couple of the cards are tougher because of the cereal boxes they were on. (Bill White comes to mind, McCovey also) The set is actually quite doable without outrageous cost including the Mantle/Maris from life magazine. The 1962 Jell-o cards are a separate issue and is deemed a test issue. Very little information exists on distribution, what boxes the players were on etc. Nearly impossible to complete.

1963 is again 200 cards. This is where it gets sticky. The cereal promotion ended sometime in mid summer and THEN you were supposed to be able to complete your set with Jello cards. A pure marketing ploy resulting in short prints for the cereal cards and different short prints for Jello. Mantle is the prime example. Difficult in Post Cereal, plentiful in Jello. The Jello cards are smaller than the cereal cards as the red line in the stats box does not go to the end of the card. A second scarcity exists because of the box sizes. Jello was available in 2 different sizes 3oz and 6oz. Price was a factor AND a 3oz box could make enough Jello for a medium size family.

I have a theory on the 63 Jello set. The cards on the 6oz boxes may be harder to find than the 3oz: Jello had a craze for make crazy fruit salads using their product. Many banquets served these things. (I certainly remember them from my Cub Scout soirees) My guess is most boxes of 6oz were basically discarded. It's only a crazy thought.

Sorry for the droning, but I thought I could shed a little light on the subject. Dan Mabey's Post Cereal books are the ultimate guides to collecting the Post Cereal sets. (I didn't even mention the 1962 Post Cereal Canadian set) For the 1962 US Football set, Ken Marks has a very informative book covering that set. A couple have collected the info on the 63 Jello boxes. (Who is on what flavor and size) As for the 62 Jello set we have a compiled list.(Sizeand flavor) It is not complete.

[Exhibitman]

Nah, it's because there's always room for jello.

[Balticfox]

Originally Posted by skil55voy

The sets themselves are relatively small at 200 cards each.

Not so! They were only small in comparison to Topps Baseball card sets which were actually enormous compared to other card sets at the time.

Moreover the degree of difficulty in compiling a set must also be taken into consideration. You had to get your mother to buy, and then make, 200 packages of Jell-O! Or else toss a box or two of Bran Flakes or Grape-Nuts into the shopping cart as your mother wheeled it around the grocery store which I'm sure would have elicited a puzzled look from your mother. Then an angry rejoinder from her when you'd be reluctant to eat them. "You picked that cereal now you eat it! I'm not going to buy any more cereal until you finish every last bit of that box."

Originally Posted by skil55voy

Dan Mabey's Post Cereal books are the ultimate guides to collecting the Post Cereal sets. (I didn't even mention the 1962 Post Cereal Canadian set) For the 1962 US Football set, Ken Marks has a very informative book covering that set. A couple have collected the info on the 63 Jello boxes. (Who is on what flavor and size) As for the 62 Jello set we have a compiled list.(Sizeand flavor) It is not complete.

I agree! Dan Mabey's books are excellent. He very recently published new revised and expanded editions of each:

https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=354940

He might perhaps still have some left.

[Kenmarks]

Mike Skiles is right on. One thing I might add related to collectors of the Post Cereal and Jell-O cards and sets. While most collectors might go for basic 200 card sets (or less in the 62 Jell-O and Post CFL issues), some post enthusiasts do attempt putting together "Master Sets". A master set of some of the Post issues can sometimes reach into the mid-500s in terms of cards necessary to be complete ... as you need a card for each player coming from every cereal box each player appeared on (plus in the 1962 Post baseball, differences in the cards of Cash, Adcock, and Cepeda where they had differences in cards on their Grape Nut box appearances. Master sets are attainable (but far from easy) for all the American and Canadian Baseball and Football Post Cereal promotions. Recently a couple of collectors have put together master sets of the 1963 Jell-O set (324 total cards of which 180 are 6 oz. SP cards-brutal). And as Mike alludes to, not enough information is available to understand exactly what is included in a 1962 Jell-O master set.

Have texted with Dan a couple of times this week and he confirmed he does have copies of all his different books available to collectors.