College sports logo prints

[billyb]

Anyone have any ideas on these what appears to be printed logos. These are on shear cloth pieces. The couple I seen up close, the wording on the bottom was faded too much for me to read. But it appears to be manufactured in New York. Size was about 8" x 5".





college sports.jpg

[1880nonsports]

They are a slightly off the beaten path collectible silk (actually satin) designated S21. They were available in the 1911-1914 timeframe as inserts and as premiums. I included a link to the NS gallery for you. I have a "set" of "types" - all of the schools and all of the individual sports represented. Value depending on whether they still retain the 4 perimeter overlays (where the cutter was supposed to cut), are not trimmed, and no sewing holes. Figure from 10.00 - 75.00 with golf and base ball on the higher end. Some schools are tougher than others. Looking at your group above - figure about 140.00 retail. Mastro auctioned (or sold) a super uncut sheet with color bars for a handsome sum.

http://www1.coe.neu.edu/~dan/S22/go.html

[billyb]

1880,

Thank you for the link and the info. The colors really caught my attention, they are in very good shape. Thanks again.

billyb

[vintagesportscollector]

Bill - I collect these and enjoy them a lot. Dan (1880) is certainly an expert on these types of series. You have the larger S21 series - 5x8", and there is a smaller S22 series - 3.5 x 5.5". The larger series commands more, and golf, hockey, baseball and football go for more money. Depending on school and sport an s21 silk can be $150+. Search "Murad Silk" on ebay and you will see many listings. I've seen some go for over $200. Cornell Hockey S21, for example, commands a pretty high price. I would put your group above closer to $300+ figure.

[billyb]

Joe,
WOW! I will check ebay.

Thank You,
Billyb

[1880nonsports]

on the SOLD or active ones when trying to determine "value". They're out there - in the past I've sold nearly 100 of the S21's. Occasionally a golf or hockey silk will make it into a third digit but it's rare for this issue and the market has soften since the happy days of the early 2000's. A stained silk like the golf one above likely wouldn't eclipse 10-15 dollars, same with the "lesser" sports. I figured about 30.00 for the BB and maybe 75.00 for the golfer. It's all a crap shoot. Neat items but silks, felts, rugs get little love..........I'm putting a set together of the Brown silks for my brother. My sister went to Smith - I might have to start with the cough drops.

[1880nonsports]

and BTW - my name is Henry :-) As for expert - likely not! I suppose I do get props for living as long as I have......
If you like this kind of thing - check out the silks in the college S23 series as I think them to be the most interesting with a "flavor" all their own.

[vintagesportscollector]

Good perspective Henry. Thanks. The S23 college yell series is very nice.

[billyb]

Thanks Henry,

I appreciate you sharing your knowledge. I had your name written down in past raffles I held, but could not find the list, sorry.
Once again, thank you.

Billyb

[billyb]

Got lucky and won the lot for $40. Henry and Joe, thank you both.

Billyb

[billyb]

Henry,
On the Columbia golfer, what looks like a stain just right of the golfer, is actually like a shadow of the golfer. It may have been a silk screen error, sort of like a double image, as it is the exact shape of the golfer including the golf club.
Have you seen any of these double images before?

[1880nonsports]

don't think it's any type of error - likely just a ghosting image from another silk - obviously without it in hand and without a lot of time to study it as I'm packing - I could be wrong. I've seen a few severe miscuts but don't recall ever seeing anything along the lines you are suggesting.

[billyb]

Thanks Henry,
I am away from the silks at this time, but when I get back to my printer, I will provide a better image.

[billyb]

As promised, here is another scan of the Columbia golfer. To me, this is not a bleed from another silk, the shadow image is too perfectly placed. Also, if it were a stain, I would assume it would bleed through the satin cloth, and show up on the back. But the back does not show any signs of bleeding through. I believe this is a printers error that they let go. So can anyone tell me what may have happened?

MY GUESS: On the first print attempt, did they realized the print was not centered properly, and they stopped the process, just after it started, leaving the shadow, Then reprinted on the same satin cloth, threw it in the Murad cigarette package, and let it go. The printing company probably paid by piece work, did not want to waste any product, so they just passed it through with the rest of the good prints????

Any other thoughts??
Does this make this silk an "error silk"....LOL??

2016-01-25 Columbia golfer S21 pic 3 001.jpg

[1880nonsports]

as there's no part of the process or image the "stain" would represent. One of the silks sat on the other long enough and it ghosted an image - I think nothing more nothing less. It didn't have to be wet or just printed. Just an opinion billy boy - really haven't had much time to think about it. I'll look again in a day or two.....

[billyb]

Henry,

Perhaps, the ghosted image did come from a silk on top of this one, I just cannot believe, the silk on top, so perfectly placed, so that the space between the ghost and the color print, is evenly spaced.
Oh Well, it is beginning to get to be one of my favorites, don't know why, maybe different, like the runt of a litter of puppies.