Another Irv Lerner Fake?

http://www.hugginsandscott.com/cgi-b...l?itemid=81442

I assume it should have a round dieges stamp and not balfour 14k... I have been comparing a lot of photos... I did see that balfour later worked on a players ring and stamped it balfour.. im confused.. thoughts?

[sports-rings]

WOW,

thanks for pointing that out!

that's the "Irv Lerner special" - the stamping inside of the ring is his and only his. The stamping is not a real Balfour stamp.

I am behind at work, give me a day or two, I will post pictures of real Yankee marks and show how this is his fake stamping.

If anyone does not believe me, email me and I will send the official Irv Lerner newsletter pdf where he boasts he will make any Yankee ring you want.

Feel free to send the pdf to Balfour, Major League Baseball, Hauls of Shame, or the Yankees.

If Irv is reading this, I invite you to sue me for slander. the discovery process where we can ask each other questions under oath would be very informative to the ring collecting community!

I will let the auction company know it's fake too, they have been very responsive in the past when it's been pointed out that the rings are fake.

Somebody also recently bought this. I love how it has Irv Lerners name on it. There is a cold cell waiting for this man somewhere.

http://www.lelands.com/Auction/Aucti...mpionship-Ring

[sports-rings]

There are other Irv Learner yankee rings from the minor leagues out there. Someone a few months ago purchased a different "Learner" Yankee minor league ring out there and was pissed when he discovered the history of Irv Lerner and his assortment of bad rings.

He was trying to get his money back from the auction house, and I have no idea if he was successful.

He has ripped me off and plenty of others. I hope that p-o-s comes after me, would love to show the proper authorities what he has done. Amazingly, Jostens, Balfour, The Yankees, The NFL, just don't seem to care.

[sports-rings]

The ring in the Huggins and Scott auction has the fake Balfour markings.

I am posting three photos, one showing a real ring and the fake ring in the auction and the last two photos showing fake Balfour markings, and authentic Balfour markings from the 1950s and 1960s (note, modern Balfour stamping is very different and not shown).

If you look carefully at a real ring and the fake ring you will notice the Stars in the real ring are much sharper and crisper. Balfour made the original rings with a rough surface on the right side of the baseball and the fake ring fails to reproduce it. The inner circle on the bottom of the top hat is also of much better quality on the real ring.

Irv will say the ring is worn, and that's why is looks different, yet the top of the ring is in pristine condition. Also notice that the word "Yankees" looks like some effort went into making it look correct on the fake ring, while the word "Yankees" flows better on the real ring.

Irv loves to say, "Balfour" lost the molds when they moved so the rings are not exact, yet why is the markings trying to mimic vintage markings? And when did Balfour start making shoddy replacement rings?

The last picture shown in the fake-markings photograph is the Balfour stamp from the current Huggins and Scott auction. It clearly looks identical to the other fake ring markings shown above in the same photograph. The crooks that stamped these rings tried to use old-style type and tried to capture the look and feel of vintage Balfour marks.

The tell-tale sign is that on every fake salesman sample ring the "14" is always either touching or almost touching the word "Balfour". Additionally, their stamps are always very deep and rarely show imperfections the way a real Balfour stamp does.

Now look at the picture with real Balfour Markings. These photos all came from real rings (not salesman samples) with very clear paperwork from the original owners and/or their families.

Notice that the "14" is never touching or almost touching the word "Balfour" and notice that there are imperfections in the stamping techniques.

It's uncanny, that there are so many Balfour salesman samples around, yet they never, every have the proper Balfour markings. It's also uncanny, that a real Balfour ring, with unquestionable lineage and documentation never comes to the market place with a "14" touching or almost touching the word "Balfour".

How can this be?

Also, these rings are very easy to reproduce so making a fake is easy.

I will be reaching out to Huggins and Scott and relay what they say.

[tcornett]

Does this guy only do Yankees rings, or are there examples like this from other teams as well?

Tim

I have been wondering if these 1969 mets rings are Irv Lerners. Jenkins has made fake rings for him, they should be Jostens and not Jenkins, also he loves making fake New York rings.

http://www.championship-rings.net/product_p/31110.htm

http://www.robertedwardauctions.com/.../2006/899.html

[redwings58]

Originally Posted by tcornett

Does this guy only do Yankees rings, or are there examples like this from other teams as well?

Tim

It is definitely more than just Yankees rings.

[Exhibitman]

Is this about the old guy with the terrible toupee and the bad attitude at the National?

[sports-rings]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Is this about the old guy with the terrible toupee and the bad attitude at the National?

That's him, besides a crook, he is a miserable SOB

And shame on Tim, at sports-rings.net. He should know better than to have a Jenkins ring on his site.

Yes, Irv has a relationship with Jenkins and another big time ring dealer with the initials SW told me he heard someone out there with high end equipment was making stampings of companies they were not affiliated with.

[sports-rings]

Originally Posted by tcornett

Does this guy only do Yankees rings, or are there examples like this from other teams as well?

Tim

Yes, he does a ton of Nets rings with fake Josten marks. I will try to put together his fake mark with a real one for a side by side comparison in a day or two.

Email me and I will send the official Irv Lerner Newsletter where he boasts he will make you any Yankee ring with any name on the ring (please pass it along to MLB, Balfour, Jostens, and the NFL.

Why do questionable ring listings often mention Irv Lerner? Btw I filed a complaint with the FBI last year when he defrauded me, but ive yet to hear back.

http://legendaryauctions.com/mobile/...entoryid=21950

[Leon]

Originally Posted by jbits

Why do questionable ring listings often mention Irv Lerner? Btw I filed a complaint with the FBI last year when he defrauded me, but ive yet to hear back.

http://legendaryauctions.com/mobile/...entoryid=21950

Here is a notice to all of our new participants, or old ones who should know ...
"If you give an opinion of a person or company your full name needs to be in your post."
That rule is at the top of every page. Thanks for your understanding and please, please...carry on .....

and if anyone wouldn't want to do that, and they have posted something, then they can edit their comments out..

I asked a question. I didnt give an opinion. You can delete my account if you want to make a false accusation against me.

[sports-rings]

Originally Posted by jbits

I asked a question. I didnt give an opinion. You can delete my account if you want to make a false accusation against me.

Please don't take it that way and please don't delete your account.

Unlike many other forum sites, including sportslogos.net, you truly can say anything you want here. Very very little if anything is moderated out.

Yes, if you ask questions or make benign statements you are fine remaining anonymous.

If you make any statements then they ask that you stand behind the statements and put your name. There are hundreds of members on this site (yes, mostly in the other sections) who agree to this term.

To reduce spam and internet search from ruing your life, you are 100% permitted to use special characters, such as J_ohn, M*ary, J~O~E, etc.

[sports-rings]

I heard back from Huggins and Scott yesterday afternoon.

They saw this thread on Net54baseball.com and said they had one bidder and wanted to reach out to him before cancelling the item or updating the description.

I see the auction listing continues..... http://www.hugginsandscott.com/cgi-b...l?itemid=81442

My concern is stating the items I collect, and giving my full name which can easily direct somebody to wear I live. I dont live in a safe deposit box.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by jbits

My concern is stating the items I collect, and giving my full name which can easily direct somebody to wear I live. I dont live in a safe deposit box.

I understand but there are no exceptions to our rule. Collectors on this board have 10s of millions of dollars, if not more, in collectibles. When they say things as you have they have their names in their posts.

If Someone said the things you have said in this thread about you, would you want to know who it was? I would guess you would, I know I would. That is the main criteria we use for being private on the board. Since these Lerner fakes are so embedded in our hobby, and have been known about for so many years, this thread can stay as it is. However, there are no exceptions to our rule. If you give anymore opinions of a company or person please have your name in your post. If not, I will put it there permanently...same rules for everyone, including me. Nothing personal.
Thanks for your understanding.

btw, if you have very valuable stuff, as I and a lot others do, you should consider a safe deposit box. It's the best $100 a year I spend...

Delete my account

[Leon]

Originally Posted by jbits

Delete my account

Deleted. Sorry it came to that but, If you don't want to stand behind what you say, and need to give opinions of people or companies, then you should find another place to visit. Nothing personal. This forum isn't for everyone.

[sports-rings]

Here is another example of a fake Irv Lerner salesman sample. The photo includes the real ring and also includes the fake scripted J and two samples of real Josten logos with the proper J.

I am also including an excerpt from his newsletter, where is states he can make any Yankee ring in any size and with any name.

You can also see he is selling the 1996 Jeter gold-filled salesaman sample, that has been seen in numerous auctions and mis-stated as being a genuine Balfour salesman sample.

[sports-rings]

Originally Posted by jbits

http://www.hugginsandscott.com/cgi-b...l?itemid=81442

I assume it should have a round dieges stamp and not balfour 14k... I have been comparing a lot of photos... I did see that balfour later worked on a players ring and stamped it balfour.. im confused.. thoughts?

Huggins and Scott let me know that the item has been pulled. Great job to them and a big thanks!

[Rohder19]

So are all Irv Lerner rings fake? I see almost all the rings in the Huggins action have his name on the invoices. Should these rings be stayed away from?

[sports-rings]

Originally Posted by Rohder19

So are all Irv Lerner rings fake? I see almost all the rings in the Huggins action have his name on the invoices. Should these rings be stayed away from?

Those who have collected rings far longer than I have, said Irv had a huge, real collection.

He collected in large quantity, not quality, meaning he has tons of minor league rings, bowling rings, etc. He does not have many professional, jajor leage, player rings.

He collected salesman sample rings too.

I would imagine many of them are real, experience has taught me many of his salesman sample rings are not real. It he goes through the trouble of making salesman sample rings, I would be careful with any ring that came from his collection.