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#1
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It takes a lot of balls to soak a $6600 card, but I guess it paid off in end.
Still a NM (7) and you can still see the remnants of the tape stains IS a little concerning. Wonder if that would be a (7) on any modern card with similar evidence of past taping on it. Looking at the REA auction, it was probably cleaned up just to get the (4). Now another round of cleaning got it to a (7). |
#2
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__________________
Check out my aging Sell/Trade Album on my Profile page HOF Type Collector + Philly A's, E/M/W cards, M101-6, Exhibits, Postcards, 30's Premiums & HOF Photos "Assembling an unfocused collection for nearly 50 years." |
#3
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Is there a company not out there that specifically cleans/fixes cards?
It's hard to say with this pic/card, but I would tend to believe it was professionally done?
__________________
52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#4
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It may have been professionally done.
The question is why wasn't it "professionally" caught?
__________________
Check out my aging Sell/Trade Album on my Profile page HOF Type Collector + Philly A's, E/M/W cards, M101-6, Exhibits, Postcards, 30's Premiums & HOF Photos "Assembling an unfocused collection for nearly 50 years." |
#5
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Because there is no money in that.
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#6
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Or another question should be who submitted the card and did they get a favor done. #PSAblewit
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#7
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Quote:
Quote:
http://www.gonewiththestain.com/
__________________
52 Topps cards. https://www.flickr.com/photos/144160280@N05/ http://www.net54baseball.com/album.php?albumid=922 |
#8
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I don't know much about restoration of cards, but to me this looks like the first card was up against some acidic paper and the two corners were protected. The result is toning, which happens in old prints that have been framed with non-acid free mats and backing. The process to remove this toning is well established and very common. If my assumptions are correct, it might not have taken a whole lot to remove the toning from this one.
__________________
Collection: https://www.flickr.com/photos/132359235@N05/sets/ Ebay listings: https://www.ebay.com/sch/harrydoyle/...p2047675.l2562 |
#9
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#10
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There's restoration companies that clean up posters, but that's more accepted in that field. They aren't cheap but I'm sure some of them would handle cards if given the business. This one certainly paid off for somebody. Likely not the guy who bought it from Goldin though. They'll probably be ecstatic if they break even at this point. |
#11
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__________________
Check out https://www.thecollectorconnection.com Always looking for consignments 717.327.8915 We sell your less expensive pre-war cards individually instead of in bulk lots to make YOU the most money possible! and Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thecollectorconnectionauctions |
#12
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#13
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WWG DiMaggio
I don't care about its past, it's a PSA 7 now and I'll take it!!!
It's like a fat broad that loses 75 pounds and becomes hot. |
#14
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Just so you know those women that lose 75 pounds only look hot with clothes on. Last edited by bnorth; 02-03-2017 at 06:13 PM. |
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Lol
So true!!
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#16
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lolol
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#17
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Great card, and have zero problem with removing tape and stain residue If I had the cheddar, I'd still want to own it
__________________
Neal Successful transactions with Peter Spaeth, Phil Garry, Don Hontz, JStottlemire, maj78, bcbgcbrcb, secondhandwatches, esehobmbre, Leon, Jetsfan, Brian Van Horn, Brian Dwyer, MGHPro, DeanH, canofcorn, Zigger Zagger, conor912, RayBShotz, Jay Wolt, AConte, Halbig Vintage and many others |
#18
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Wwg
Right !!! It's a darn POP 1 PSA 7. None higher!!!
Why are we even attempting to knock this card? Any one of us would kill to have this. Last edited by aloondilana; 02-03-2017 at 07:12 PM. |
#19
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Gee John I hope that is not how you came to own it.
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#20
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If the restoration is acceptable to the community then there should be no concern about disclosing it. But somehow i am guessing PWCC is not going to do that and the consignor would not want that.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
#21
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Highest regards, Larry |
#22
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Are we talking about shallow "Joe"
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#23
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That is a great analogy, but in the eyes of some (like Peter) it would be like she lost that 75 pounds by having marathon sex with hundreds of different men. Yeah, she looks great, but she is tarnished. I happen to agree with you that I don't really care if the card was soaked so long as it grades. The Mona Lisa and the Sisteen Chapel get restored all the time. I don't think any of us would consider those works of art to be tarnished or less valuable because of it. After all aren't baseball cards just small pieces of art?
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#24
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There is no deception in art restoration. There is a world of deception in baseball card restoration/alteration, because rarely is any of it disclosed, and the whole point is to make a card look better and grade higher while deceiving the grading companies and potential buyers into thinking it's original.
As I said, if the restoration in this case is no big deal, then the consignor should have no objection to its disclosure. But something tells me the consignor would have been furious if PWCC had posted a picture of the SGC 50 in the auction and explained the work done by Towle or whoever did it. Can't have it both ways. If it's acceptable and even a good thing as some seem to be saying, you should have no objection to disclosure.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 02-04-2017 at 06:48 AM. |
#25
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#26
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i highly doubt this card was "just" soaked!
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#27
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Maybe a little bleach, a little of this, a lot of that.......
Look at that REA version of the card. If those lighter spots are the original color of the card, then that's not "toning". That's a stain! I'd guess it was soaked out of a scrapbook. The "toning" is glue residue that seeped into the paper, and the lighter marks are one of three things. #1. Old tape that covered that area, and then deteriorated #2. Something similar to stamp mounts #3. The evidence of whatever tool was used to hold the card in place when it was taking it's chemical bath |
#28
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Interesting debate. When I go to sell my house I'm hoping to brush over a couple of 100 flaws/issues. I won't actively deceive anyone, or make any affirmative claims that are false, but I'm going to do everything I can to make the house present well and detract attention away from its shortcomings. Might slap some paint on the side of the house that turns to hell after a few months for some odd reason. May scrub the garage door that always attracts some green mold crud. Does that make me a bad guy?
Did anyone ever answer how we know this is the same card? Last edited by Snapolit1; 02-04-2017 at 07:26 AM. |
#29
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Quote:
.
__________________
Leon Luckey Last edited by Leon; 02-07-2017 at 09:54 AM. |
#30
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The same discoloration marks on the front are still visible on both....even the cleaned up card. Also, same centering and same print/toning dots on back of card. |
#31
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#32
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Vintage car restoration is acceptable (and disclosed) but collectors pay way way more for untouched, original paint, low mileage jewels that are "condition rarities". The value goes way down if a car(d) is sold as original and then you find out it was reconditioned. That, my friends, is fraud. I would have loved to own that DiMaggio if I could afford it but now it is a lie in a holder.
Scott |
#33
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its pretty obvious its the same card...just look at the before and after for christ sake?
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#34
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__________________
"Trolling Ebay right now" © Always looking for signed 1952 topps as well as variations and errors |
#35
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Last edited by DeanH3; 02-04-2017 at 03:49 PM. |
#36
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May your collecting bring you immense joy, Larry Last edited by ls7plus; 02-09-2017 at 02:13 PM. Reason: original post made before reading entire thread. |
#37
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isn't this enough?
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#38
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I would have Brent's team spell check their listings better. On this high value piece, the following words are all spelled wrong:
"imensly" "it's" used incorrectly "diversifcation" "beyong" It's not a blog post, guys.
__________________
-- PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head PSA: Regularly Get Cheated BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern SGC: Closed auto authentication business JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC Oh, what a difference a year makes. |
#39
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for fans of distilled water
Some detailed pics that were provided to me comparing the 50 to the 7 (7 scans are from the Goldin auction).
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
#40
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That ID has been called out many times before. No reason to believe John has anything to do with it.
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
#41
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So, did we ever decide who was behind the scam here? Who won it in REA....who cracked it.....who washed it....who submitted to psa......who THAT ONE PERSON sold the card to.
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#42
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...
__________________
Last edited by Bliggity; 02-16-2017 at 12:37 PM. |
#43
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I think it was colonel mustard did it with the candle stick in the 3rd floor bathroom .
__________________
Just a collector that likes to talk and read about the Hobby. 🤓👍🏼 |
#44
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I would not call it a scam, its a legit graded psa 7 card.
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#45
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So, you don't think that buying an SGC 50 in REA, cracking it, cleaning it and then submitting raw to PSA is a scam? You also don't think that selling (as being the same person) a card privately for 75K without revealing such information (disclosure) is a problem? Now, as someone with more than a 3rd grade education, I find that hard to believe.
Last edited by Whodunit; 02-16-2017 at 09:45 AM. |
#46
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this hobby is full of crooks...littered with them...way more crooks than honest joes in this hobby. some have paid a price but the majority continue to flourish here there and everywhere. |
#47
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Quote:
Last edited by PhillipAbbott79; 02-16-2017 at 10:17 AM. |
#48
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It's fraud to sell an item without disclosing a known material fact. It's the same as lying. You're a lawyer, you know that. Are you seriously saying it's not material that the card came out of an SGC 50 and was worked on before being graded a 7 by PSA?
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 02-16-2017 at 10:02 AM. |
#49
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To further that argument Peter, regarding not disclosing material facts, make sure that he knows that we know who won it in REA, who cracked it, who graded it raw by PSA and who sold it to the "first" buyer (as a private sale). There have been 4 owners in a PSA holder: 1) the "person" who bought it from REA and worked on it, 2) the person he sold it to, 3) John Perez via Goldin Auctions and now 4) the winner of Brent's auction. I wouldn't put it past Brent to have won the card himself just to get that cert # off of the mkt. Quite frankly, I've got some pretty juicy texts, emails, spreadsheets,etc. from the "man himself" regarding this card. It will surely be fun to see some of his guys (I was one of them for a long time) come to his defense. If you noticed early on in this thread, he defended this card 3 days into the auction, monitors this board tirelessly (told me to stay away from it {the board}..........."I've got it handled"), yet slipped away like a thief in the night when facts start divulging about who actually had factual and material information about the card from the point of its coming out of REA. He left John hanging high and dry when the rubber hit the road.
Last edited by Whodunit; 02-16-2017 at 10:07 AM. |
#50
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You should also follow the forum rules and put your real name somewhere. Last edited by bnorth; 02-16-2017 at 10:11 AM. |
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