Gone with the stain. Dick Towle

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by wonkaticket

If the problem can't be solved with a bowl of warm tap water then I'm out, that's just my stance. Also if your stance isn't mine all good.

My sense is that a lot of the people who dislike the chemical bath also abhor the water bath. But, if you can draw the line between water and undetectable chemicals, then you're a better man than I.

When I was a kid, I learned you could take wax stains out of a 1987 Topps card by pouring lighter fluid on it, and then sitting it on the radiator for a short while. Pretty amazing and no residue or anything was left behind. It was magic. My guess is that Dick uses something like that, maybe something alcohol based, which evaporates a lot faster than water and leaves no trace. Maybe he uses hydrogen peroxide. Then you're talking about the difference of one extra oxygen atom -- H202 vs. H2O. Who knows?! Dammit, Jim! I'm a card collector not a scientist!!

In any event, if the "chemical" leaves the same trace as water (i.e., no trace at all), then I'm still in. No harm comes to the fibers of the card, and the effects are simply not detectable within the lifetime of my immediate heirs. I accept this work has been done on every card I own, and I sleep well at night.

But, if you get a gag reflex from a good warm water bath for your T206 card, then you probably just don't understand how many of these little guys have spent some time in water over the past 103 years.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

My sense is that a lot of the people who dislike the chemical bath also abhor the water bath.

That's not what the posts in this thread would indicate.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Runscott

That's not what the posts in this thread would indicate.

I agree Scott. Big difference to most/many collectors, I would say.

[ullmandds]

So then this question remains...if the solvents that Dick uses can be proven to cause no permanent changes to the cardboard stock...the colors/images...would people still have a problem with this?

[T206Collector]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

So then this question remains...if the solvents that Dick uses can be proven to cause no permanent changes to the cardboard stock...the colors/images...would people still have a problem with this?

+1 - that's the relevant question, not whether it is water or something else. If you are comfortable with the illicit uses of water on baseball cards for these reasons, then why are you uncomfortable with the illicit uses of CHEMICAL X for the same reasons?

[baseballart]

I knew I should have paid more attention in Grade 12 Chemistry class

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by baseballart

I knew I should have paid more attention in Grade 12 Chemistry class

Haha. Yeah, you and at least one other forum member.

[smokelessjoe]

Question:

Say I spill red Kool aid on one of my wonderful T206s and stain the whole card red - three weeks later I make a new batch of red Kool Aid and discover that by removing the red dye (yet keep all chemical properties the same) and dumping it on the same card that I can remove the red stain... Essentially I have swapped one chemical for another or washed it with the same chemical.

Please note that at this time No One knows what Kool Aid will or will not do to the card as far as preservation or lack there of...

Would this be acceptable?

(I know Kool Aid jokes are coming)

[Section103]

So the only difference between water and hydrogen peroxide is "one little oxygen atom"? Yeah, lets see the line of people willing to drink a glass of hydrogen peroxide.

[T206Collector]

***That's not what the posts in this thread would indicate.***

***I agree Scott. Big difference to most/many collectors, I would say.***

Stated another way, how can you distinguish from water when you have no evidence that what Dick uses has any lasting effect distinguishable from water?

People may say they have no problem with water, but then they do have a problem when a "mysterious chemical solvent" that has the same lasting effect as water (i.e., none at all) is used.

Again, if Dick was using H202 (hydrogen peroxide) instead of H20 (water), then you are arguing over a single oxygen atom. Seriously? Wouldn't you want to know what your chemical is before drawing a line that shows a "big difference" of opinion?

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by T206Collector

***That's not what the posts in this thread would indicate.***

***I agree Scott. Big difference to most/many collectors, I would say.***

Stated another way, how can you distinguish from water when you have no evidence that what Dick uses has any lasting effect distinguishable from water?

People may say they have no problem with water, but then they do have a problem when a "mysterious chemical solvent" that has the same lasting effect as water (i.e., none at all) is used.

Again, if Dick was using H202 (hydrogen peroxide) instead of H20 (water), then you are arguing over a single oxygen atom. Seriously? Wouldn't you want to know what your chemical is before drawing a line that shows a "big difference" of opinion?

Yeah, you are right - bring on the hydrogen peroxide.