Restored T206 Wagner?

[Jobu]

I came across the following 1962 publication with a Wagner on the front:

Sport Hobbyist 1962.jpg

I thought perhaps it might be a "new" Wagner given the age of the publication, so I checked the T206 Resource's gallery (http://t206resource.com/Galleries.html) and it looks like card 12:

Wagner 12.jpg

The corner wear is the same, the spot on the right border is the same, and the centering is the same. However, the apparent chunk missing out of the left is gone, the wear pattern on the left below that looks like it may have been repaired, and the apparent paper loss on the frame on the top border is no longer there. There may be a small difference on the bottom right edge as well:

Wagner comp.jpg

I am curious to hear what people think.

[ullmandds]

yup...nice work! perhaps why it's in a GAI holder? Although I'm sure PSA would grade it!

[BeanTown]

Originally Posted by ullmandds

yup...nice work! perhaps why it's in a GAI holder? Although I'm sure PSA would grade it!

Haha +1

[hcv123]

I wish I knew how to add a gif of shaking my head!! Will it ever end.........

[pherbener]

Good work Bryan. Based on the GAI holder I would assume the alteration happened a while ago.

[Mark17]

Publisher Charles Brooks, Associate Editor Frank Nagy. Frank had a Wagner so I'll bet this was his.

[Copa7]

Wouldn't be the first altered Wagner PSA would grade as perfect.

Great research. Thanks for this posting.

[Collectorsince62]

The back of the holder states "Frank Nagy Collection"

[oldjudge]

I’m not sure it is the same card. The dot in the right border appears bigger in the card on the right and the dot within the frame line on the left opposite the border damage is missing.

[Mark17]

Originally Posted by oldjudge

I’m not sure it is the same card. The dot in the right border appears bigger in the card on the right and the dot within the frame line on the left opposite the border damage is missing.

It is pictured on Frank Nagy's publication in 1962 and again in 1971. It is slabbed with the notation it is from Frank's collection. Did Frank have 2 of them that looked remarkably similar?

[samosa4u]

Originally Posted by Jobu

However, the apparent chunk missing out of the left is gone

Because the original images are in black and white, it only looks like a chunk was missing at one time, however, it might only have been some thick stain. If you look at it, you'll see two dots next to it. One dot is on the white border and the other one is in the orange area. Those dots are now gone as well. A lot of times you can just remove these thick stains using a sharp object, such as a sewing needle. You have to slide the needle across the card surface, very slowly, and without pressing down too hard, and the chunks just break off.

[Jobu]

That is a good point, and I presented this as a question because I am not sure but wanted to see what people thought.

In the better image that Mark posted, the margins of that spot look pretty sharp, like maybe they actually are something on the card that was later removed.

And these images are all so bad that it is going to be hard to tell.

The spot on the top of the frame still looks like it was filled in though.

Originally Posted by samosa4u

Because the original images are in black and white, it only looks like a chunk was missing at one time, however, it might only have been some thick stain. If you look at it, you'll see two dots next to it. One dot is on the white border and the other one is in the orange area. Those dots are now gone as well. A lot of times you can just remove these thick stains using a sharp object, such as a sewing needle. You have to slide the needle across the card surface, very slowly, and without pressing down too hard, and the chunks just break off.

[slightlyrounded]

Left hand border has clearly been trimmed the whole way down...white border thinner in the GAI holder to even the naked eye. Can we all agree on this?

[steve B]

Probably not trimmed. Size is almost meaningless for T206s. They vary is size so much you can't go by that.

That edge doesn't look any different than the others. And the wear, which looks natural starts well down from the top left.

[Mark17]

This is an interesting discussion.

[hcv123]

The spot at the top changed. The spot on the left changed.

I see where one could speculate that the left border appears trimmed (hell if it was good enough for the Gretzky McNall Wagner......)

My question is if the Slabbed card has the Nagy provenance - what was the chain of ownership from Nagy to the slab?

[Bigdaddy]

Originally Posted by steve B

Probably not trimmed. Size is almost meaningless for T206s. They vary is size so much you can't go by that.

That edge doesn't look any different than the others. And the wear, which looks natural starts well down from the top left.

Agreed, you can't go strictly by the size. But if you have before and after photos, then you could measure the relative sizes of the borders.

Enlarge both photos so the player image is the same size, then compare the borders.

[2dueces]

Looks like the same card but I’m not sure I would be turned off by the restoration if noted. I think it’s a beauty.

[BeanTown]

Originally Posted by 2dueces

Looks like the same card but I’m not sure I would be turned off by the restoration if noted. I think it’s a beauty.

"If" it's the same card, I would not consider trimming a part of restoration.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by BeanTown

"If" it's the same card, I would not consider trimming a part of restoration.

Agree. Trimming might have been innocent back in the day but today it's a red flag (and rightfully so).