FS: 1950 Bowman Jackie Robinson PSA 2.5

[Machetero]

Graded PSA 2.5. Very nice example with excellent centering.

Thanks for looking.

[darkhorse9]

PM sent

[darkhorse9]

So...this is interesting.

I was the winning bidder on eBay for this exact card. Got a good deal and paid immediately.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1950-Bowman-...ip=true&rt=nc]

Apparently the seller was not happy with the winning bid so he cancelled the auction saying it was lost or no longer available

Then the next day it shows up here with a higher asking price. (he obviously didn't plan on someone visiting both sites) I contacted him...he said there was some bid cancelling he had to do - none of which affected my winning bid. But he would be happy to sell it for me for more than my winning bid.

Nothing like some good shill auctioning.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Originally Posted by darkhorse9

So...this is interesting.

I was the winning bidder on eBay for this exact card. Got a good deal and paid immediately.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tid=0&view=all

Apparently the seller was not happy with the winning bid so he cancelled the auction saying it was lost or no longer available

Then the next day it shows up here with a higher asking price. (he obviously didn't plan on someone visiting both sites) I contacted him...he said there was some bid cancelling he had to do - none of which affected my winning bid. But he would be happy to sell it for me for more than my winning bid.

Nothing like some good shill auctioning.

link only shows that a listing was removed.

That is shameful how much did you 'win' the card for. Were you able to leave ebay feedback. Not sure why go through all this mess for a seller when the asking price is only a few hundred bucks on here. Is making that extra 50 or whatever dollars worth it for the reputation

[Peter_Spaeth]

WTF? The seller has some explaining to do.

[wilkiebaby11]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

WTF? The seller has some explaining to do.

I contacted the seller a few days ago about this, as I noticed the past two VCP sales were of this same card.

Here was his response. I don't know him, but it seems like his reason is legit and honest.

... In October I listed the card and the auction ended at $283 - buyer never paid after 2 weeks of emails asking for payment. I blocked the buyer and re-listed the card a couple weeks later. The same buyer created a new profile (using a similar username so I knew it was him) and continued to bid on the card again. I blocked him again and canceled his bid. He created a third new profile using a similar username and continued to bid on the card. In any event, I had to cancel his numerous bids which manipulated the outcome of the auction. Never had that happen to me before so I really didn't know how to handle it. Now I don't think I want to sell on Ebay anymore, so I will try here.

The first auction, here, ended on 10/2 to a bidder with just 24 feedback, for $283.

Then came this auction, here, where a new bidder(s), with 0 feedback kept bidding and those bids were retracted on different days.


His story does add up. I won't comment on how the second auction should have been handled because I dont know how (much) the bids manipulated the auction. Either way, it seems as though the second auction was tainted by a bidder with a vendetta.

[darkhorse9]

The auction link is corrected above.

None of the cancelled bids exceeded the highest bid. The two highest bids were legit.
His response to me in a PM here was "there was no way I'm selling that card for $228"

For all I know, the cancelled bids were from him.

[wilkiebaby11]

Originally Posted by darkhorse9

The auction link is corrected above.
For all I know, the cancelled bids were from him.

Very true.

I'd be fine with his story up, proabbly more so had he cancelled the auction early do to the alleged bidding. All of that would be okay up until the point where he contacted you to make a deal offline. At that point, his story starts to go from a possible honest one to having a strong chance of fishy auction tactics.

We likely will never know the whole honest truth, you just have to follow your gut on this one.

[sterlingfox]

That's not how eBay works - shame on the seller!

The card was won at $228, and that's what it should have sold for. That's the risk of selling anything on eBay with a low starting price and no reserve!

If the seller was looking for a set amount, then he/she should have done a buy-it-now auction.

Kudos for leaving appropriate negative feedback.

Originally Posted by darkhorse9

The auction link is corrected above.

None of the cancelled bids exceeded the highest bid. The two highest bids were legit.
His response to me in a PM here was "there was no way I'm selling that card for $228"

For all I know, the cancelled bids were from him.

[mattjc1983]

Wow, I was half tempted to buy this guy's card. Glad I didn't give him the business.


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[1952boyntoncollector]

i remember buying a 1953 topps mantle from ebay seller dcsd1212 psa 5 for about 1500 last year and paid immediately after the auction and got this:

I sent the card out shortly after receiving payment so it definitely should
have arrived. I m out of town through the holiday but when I return I can
send the tracking number for the package to see what happened. I purchased
insurance for the package and if it seems I will issue a full refund if the
package has been lost. Please keep me posted in the next few days if it
happens to arrive. If not I will refund your money. I apologize for the
inconvenience but I will make sure everything gets taken care of.

-dcsd1212


Dear dcsd1212,

you could check paypal and get a tracking number.....you haven't supplied a
tracking number for more than a week......even if out of town if you can
log on to ebay I think it would be easy to find tracking on paypal....so
let me know the tracking shortly after I paid so I can look it up and call
the post office..thanks


Then he said this

I checked into the tracking number and it was never even scanned. I am not
sure if the package was stolen or what happened but I refunded your payment
and because I can tell the package clearly never arrived at your location.
I am sorry for the trouble and I appreciate your communication.

-dcsd1212


How come when you pay a new market high on an ebay auction the package NEVER gets lost?

[Machetero]

Here is what happened:

A bidder won the Jackie Robinson after a 7-day auction for $283 - he never paid and there was absolutely no communication from him regarding payment. After 2 weeks I opened a non-payer case.

I re-listed the item for a 5-day auction and blocked the non-paying bidder, thinking that would take care of the situation. Around day 4 I checked on the auction and noticed that the same non-paying bidder had created a new username and had bid on the item. He used a similar username so I knew it was the same guy. I immediately canceled the bid and blocked the second username. Sure enough, he continued to create new usernames and continued to bid on the item - I canceled all of his bids and finally blocked all bidders with 0 feedback, which finally took care of the problem. Unfortunately, all of this occurred near the time the auction was ending. I was under the impression that if you end an auction early, after bids have been placed, then you are obligated to sell to the highest bidder at the time the auction is ended, that is why I let the auction run its course.

There is no doubt that the auction was artificially manipulated by this buyer who obviously had a vendetta against me for some reason (even though I gave him more than enough time to pay for the item), and by forcing me to cancel numerous bids near the end of the auction the outcome of the auction did not represent fair market value.

In addition, it is simply untrue that I contacted the winning bidder (darkhorse I believe) on this forum to try to re-negotiate the sale of the item. To the contrary, when darkhorse saw the item listed here he contacted me and offered to pay more money for the card. I thought we were going to make a deal that would make both parties happy when he decided to take a different avenue.

In any event, here is the substance of our conversation in bold for those that are interested:

darkhorse9
Mark
Member
*
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Kalamazoo, Michigan
Posts: 389

Re: 1950 bowman

I see...but you can see my frustration too. I bid and paid in good faith.

Tell you what...how about we split the difference and do $255 for it. That seems fair.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Machetero
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkhorse9
My best offer is the 228.00 that I won this card for on eBay two days ago until the auction was cancelled after I won it.

Yeah here's the deal: That card sold for $283 dollars a couple weeks before and the buyer never paid (I gave him 2 weeks to pay and never heard from him - no communication whatsoever). So I re-listed the card and blocked the buyer. He created a new username (similar to the first username so I knew it was the same guy) and started bidding on the new listing, so I blocked him again and canceled his bids. He created a third new username and continued to bid on the card, so I had to block him again and cancel his bids again. This continued up until the auction ended. Canceling the bids dropped the price of the card considerably and artificially manipulated the auction. $228 was not a fair market price for that card and I think you know that. I understand your frustration but I am frustrated too. There is no way I'm selling that card for $228. I have never had to deal with a situation like that before, and to be honest I think Ebay is the one to blame because although I blocked the buyer, Ebay still allowed him to bid on my auction using a slightly varied username.
[/B]__________________ [/B]

[jfkheat]

The problem with your explanation it that the highest cancelled bid was $225. There were two bidders that placed bids higher than that so the blocked bidders did not have any effect on the high bid. In mu opinion, you should honor the high bid or at the very least accept his $255 offer.
James

[wilkiebaby11]

^^^

That's the story I got from him a week ago and it hasn't changed.

I would also go as far to agree with him that eBay put him in a bad situation allowing the same person, with most likely the same paypal, mailing address, and IP address to bid and manipulate his auctions.

Any illicit bid can and does alter an auction, whether it was a new high bid or not. And does so even more when it is near the end of the auction, which these bids were. This guy's story seems to line up.

Just my 2 cents and intuition.

[wilkiebaby11]

Originally Posted by jfkheat

The problem with your explanation it that the highest cancelled bid was $225. There were two bidders that placed bids higher than that so the blocked bidders did not have any effect on the high bid. In mu opinion, you should honor the high bid or at the very least accept his $255 offer.
James

I am a bit confused though... was his offer $228 or $255? Were there two different offers?

[sterlingfox]

All I see here is that the seller violated eBay's terms by not selling the card at the price the bidder won it at, and then requested the winning bidder to buy at a higher price.

None of the removed bids affected the final bids of the auction.

What a no reserve eBay auction ends at doesn't matter in the least. It can sell for next to nothing, but you're still obligated to sell at that price.

Just my 2c

Originally Posted by Machetero

...and by forcing me to cancel numerous bids near the end of the auction the outcome of the auction did not represent fair market value.

...Tell you what...how about we split the difference and do $255 for it. That seems fair.

...$228 was not a fair market price for that card.

...There is no way I'm selling that card for $228.

[1952boyntoncollector]

Whatever happened, all i see if we are talking about 50 bucks. spending all this time on this subject and all the negative attention on it, i am not sure why not just sell it to that guy. Time is money and reputation as well.

Either side can be right but why allow potential buyers on new items make that call on your reputation which can cause a lot more than $50 is losses not to mention additional time to explain etc.

[wilkiebaby11]

Someone bought it over on Blow Out.

[irv]

Originally Posted by wilkiebaby11

Someone bought it over on Blow Out.

For how much?

[mattjc1983]

Obviously we rarely get the full story in these instances but the primary issue I saw, if true, was not so much that the seller refused to sell the card to the highest bidder on eBay, but that he apparently didn't give that buyer any reasoning beyond "the card is no longer available." The buyer didn't get any of the "bid stalking" story until he questioned why the card was immediately put up for sale somewhere else.

Chances are the seller didn't do anything terribly wrong here except not communicate well enough to avoid appearing very shady. Over communication is a plus in my book.


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