How is it that ( Mastro~) ???

[Archive]

Posted By: Brian C Daniels 

The current bid numbers in Mastro are 3x the same stuff if posted on E-bay or in any other auction house? How do they get these kinds of prices?. THE GNP of the results of this auction now running exceeds the accumulative wealth of all the collectors on this board (metaphorically)! What is the deal here?

Example~An e-95 Wagner in a PSA 5 holder sold for $1900 on e-bay about a week ago. One not quite as nice is up now in the Mastro auction for $2669.00 ?


http://catalog.mastronet.com/index.cfm?action=DisplayContent&ContentName=Lot%20Information&LotIndex=37237&CurrentRow=1

How do these people do this?

[Archive]

Posted By: botn

I have decided to make changes to my website. There will now be two columns for prices. The first column will have my retail asking price and the next column will feature what the card would sell for after juice and shipping if it were sold in a Mastro auction.

And you cats complain about my pricing? I am giving stuff away comparatively.

[Archive]

Posted By: quan

DON'T your prices represent Mastro's plus the juice plus shipping?

[Archive]

Posted By: BcD

Why do you write greg about his inventory every week?

[Archive]

Posted By: botn

is Quan's real passion. Winding up with the card is just the fruits of his victory. He does not care what the item is worth he just wants to get it for half of what someone is asking. He is like my Jewish Grandmother.

From now on Quan will be referred to as Grandma Sadye, in honor of my Grandmother.

[Archive]

Posted By: quan

since I'm a 26 year old Vietnamese refugee. I had to battle many hardships to come to America so I know the value of a dollar

[Archive]

Posted By: botn

My Grandparents lived through the Great Depression and grew up having nothing. My Grandfather was born in Russia and immigrated to the US when he was an infant. Despite their reaching an economic status that put them in the top 1% of Americans before they were in the 60's, they never forgot where they came from. Sadly, they too never learned to live in the modern world. They ended up depriving themselves comforts and conveniences that they could more than afford but would not part with the money due to their living in the past.

They are now recently deceased and missed out on a great deal.

[Archive]

Posted By: warshawlaw

I mean, I can squeeze a quarter so tight that I put a dent in the eagle's ass, but that's not my ethnicity, its just that I'm a cheap SOB. Some of my WASP clients are tighter than a bullfrog's butt and make me look magnanimous by comparison.

I seem to "win" a lot of Greg's lots at the minimum, so maybe they are overpriced. And that doesn't even include the state of CA's vig... I don't know, I just see some of those great cards and I've gotta have them. Still, the mastro prices are INSANE. They're at nearly $1,000 a card for vg-ex commons in the N269 set, which is right where another lot of them went in the prior auction, but is just crazy money.

Of course, with my luck, I'd get raped if I consigned anything of mine to them.

[Archive]

Posted By: slacks

Greg had a beautiful, well-centered T206 GAI 5 Cobb Bat Off on his website for $1850 the first week in April. I jumped too late and too low, and have been kicking myself ever since.

Another GAI 5 version of the same card sold a week later for $3300 on eBay, and the card was nowhere near as nicely centered as Greg’s. A search of similar auctions shows that, at least with this card, he is not at all above the market. I'm not mad because I could have resold it, just that this and other recent sales have put this quality of card out of my price range for the foreseeable future.

By the way, I hope he understands that when a collector "lowballs" him, it might just mean that that’s the price he/she is willing to pay at this time for the card, and isn't always looking for below-market deal. Some folks (like me) might just be trying to build a little card portfolio for a son or daughter and have to do it on the cheap...

I have gotten some N172’s from him (his website, not auctions) that I think are comparable to ones that have sold for more on eBay.

[Archive]

Posted By: Aaron M.

While I think alot of the price difference you see on Mastro as opposed to E-Bay can be chalked up to "high rollers" who don't bother with E-Bay (and it's also partly due to some people thinking they are somehow getting a better guarantee of authenticity) and others getting caught up with the cache and status of buying from the fancy "fine sports" catalog, one of the reasons Mastro's prices are so much higher, I think, is because they allow their own employees and executives to bid on their own lots.

Rule 6 of their terms: "6. Subject to exceptions relating to credit considerations, all registered bidders in good standing are eligible to bid on any lot in the auction, including employees and executives of MastroNet, Inc."

While I would not go so far as to say that they engage in shill bidding (although I don't know how else you would describe it), certainly Robert Edwards strong stand in their auction notices that they do NOT bid on their own lots certainly casts a suspicious eye on the subject (I mean it's not like the card business--no matter how "high-end"--is a stranger to consumer fraud), especially with Robert Edwards auction prices not exploding out of the gate like Mastro's do. While I would note that Robert Edward has placed more reasonable reserves on their lots than Mastro's unrealistically low, two weeks later you do see the pattern of Mastro's items selling for significantly higher than the items regularly sell for on E-Bay and what there actual worth is.

So basically I think it's either people lose their heads and willingly spend more on Mastro lots than they need to (because of the fancy catalog, etc.) or Mastro (and other auction houses who engage in this practice) are possible shilling up their prices, or both.

[Archive]

Posted By: scott brockelman

knowing all of the principals and employees of mastro, i can assure you they are not shill bidding or running up the bid by this clause. in fact they are all collectors of various items, from the head guy on down. i know for a fact if they are interested in something for themselves they bid on their own off site computers like all other bidders.

i consign and bid in every major and minor auction known to man and am very comfortable bidding in their auctions, even more so than some of my recent winnings in other auctions where i won low dollar items but mysteriously was bumped to my 4 level max at the last instant, ????

SCOTT

[Archive]

Posted By: MW

If shill bidding never happened (happens) in Mastro auctions, then why put the language there in the first place? Kind of reads like some type of legal disclaimer if you asked me.

[Archive]

Posted By: BcD

who pays your rent bro and how did you afford a Calibunga private university education?.The poor third World story ain't flying.Plus,you try to sell stuff for more than you would hope greg would sell you the same item for so you are completely a typical American capitalist.You,like Kevin Costner in Dances with Wolves have completely aculterated yourself down to the last slice of Pineapple and ham pizza and late night breakfast jack runs with your fellow sun roof and lowered with whale spoiler Mazda Rx7 driving LA groovers so that pulls the rug out of the "Coming to America" story~

[Archive]

Posted By: Aaron M.

"knowing all of the principals and employees of mastro, i can assure you they are not shill bidding or running up the bid by this clause. in fact they are all collectors of various items, from the head guy on down. i know for a fact if they are interested in something for themselves they bid on their own off site computers like all other bidders."

I admire Bill Mastro's collection (his profile on A&E was one of the factors that pulled me back into the hobby) so I know he (and I assume his staff) are collectors. However, the fact that they bid on lots in their own auction is an irreconcilable conflict of interest. Other than the fact that you know and trust them, there is nothing factual or in their terms to prevent rampant shill bidding.

The fact that they are told to bid off-site is both an acknowledgment of the conflict of interest and shadiness of the practice and would tend to actually draw more suspicion to the practice since Mastro's corporate officers can't keep track of their employees bids. (It would also serve as an attempted legal defense - "we didn't know--it happened off-site" - were they ever to face federal fraud charges.)

Bottom line, no matter how passionate of collectors they are, this is a practice that should unequivably stop and is more or less indefensible. Until it does, they will always be a target of suspicion--even more so now that Robert Edward has thrown down the gauntlet and made this issue more public. I firmly believe that the vast majority of Mastro participants don't have any idea that this practice goes on because it is so outrageous as to be inconceivable. Once they figure this out, I would imagine Mastro will hear complaints.

"i consign and bid in every major and minor auction known to man and am very comfortable bidding in their auctions, even more so than some of my recent winnings in other auctions where i won low dollar items but mysteriously was bumped to my 4 level max at the last instant, ????"

Well, the fact that you consign to, and benefit from, these auction house that engage in bidding on their own lots that may result in higher realized prices for you is the whole point (it would also tend to explain your happiness at consigning with them). Mastro and other houses are in a increasingly competitive field and their revenue stream and sales pitch for future consignments is based on their ability to get higher and higher prices realized. If I you were a Mastro employee and saw some of your lots underperforming in price level, knowing that your company makes less money, your consigner will be disappointed and you might lose future consignments and market share as a result, you might be awfully tempted to play with the price and shill bid a bit.

Man, it would be something if a couple years from now federal investigators are putting the clamps down on these auction houses for fraud. Not hard to imagine at all.

[Archive]

Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

Slacks, I appreciate your support. I never mind someone trying to get a deal and it never hurts to ask for a discount. I guess it is all in the delivery. I take exception to a anyone who comes on with a have to have it attitude and then proceeds to nickel and dime me. What bugs me even more is when that same person then sells me something and is more than willing to adopt his own 237% mark up over retail.

Best,
Greg

[Archive]

Posted By: QUAN

I pay my own rent now and although the education was PARTIALLY paid for by the government....I have given all of it back and then some with the yearly appointment I've made with uncle Sam since working. I will admit that America has been "berry berry good to me".

As for Greg, he's comfortable with all the prices I've paid for his cards and has made money on all of them...he's not here to do any favors, and I'm fine with that.

[Archive]

Posted By: jay behrens

you can shove a lump of coal up his rump and when it comes out, you will have a diamond. How do you think he affords those cards? It sure isn't from the money he makes handing out bowling shoes :-p

Jay

[Archive]

Posted By: slacks

No need to post about cards -- those good-natured jabs between you two never get old!

[Archive]

Posted By: BcD

He once had a card collection to speak of and then got whacked by the big one! Divorce and carbohydrates shook it all out of him.The knowledge is still there.As is the N36 he sniped me out of I want.

[Archive]

Posted By: jay behrens

Yeah, that N36 Geronimo is gonna be a beast find for you considering that is only one I've ever seen. It may find a new home soon if the deal to sell off my Indian collection goes down. Scary thing is, given recent auction results, it wouldn't be out of the question to see my card get upwards of $2k. When N36s with chunks of card missing selling for $150+ and ones with paper loss going for $300+, a NM Geronimo should easily go for a huge sum.

Jay

[Archive]

Posted By: warshawlaw

Mastro has 5 letters. Satan has 5 letters. You never see mastro and satan together at the same time. Obviously, Mastro is Satan. I took logic classes, you know.

Glad I'm just a poor working lawyer who cannot afford the small car priced mastro lots--keeps me out of trouble. I'm just glad they don't offer markers like casinos do...that or layaway.

[Archive]

Posted By: bmb11

a virtual casino marker...he just wants some condignments in advance

[Archive]

Posted By: Jay Miller

A lawyer, but not a mathematician

[Archive]

Posted By: Cy

I think it is fairly obvious why Mastro's prices exceed ebay. There is a group of people with enough money to spend on these auctions. And, even though they do not want to spend more than they have to, they do spend more at Mastro to alleviate the hassle of searching for the cards that they want. So they just pay a little more and that saves them the effort of scouring ebay.

I have always said that most T205 and T206 lots can be bought on ebay one card at a time for the same prices that the entire lots get at Mastro.

That's my two cents worth.

Cy