Bud Selig thinking of reinstating Aaron as HR king

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Posted By: JohnnyH

How can one deny that Pete Rose is not the hit king ? What he did on the field had nothing to with his ban from the hall of fame for his gambling. I truly believe after he is dead he will be elected into the hall of fame. If not, his record will remain and if removed, then Ty Cobb should be banned, and Cap Anson should be removed along with many others. If Ty Cobb did the things he did today that he did back then he would be in jail and kicked out of baseball forever. And all this talk about what a mess the world is in today, when hasn't it been ? Nothing is new, nothing is different, just advancement in technology.

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Posted By: John K

JohnnyH, you are completely correct on Rose. DC, thanks for the list of the Sluggers. Nice looking list; just remove the steroid guys. Foxx and Greenberg underrated. Nice to see the best two position players of all time on top of this list.

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Posted By: Don

Some of you are missing my point. In order to have an objective standard to deal with the PED issue, ban anyone who is a proven PED user. Declare that anyone banned will not have their stats as part of MLB official records and ineligible for the HOF. Pete Rose, Shoeless Joe etc. would be caught in the banned net and have their stats removed as well. Unfortunate? Maybe, but there has to be an objective way to deal with the PED issue and clean up MLB records. This was just my suggestion on how to do that.

The easy way to fix Rose/Jackson etc. would be to reinstate them. And who knows, maybe in the hindsight of history, people like McGwire/Sosa/Bonds would be reinstated as well and have their records count (I hope not though).

Personally, I don't see how anyone who was banned should have their stats count anyway. That should be part of the price you pay for doing something so egregious that you get banned from MLB.

If all these PED users thought they might get banned, and subsequently have their stats not recognized by MLB, it would take away a major incentive for using PED's.

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Posted By: marshall barkman

I agree that Pete Rose should be in the Hall of Fame. His actions took place after his playing career was over. What goes on behind closed doors of many athletes is no different than any other person. A majority of this world puts on the old i'm heading to work face which is smile,be polite,say the right things,kiss ass, act socially and politically correct. Once the person returns home then it is a whole new ballgame. I once spoke to Rose in Florida and told him that there are more fans who appreciated what he brought to the game when he played than the finger pointers keeping him out of the Hall. He touched the lives of millions of kids with the head first aggressive diving style and hustle so i say Go Pete Go.

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Posted By: Cy

Maybe the lawyers can chime in on this. What if Selig decries that Aaron is the home run king, that Bonds' home runs were tainted and were not the "real thing"? Would that allow all of the Giants season ticket holders, and, I guess any ticket buyer, to sue major league baseball for the price of their tickets because they received an inferior product? If MLB didn't give the paying fans the true baseball that was stated, I would think that as a paying customer, I could demand my money back for every one of those years!

Cy

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Posted By: Vintage Clout

I believe the major issue with Rose is that he "denied" gambling instead of being 100% humble and apologetic. This country has a forgiving nature but Rose's complete denial in the face of 100% guilt destroyed him! Case in point....how come nobody badmouths Any Pettite....because he agreed to using performance drugs to assist in various healing issues (whether it was for injury we may never know for sure!), but the fact remains that he said YES to using HGH. Clemens was a complete liar, making a sham of the whole process, embarassing himself in public and THAT is what the baseball community will remember. This is one reason that I believe Joe Jackson should be included in the Hall.....he eventually admitted to taking money and was ashamed for his guilt. Our nation is built on most criminals (except for "murder 1" of course)eventually being released from prison and provided a chance for a clean slate which is why we must ask this question.....what gives baseball (merely men playing a kid's game)the right to be more important than life itself...give me a break!

VC

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Posted By: marshall barkman

Who cares about Andy Pettite? His situation was totally different than that of Pete Rose. So what if Rose lied about his gambling. I do believe there was a former President that lied about a certain use of a cigar. He was not impeached and his records remain intact.

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Posted By: Jim VB

"He was not impeached "





He, most certainly, was impeached.

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Posted By: Anonymous

You are missing the point. You will ALWAYS have a better chance when you "come clean" instead of hiding the garbage that incriminates you. Petitte, Rose, etc....who cares about the name...the public isn't stupid and is tired of being deceived regarding any issue. I can remember Tom Seaver in a rouge interview standing up at a podium asking the American public to forgive Pete Rose for his wrong doings. Unfortunately, in the face of denial there could NEVER be forgiveness.

Marshall, I myself believe Rose should be in the Hall of Fame for his accomplishments. If Rose and Jackson are out, then Cobb and Speaker should have also been banned for their gambling exploits (I believe Landis was afraid to nail those two legends to the wall due to the 1919 scandal, figuring it would be the final nail in the coffin and destroy the game forever). Bottom line is I am just trying to make light of how millions of others may feel.

Regards,
VC

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Posted By: Fred C

Don,

The only problem with not allowing proven PED users stats to count in the MLB records books is that it only addresses those that were caught. Those that weren't caught will get away with it.





Who would make a good baseball commissioner today? What about Bernie Madoff?

One more thing, everybody wants to blame Selig for this whole thing. What about the players unions? What about the owners? I think it would be hard to convince people that the unions and owners had no knowledge of what was going on. Sure, Selig was the commissioner but how many times have you heard in the news that a player or owner called Selig and expressed their concern about the "possible" use of PEDs by MLB players?

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Posted By: Don

True, you might not catch them all but that's no reason not to punish the ones you do catch.

One option is to test them all, every year. This would be another confidence builder in cleaning up the game.

I'm not sure who might make a good comissioner, I'd have to think about it. But, I think it should be someone not connected with MLB.

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Posted By: Bob Manning

Colin Powell
George Will
Condoleeza Rice
Jim Rice
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The Jersey Devil
Dick Cheney
Mr. Hyde
Rod Blagojevich

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Posted By: Al

Re: Slick Willy, aka Bill Clnton...

A simple Google of "Bill Clinton impeachment" will find you with enough reading material to last well into next week. That you could post "he was not impeached" is beyond laughable.

Perhaps you'd like to recant your statement.

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Posted By: marshall barkman

LMAO.....i know he was impeached but only in the trial sense. He was not officially impeached and removed from office like other former presidents.

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Posted By: Glenn

Oh, where to start?

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Posted By: Don

"LMAO.....i know he was impeached but only in the trial sense. He was not officially impeached and removed from office like other former presidents."


You definately brought the noise with that statement.

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Posted By: marshall barkman

When i stated he was not impeached from office what i should have said is that he was not removed from office because of the impeachment.

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Posted By: Jim VB

"He was not officially impeached and removed from office like other former presidents."

I may have mentioned this before, as have several other posters, but you couldn't be more WRONG, on several issues.

1. Clinton WAS impeached. Period. December 19, 1998. Officially, unofficially, any other way you can think of it. Impeachment is brought by the House of Representatives. It is the act of being charged with wrongdoing. (Comparable to an indictment in a criminal case.) Nothing more. When a President is impeached, the actual trial is held by the Senate. There was an impeachment. There was a trial. (It was on TV. You may have missed it.) He was acquitted by the Senate.


2. He was the second President to be impeached. The first was Andrew Johnson. He was impeached by political rivals of his own party who thought he was being too soft on the South, during the Reconstruction, following the Civil War. He was also acquitted. (This one wasn't on TV.)


3. No other President of the US has ever been impeached and/or "removed from office." I know. You're thinking of Nixon. He wasn't impeached. He wasn't removed from office. He resigned before any of that could happen.

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Posted By: marshall barkman

Jim....you do crack me up bro. There is a 8% discount card at Border's books for your superior knowledge on Impeachment. Clinton was Aquitted and not removed from office. However you want to shake it down the man was off the charts and was not removed.

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Posted By: keyway

Pete Rose was a wise guy. He was a wise guy all if his career. He thought he was all of baseball and could do no wrong. He BET ON BASEBALL as the manager of a team. He is a bum and should NEVER be let in the hall of fame. Frank

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Posted By: J Levine

I nominate our collecting friend, Keith O. as the next commish...

Just once, I would love Marshall, to say, "I am sorry, I was wrong." Just once...

Joshua

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Posted By: marshall barkman

Levine....just once i would like it if you stop whining. You remind me of like a 2nd grade English teacher. Ok little Billy come up in front of the class and say you are sorry for talking about what Mr.Clinton did with that cigar.

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Posted By: Jim VB

Aah! 2nd Grade! The three best years of your life!

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Posted By: marshall barkman

Jim Vb.... you remind of this joke i once heard in regards to three flies. These three flies were in the pasture eating cow **** and they ate the whole pile. The three flies were so full that they could not fly, the oldest fly said to the other two i am going to crawl up that pitchfork and flap my wings as fast as i can and then start flying, he crawled up the pitchfork got to the handle and jumped off flapping as fast as he could and he got about ten feet out and nosedived splat to his death. The other fly looked at the youngest and said well he was to old but i bet i can make it so watch me crawl up that pitchfork and fly away, he crawled up the pitchfork and got to the handle and wooosh off he flew, about 25 feet he took a nosedive and splat he died. The youngest fly looked and thought well he almost made it and i am the youngest so i think if i flap real fast i can make it. He crawled up the pitchfork and got to the handle and woosh off he went, about 35 feet later he nosedived and crashed to his death. The moral of the story Jim Vb is that when you are full of **** do not fly off the handle.