Ted Williams

[brunswickreeves]

Originally Posted by Snowman

48/49 Leaf provides the most fair comparison for Dimaggio vs Williams prices that I can think of. It controls for numerous factors that might otherwise affect price differences, like both being from a very popular and widely collected set, both having effectively the same PSA pop report (~1100 ea), neither being rookie cards, and both having very similar poses.

The Dimaggio sells at about a 20% premium over the Williams in grades 3 through 5, and a bit more in the higher grades, although the data is more sparse and less reliable as you move up the grading ladder.

Here are mine side by side. I just received my Williams back from grading today. It was a PSA 3 when I bought it. Interestingly, I paid $3700 for my PSA 3 Ted Williams and only $1500 for my SGC Dimaggio.

Oh, and don't get me started about SGC not being able to place the cards in the same spot of their slabs... Arrrggggh!

Those Williams and DiMaggio Leafs are stunning with very tight centering, I’d expect nothing less from your collection!

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by brunswickreeves

Those Williams and DiMaggio Leafs are stunning with very tight centering, I’d expect nothing less from your collection!

Thanks. I usually put up a fight when I find centered copies of the cards I want, haha. I probably paid $1700 for the number on the slab of that Ted Williams and another $2,000 for the centering

[refz]

1954 #250

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

^^^
I think it's beautiful, but you're going to give Travis nightmares.

[brianp-beme]

Originally Posted by BillyCoxDodgers3B

^^^
I think it's beautiful, but you're going to give Travis nightmares.

I suggest we all realize this 1954 Topps of Ted as having
better centering than an example with borders perfectly aligned, because Ted's portrait is actually closer to being centered.

Brian

[Chuck9788]

No one ever talks about Ted Williams' defensive prowess.

Was he average, above average or below average as a fielder?

[GasHouseGang]

I don't know if it shows Ted's popularity, or Topps trying to make him happy, but he's the first and last card in the 1954 set, and he's the first card in the set in 1957 and 1958. They weren't able to put him in the 1952 or 1953 set and must have been really happy when they had him on contract in 1954.

[Lobo Aullando]

Baseball Reference has his defensive wins above replacement (dWAR) at -13.3 for his career.

https://www.baseball-reference.com/p...illite01.shtml

Originally Posted by Chuck9788

No one ever talks about Ted Williams' defensive prowess.

Was he average, above average or below average as a fielder?

[jsfriedm]

About half of that is 1958-1960.

[daves_resale_shop]

The Ted Wall.

[Jobu]

This isn't how things work, but it is interesting to look at Ted's career #s if you fill in his war years with the averages of the full seasons just before and after each. He missed full seasons in 1943-44-45 for WWII and almost full seasons in 1952-53 for Korea, so I did the same exercise to fill in all five years.

Missing Seasons jpg.png


If you add these totals to his career line it makes a huge difference:

Adjusted Career.png

While it is impossible to say he wouldn't have gotten injured, it is also possible that he would have outperformed the averages, especially in his prime during the WWII years, so there is both downside and upside.

If he actually had finished with these career numbers, I think people would look at him dramatically differently.

And a 1939 photo of Ted by Arthur Griffith.
Ted Williams type 1 photo Arthur Griffin 1939 6.75x8.5 a.jpg

[BearBailey]

Undervalued in todays market if you consider what he used to go for, he just hasn’t seen the increases many other players have in the past 30 years or the past 5. If you were putting together the mid 1950s sets it was mantle, Williams, mays and whatever key rookie cards. Now Aaron, Clemente, banks, Koufax are all pretty similar priced to Williams in those sets. The early cards vs DiMaggio for whatever reason DiMaggio has always been more.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by robw1959

I can't imagine that I'm the first member to post on Ted being undervalued. He is arguably the second best ballplayer of all-time, being second on the career OPS list. If he wasn't called up as a fighter pilot for both WWII and the Korean War, Ted may have finished his career with a Barry Bonds-like homerun total.

Any thoughts about what keeps the value of his cards relatively inexpensive in relation to his greatness?

Ted just doesn't get the respect he really should.
From the BST several years ago..

[boysblue]

IMO Ted Williams is one of the top 3 hitters to have ever played the game! Picked this up not that long ago. Love the graphics.
TW1.jpg

TW2.jpg

TW3.jpg

[the-illini]

Bryan - that is a fantastic photo of Williams

[DeanH3]

Originally Posted by Jobu

This isn't how things work, but it is interesting to look at Ted's career #s if you fill in his war years with the averages of the full seasons just before and after each. He missed full seasons in 1943-44-45 for WWII and almost full seasons in 1952-53 for Korea, so I did the same exercise to fill in all five years.

Attachment 588458


If you add these totals to his career line it makes a huge difference:

Attachment 588459

While it is impossible to say he wouldn't have gotten injured, it is also possible that he would have outperformed the averages, especially in his prime during the WWII years, so there is both downside and upside.

If he actually had finished with these career numbers, I think people would look at him dramatically differently.

And a 1939 photo of Ted by Arthur Griffith.
Attachment 588460

Thanks for filling in those gaps Bryan. Definitely interesting food for thought. I'll add, Ted hit 29 HR's in his last year, 1960. He would have been 23 behind Ruth. I wonder if he would have hung on 1, maybe 2, more years to break Ruth's record. How would he be viewed if that had been the case? And Aaron would have been chasing Ted's HR record instead if Ruth. Again, fun to speculate.

[jethrod3]

[QUOTE=Jobu;2371675]This isn't how things work, but it is interesting to look at Ted's career #s if you fill in his war years with the averages of the full seasons just before and after each.
Attachment 588458

If you add these totals to his career line it makes a huge difference:
[ATTACH]588459

It's not a bad approach to take for filling in the gaps. If you compare the projections for Ted with Aaron's career numbers, one realizes that Ted played about 200 games (or more than one full season's worth of games) less than Aaron. He finished with about the same number of games played as Bonds, but I don't recognize him as the all-time home run leader.

[ALR-bishop]

There are variants to his 55 and 56 cards. The 55 involves missing dots on the i in his auto ( recurring print defect) and the 56 involves a minor cropping difference in the image. Only weird folks like me collect both. The 55 and 56 Hocus Focus are not beautiful but they are tough.