What's the real deal with these Cuban cards?

[Scocs]

There are four of these supposed 1911-1915 Romeo Y Julieta baseball cards on Ebay now, but several voices have already come out against this seller and these cards as being fake on his Ebay listing itself.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CUBAN-CIGAR-...item2a38bf0ac0

Can anyone fill us in on the backstory here?

[Exhibitman]

I can add some info on Romeo y Julieta ["RyJ"]. The company is known for a pair of mid-1920s boxing issues as well as some nonsports movie cards. The front format of the cards on eBay roughly matches with a rare boxing issue:



Here is the principal boxing issue:





The cards are real photo, so there should be signs of silvering and very difficult to duplicate photographic age on them. Backs are found with black or [very rare] brown printing. There are tone variations among the cards with some sepia and some grayer. Also, there is a pretty good variance in size.

I have no idea who the seller is, so no opinion there. Is there another thread on these?

In terms of potential for discoveries, I do a lot of research on Latin American boxing cards and new issues surface seemingly every year. Last year two Cuban tobacco boxing issues popped up. New cards also surface periodically from established sets, most of which cannot be definitively checklisted.

There are two or three guys here I can think of on this board who have even more experience than me or anyone else in the world handling RyJ cards. Ryan Christoff is one of them. The others may not be 'out' so I won't mention names, but certainly any of them could examine these cards and give a pretty solid opinion on whether they are consistent with the genuine RyJ issues.

[ernestohur68]

Hello, I am the seller of the Romeo & Julieta card in Ebay. About the authenticity of them. I know nothing about baseball cards. I never saw Nacionales as somebody named Manni told me. But I contacted the biggest collector in the island to revised the cards inmediatly I bough them. Now I returned to his house and tell him what some people are saying about the cards. He confirmed again that the cards are original. I show in this post know some other cards in his collection, including other two issues of R&J cards that he found about 15 years ago. He told me that Ryan saw those cards in his house about 5 years ago and he was very surprised. He told me that anybody who has doubt about who is him can ask RYAN, can ask to Cesar Lopez, the owner of CUBANBALL. All of them know that he has the biggest collection of Cuban baseball cards, that he is working in the book about Cuban baseball cards. I show pictures of him with some of even more rarest cards of his collection. Rolando is a very serious people, he told me that he was who discovered the fakes in a lot of Cuban baseball cards, he was the source for many years to all the American who came to Cuba to buy this kind of item. I show 1 photo of him with Monte Irving and this is a good history to you: he asked Monte "Which is your rookie card?. Irving respond: "it is the Topps" and Rolando show him the album that Monte is seen in the photo with the Cuban EL INDIO card that was issued before TOPPS card. You can see in the photos others very rare cards CIGARS EL JUNTO, J.L. PIEDRA. DIHIGO CAMPO ALEGRE, LA MALLORQUINA (POP LLOYD), some PUNCH, GENER (ADOLFO LUQUE). NOW YOU HAVE INFORMATION TO OPEN MORE POST ABOUT OTHER RARE CUBAN BASEBALL CARD. NOW EVERYBODY WILL KNOW that the person who know more about Cuban baseball cards is not in UNITED STATES. HIS NAME IS ROLANDO SANCHEZ and he live in CUBAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.

[Brian Van Horn]

Love the album.

[ernestohur68]

One more time. I am not an expert. But Rolando is an expert. I just buy and sell Cuban items. I don't made fakes. I found the cards together with other cards. If you want pictures of the album where the cards were found I can add them to the forum.

[packs]

Just a quick question. You said in your post you went to his house to ask him again about the cards after questions arose. But on eBay it says that your location is Spain. You said the gentleman lives in Cuba. Just wondering about the disparity between the location of the cards, your location, and the man in Cuba.

[ElCabron]

I'll post my opinion about these shortly, but are you sure Rolando is okay with you posting pictures of him on the internet? As you know, he lives in CUBAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA and has always been more discreet than that.

-Ryan

[Jaybird]

Originally Posted by ElCabron

I'll post my opinion about these shortly, but are you sure Rolando is okay with you posting pictures of him on the internet? As you know, he lives in CUBAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA and has always been more discreet than that.

-Ryan

I agree. Paraphrasing is one thing but posting quotes and pictures from a personal message is a bit out of bounds. There's a reason why people are reluctant to share hobby information.

[ernestohur68]

who don't know me and said cards are fakes. that said that I made fakes. People who apologized for his word and after that continue doing the same but wrote me private e mails. I convinced Rolando to talk his opinion as an expert in this forum and even that not work. I really very sorry for all this. I am very happy for the price of the cards but I now this is not all. For me is more important people know I not sell fakes items, Check my feedback, I sold one item in 10 000 and it was not fake. I don't know why Ryan continues attacking. God will be his judge. And if he come to Cuba in the future, I will found him here to ask him WHY.

[richardcards]

finally does anyone know if they are real or not?
I love Cuban cards so would like to know!

[richardcards]

I have 3 amateur r&j baseball cards my opinion
looks real
looks very similar to a nacioncales issue or aguiltas Cuban issue.
one expert I know says real.
thanks

[Lopezcoins911]

I just came back from cuba and while I was there I picked up several baseball cards and 9 of the super rare boxing cards! One will not upload for some reason.
[









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[irv]

Originally Posted by Lopezcoins911

I just came back from cuba and while I was there I picked up several baseball cards and 9 of the super rare boxing cards! One will not upload for some reason.

Your pictures are huge so you need to resize them. Your pic that won't load is likely way too big for Leon's uploader to handle, or you have used up too much bandwidth/space?

Depending on your system, find one that works and install it if you already, unknowingly, don't have one?

I use/trust Filehippo as it's the cleanest site to download from, imo.
https://www.google.ca/search?q=windo...icture+resizer

Good luck.
Nice cards, BTW!

[Lopezcoins911]

IMG_6068.JPGIMG_6069.JPG


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[Lopezcoins911]

I'm using the app from my phone. It has the option for photo or attachment. I'll try the attachment which seems to be smaller


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[Lopezcoins911]

IMG_6070.JPGIMG_6071.JPGIMG_6072.JPGIMG_6073.JPGIMG_6074.JPGIMG_6075.JPGIMG_6076.JPGIMG_6077.JPGIMG_6078.JPGIMG_6079.JPGIMG_6080.JPGIMG_6081.JPGIMG_6082.JPGIMG_6083.JPGIMG_6084.JPGIMG_6085.JPG


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[swarmee]

They're all showing up just fine. Thanks for bumping a cool old thread, too.

[irv]

Originally Posted by Lopezcoins911

I'm using the app from my phone. It has the option for photo or attachment. I'll try the attachment which seems to be smaller


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Originally Posted by swarmee

They're all showing up just fine. Thanks for bumping a cool old thread, too.

X2. Those are much better.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by Lopezcoins911

Attachment 276040Attachment 276041Attachment 276042Attachment 276043Attachment 276044Attachment 276045Attachment 276046Attachment 276047Attachment 276048Attachment 276049Attachment 276050Attachment 276051Attachment 276052Attachment 276053Attachment 276054Attachment 276055


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As a guy that used to get punched in the head a lot, those look awesome! Thank you for sharing them.

[Brian Van Horn]

A couple more with a Pittsburgh connection including Harry "The Pittsburgh Windmill" Greb and Benny Leonard, part owner of the Pittsburgh Pirates NHL club:

[Exhibitman]

Leonard is one with a pose variation



Same card #

[richardcards]

I thought this thread was about the baseball
Cards romeo y julieta in question not boxing?