New Old Judge discovery

[brewing]

Saw this on the twitter feed of olberman. Unknown old judge cards of minor leaguers.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=y...ure%3Dyoutu.be


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[glynparson]

very cool piece. I love it when KO talks cards, hell I just love hearing him opine on anything.

[Jacklitsch]

Not sure why he refers to the cards as Old Judges. Can the experts chime in?

[slidekellyslide]

What Steve said...how are these Old Judge cards?

[h2oya311]

If they were distributed in Old Judge packs, what else would you call them? How 'bout Old Judge Minor League Supplement cards? And the line Gypsy Queen example would be a Gypsy Queen ML Supplement.

[Piratedogcardshows]

Cool discovery no matter how they are designated.But I agree they don't seem like Old Judge cards.

[slidekellyslide]

Originally Posted by h2oya311

If they were distributed in Old Judge packs, what else would you call them? How 'bout Old Judge Minor League Supplement cards? And the line Gypsy Queen example would be a Gypsy Queen ML Supplement.

I think he's just guessing they came out of an OJ pack, but nothing on the card itself suggests that.

[Julz24]

Amazing story. Thanks for posting this!

[the 'stache]

I just hit "play" on last night's show, and couldn't believe how excited I was when I heard him talk about these newly discovered cards.

[joeadcock]

Cool stuff

[NYHighlanderFan]

The baseball card hobby is the only going I enjoy hearing Olbermann talk about.

I can't disagree more with his liberal-socialist-communistic view of how things should be and no other way. God help us all already as it is...

[Leon]

Originally Posted by NYHighlanderFan

The baseball card hobby is the only going I enjoy hearing Olbermann talk about.

I can't disagree more with his liberal-socialist-communistic view of how things should be and no other way. God help us all already as it is...

With KO I put politics aside, I have to .......so let's quickly get back to cards and all will be good.....

[tjb1952tjb]

Originally Posted by NYHighlanderFan

The baseball card hobby is the only going I enjoy hearing Olbermann talk about.

I can't disagree more with his liberal-socialist-communistic view of how things should be and no other way. God help us all already as it is...

+1

[ZenPop]

Originally Posted by NYHighlanderFan

The baseball card hobby is the only going I enjoy hearing Olbermann talk about.

I can't disagree more with his liberal-socialist-communistic view of how things should be and no other way. God help us all already as it is...

One could have stopped at the word "liberal" and left it at that... but to play the "communistic" card is idiotic. I don't throw the word "nazi" out when describing conservatives... It adds needless fuel on a political fire.

Back to the cards...

[sycks22]

Pretty cool find.

[the-illini]

So who got that amazing scrapbook full of cards?

[ullmandds]

what's a window seat?

[the 'stache]

I'm not sure why KO's politics needed to be brought into this topic at all. Invariably, those discussions devolve into some sort of partisan pissing match.

Can we please just enjoy these newly discovered cards, and keep the elephant and donkey out of the room? Thank you.

[sportzjunky]

Originally Posted by the 'stache

I'm not sure why KO's politics needed to be brought into this topic at all. Invariably, those discussions devolve into some sort of partisan pissing match.

Can we please just enjoy these newly discovered cards, and keep the elephant and donkey out of the room? Thank you.

+1............. back on subject. Thank you to KO, Jay & Joe.. GREAT STUFF and more exciting stuff for the hobby and incredible pub for the Old Judge and 19th century cards. Please keep it there.

[Exhibitman]

Joe, Jay, other OJ masters, what is the relative scarcity of GQ cards with the wavy logo at bottom as compared to OJ cards with the wavy logo at bottom? Any idea as to the ratio between the two?

[dstudeba]

Joe - Thanks so much for those scans. Hopefully that clears up a lot of confusion for collectors.

[E93]

As Jay suggested, this should not change the N172 catalog, but would it not suggest the possibility of another yet-to-be-discovered N172 California League card if it is indeed a GQ and all GQs have a corresponding N172? Or do you think there is too little known about California League GQs since this would make 3, even though the only other one does have a corresponding N172?
If it does imply the potential existence at one time of a couple more N172 California League cards, would that change how we think about N172 California League card production? These are just questions from a relative N172/N173/N175 novice. WOuld love to hear more about what the experts here think.
JimB

[z28jd]

A new California League OJ is highly possible because of the known number of just 19 subjects and the fact they number so low each(1-3 examples known). I wouldn't doubt that there WERE more out there, it's just a matter if they survived all this time and now someone has to find them and know what they are looking at when they do.

I still think it is possible that an N172 card showing a player on Buffalo exists because a collection found years ago in an old desk had spots for each team marked and there was a spot for Buffalo. Every other team that was marked is a known team from the set

[Joe_G.]

Originally Posted by E93

As Jay suggested, this should not change the N172 catalog, but would it not suggest the possibility of another yet-to-be-discovered N172 California League card if it is indeed a GQ and all GQs have a corresponding N172? Or do you think there is too little known about California League GQs since this would make 3, even though the only other one does have a corresponding N172?
If it does imply the potential existence at one time of a couple more N172 California League cards, would that change how we think about N172 California League card production? These are just questions from a relative N172/N173/N175 novice. WOuld love to hear more about what the experts here think.
JimB

As John stated, it is entirely possible that more California League N172s will be discovered however the poses will not match the GQ portraits discussed in this thread. It would now appear that the California League GQs date to 1887 or maybe 1888 (more research on Clements and Donovan may pinpoint date of issue) while the California League OJs date to 1889. It is possible that some players, such as McDonald, can be found in both GQ (portrait) and OJ (action pose), while others cannot based on when and where they played. Thus far, all three GQs are from the same team, Greenhood & Moran team of Oakland. If the GQs are in fact an 1887 issue, there could conceivable be cards from the San Francisco Pioneers, San Francisco Haverleys, and Sacramento Altas as well. If the GQs date to 1888 then Sacramento is replaced by Stockton. By the time 1889 rolled around and the OJ brand began issuing California League cards, Oakland, San Francisco, and Sacramento would be represented with Stockton being the only team without a card. Plenty of opportunities for more OJ and GQ players to surface but their shear rarity means many of them are probably lost to time forever.

[Joe_G.]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Joe, Jay, other OJ masters, what is the relative scarcity of GQ cards with the wavy logo at bottom as compared to OJ cards with the wavy logo at bottom? Any idea as to the ratio between the two?

Adam, difficult for me to answer as this is specific to issues outside of baseball which is where most of my research is focused. The answer may vary based on whether you just look at just boxing vs other subject matters or perhaps may even be impacted by imported vs exported cards etc. I also don't know if the wavy advertisement at bottom is only limited to a single year. Perhaps Jay has some thoughts here.